<------- Not a fan by any means of the AK47/74
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Gasp!!! A Firearms Thread ??? GUNS ???
- Thread starter A4sForever
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metro said:
Yeah, but if you get a FN FAL or a H&K G3 you can get them all sorts of dirty and be accurate too. Im not a big fan of AK's in any version, they were designed to be handed to a conscripted army/peasents with little or no firearms experiance. The Soviets basically said, well we aint gonna be accurate so lets give them a big ol' mag and full auto and maybe they will get lucky. Im half suprised they came with sights and they might as well not the way you see them used by people in the Sub-sahara. Sorry, no thanks Ill take my .308 nail driver.
M-14/M-1A if you want a .308, that is the way to go.
Fly Navy said:If you have an AR, you need an AK. They belong together
That's funny .... that was my rationale for buying both @ 20 years ago ..... When have two opposing weapons ever been so intertwined in military history for so long .... and it continues !!!
VetteMuscle427 said:
I think I would agree with M-14/M-A .308 marriage, but part of me says it's just USGI sentimentality --- that it's an "old" design, but still -- it's reliable, accurate, and quite versatile.
The FAL --- well one thing it is NOT good with is fine dirt and sand --- and the G3/HK91, while a fine rifle (actually, all of 'em are) has as its main claim to fame cheap and simple manufacture as a result of its many stamped parts. In fact, had the Belgians not thrown a hissy fit when the West Germans wanted to buy a license for the FAL in the mid-50's, the G3 probably would not have been produced nor even exist. The Germans wanted the FAL as it's main battle rifle, but the Belgiques did not take kindly to facilitating the rearming of the Uber Alles who recently had the jackboot of occupation on their throats. So the West Germans instead turned to their ol' buddy Generalissimo Franco and bought a manufacturing license for the Spanish CETME rifle -- the G3 and it's many offspring evolved from there.
You know what the others look like, but here's the Spaniard (does it look like a G3 or what?):
I've owned top of the line examples of all three (M1A/HK/L1A1) and the only one I still have is the M1A .... that doesn't mean the M1A is for everyone --- but it is for me -- even thought the design was outdated when the rifle went into initial production as the M14. It's a hard-hitting, accurate, penetrator and I shot it in competition in the NAV.
We need to start a thread on "what's the best main battle rifle"? (listen to all the 'what's the best fighter' protesting thread-squeals then !!
) .... this thread is getting too "miscellaneous" -- too far afield ..... and then one on "assault rifles" ...... and then shotguns ..... and then ........ contact your local Web-san. 
Grant said:
Not much ... unless price is the issue.
Grant said:
Good for if you want an assult rifle but your on a shoestring budget. Ive seen Yugo SK's with a bit of money thrown into glass and a few parts that are real nail drivers, but they run into a wall quickly of "I can upgrade it but why spend that much on a 2-300 dollar Rifle."
Im a big FAL & G3 fan (side note, good versions, not Century Arms builds *Shudder*). G3's are pretty brutal on the shoulder compaired to a M1 but that can be fixed. Guy at my range just bought one that has a completely differnt set of internals, its unsuitable for select fire but single shot it kicks like an M-4.
Now FAL's .... funny thing about that fine dust and sand A4, thats not what the Brits thought back during our first trip to the sandbox. They had so many problems with those lousy LA85's that they started bringing in crates of L1A1 FAL's by the truckload from out of storage. And both rifles are everywhere in Africa, almost more common then AK's in alot of places. You'll typically see them on some 90 lbs 14 year old with a piece of lamp cord for a sling. Ive seen some scary torture tests on how much the FAL will put up with and keep functioning, 20K rounds between cleaning of any kind, and by cleaning he dropped it in a puddle and shook it off. Thats kinda that fine tuning of the gas system, if it starts to slow up just open it a little more.
One thing I wish though, when the FAL was originally in development the Brits wanted it in .280 Enfield and the US Army forced the issue of .308 because we were thinking of buying it around the same time as the M14. Had the .280 been the standard round that rifle would have been so popular that arguebly 5.56mm Nato would not exist. We're starting to learn that lesson today with the 6.8mm Remington (brilliant round). Funny how the army wanted to keep .308 so you could swap ammo between riflemen and machinegunners when they knew Machinegunners dont hit much at range and rapid fire.
"Our first trip to the sand" .... Were you with the Brits in 1991 in Desert Storm?? The got rid of the Enfield SA-80 , true -- because it is a P-O-S ... but they replaced it with the L1A1 because that was all they had remaining in the arsenal(s). What else would they have used ???
I had a chance to fire the LA85 in a "test lab" and they would not let me fire it full-auto because the instructors were afraid it would catch fire --- so much for that idea. The Brits have some real problems with small arms .... always have in the modern era.
"Seen everywhere in Africa"?? That's not much of a test of a rifle --- "Africans" use what is available and those (?) that still use a pattern FAL rifle do it because it is available --- which "African" armies would those be , anyway ?? Most have been replaced in the past 30 years by mass "freedom fighter " imports of AK-style rifles. You might see your ... "90 pound 14 year old" with one on the evening news, but that's not much of an advertisement for the rifle. If it was as good as you wish it were --- why isn't it still widely used in mainforce armies today?? Maybe because there's better options .... ????
I've used the FAL and let me tell you, it's sensitive to fine dust and sand. I didn't drop it in a puddle, however . But the M-16 also has to be kept super-clean to function properly ... so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that one. No problem here .....
I had a chance to fire the LA85 in a "test lab" and they would not let me fire it full-auto because the instructors were afraid it would catch fire --- so much for that idea. The Brits have some real problems with small arms .... always have in the modern era.
"Seen everywhere in Africa"?? That's not much of a test of a rifle --- "Africans" use what is available and those (?) that still use a pattern FAL rifle do it because it is available --- which "African" armies would those be , anyway ?? Most have been replaced in the past 30 years by mass "freedom fighter " imports of AK-style rifles. You might see your ... "90 pound 14 year old" with one on the evening news, but that's not much of an advertisement for the rifle. If it was as good as you wish it were --- why isn't it still widely used in mainforce armies today?? Maybe because there's better options .... ????
I've used the FAL and let me tell you, it's sensitive to fine dust and sand. I didn't drop it in a puddle, however
. But the M-16 also has to be kept super-clean to function properly ... so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that one. No problem here .....
P.S. does anyone doubt: WE NEED A FIREARMS "category" somewhere on AirWarriors --- contact your local Web-san .....
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