Female Navy Student Shot in Pensacola

[Ken_gone_flying]

You can also argue that if Brown hadn't been born poor and black in a Missouri shit hole his statistical chances of being alive would be considerably higher. He was a teenager, he broke the law, and he was killed for it.

That's not justice, and that's not the America I want.

Holy fucking shit dude. Actions have consequences. His circumstances growing up were probably unfortunate, but not your fault or mine, or Officer Wilson’s. You apparently have way more sympathy for criminals than I do.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

You can also argue that if Brown hadn't been born poor and black in a Missouri shit hole his statistical chances of being alive would be considerably higher. He was a teenager, he broke the law, and he was killed for it.

That's not justice, and that's not the America I want.

Brown was killed for trying to take the officers gun. It’s sad that he’s dead but he deserved it. Then the BLM movement thoroughly beclowned itself with a campaign of outright lies. Hands up don’t shoot.

 

[wlawr005]

Brown was killed after he was shot in the hand and walked away from the car. Wilson followed him. Yes, the BLM movement certainly disqualified their own arguments through ignorance and hyperbole but the underlying premise still remains true; an incredible amount if bias and disproportionality exists in today's justice system.

 

[wlawr005]

Holy fucking shit dude. Actions have consequences. His circumstances growing up were probably unfortunate, but not your fault or mine, or Officer Wilson’s. You apparently have way more sympathy for criminals than I do.

I don't believe I do. I'm simply saying killing people for stupid shit is wrong.

 

[Ken_gone_flying]

Brown was killed after he was shot in the hand and walked away from the car. Wilson followed him.

False. This was what the coroners report found:

“The gunshot wound to the top of Brown's head was consistent with Brown either falling forward or being in a lunging position; the shot was instantly fatal.“

 

[CWO_change]

Don't be coy. You could just as easily taken your premise that "we don't know all the facts" to support an interpretation favorable to Ahmaud... but you didn't do that. If your stance is that we don't know all the facts, then why not just STFU about it instead of hinting that the murderers in this case might have been justified if we only knew more. I'm someone who tends to downplay unwarranted accusations of racism, but your hot take on this case doesn't paint you in the most favorable light. It might be nice, in the absence of all the facts, to give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who got murdered, and not to the murderers.

What is your deal? No, we don't know all of the facts, which is why I don't reach an ultimate conclusion based on the absence of facts; I specifically couch my opinions and take on the fact that there are some things that are unknown. But I have zero problem speaking on the facts that are available as well as raising questions. The benefit of the doubt--regardless of what you state and as I've reiterated--has been given to Ahmaud by me based on what the record shows so far. As I've mentioned--and you can continue to ignore it if you want but it doesn't change a thing--I believe that the record as we know it supports a charge of felony murder. Note, all of the facts do not speak favorably to Ahmaud, just like they all don't speak favorably to the McMichaels. Acknowledging that is not--as you claim--going out of one's way to defend the McMichaels.

What I do push back on is the narrative that Ahmaud was simply out jogging (the record doesn't support that). Or the narrative that race had anything to do with this murder. If you or others want to play that point, feel free to supply evidence of such. Believe it or not, such a narrative without evidence does more harm than good for race relations in our society.

I really have zero care of how some view me; that's neither here nor there to me.

 

[wlawr005]

False. This was what the coroners report found:

“The gunshot wound to the top of Brown's head was consistent with Brown either falling forward or being in a lunging position; the shot was instantly fatal.“

Yeah buddy. The hand was the first of six shots that hit Brown. Obviously the head was the last. He walked away from the car after being shot in the hand, at which point the officer got out and followed him.

 

[Ken_gone_flying]

Yeah buddy. The hand was the first of six shots that hit Brown. Obviously the head was the last. He walked away from the car after being shot in the hand, at which point the officer got out and followed him.

Brown walking away from Officer Wilson is not consistent with him being shot in the top of the head. Just as the coroner stated.

 

[CWO_change]

My ex was from Georgia and graduated high school in the early 2000s where she told me they had a segregated prom because....Georgia.

I'll say that again. Segregated. Prom. 2000s. Georgia.

And yeah, I used to go into houses under construction as a kid all the time. Never got shot. #HollywoodHills #NotBlack

Reserve judgement all you want @CWO_change, but it's impressively recreant to imply that there might be a good reason for getting shot and killed in this situation. Shame on the rest of us for respecting a living being's right to live and having regard for the legal process. There were many non-violent options to resolve this situation. This isn't court, I'll not waste my time trying to prove it to you because you clearly lack the ability to think critically -- though you've certainly convinced yourself that you're oh-so-smart.

Those two will get their day in court, unlike Ahmaud (if he even did anything). And that's the fucking problem.

1) So, let me get this straight. You are willing to paint all white people in Georgia (or elsewhere, I don't know?) as racists and tag the McMichaels as racists who racially profiled because of some people deciding to hold a segregated prom?? For context, there are 5 million (give or take a few hundred thousand) white people in Georgia.

2) The house was not under construction in that sense. It was being renovated. Do you as a grown person wander into random houses when out and about today? I know kids do foolish things, but are you seriously making light of someone walking into a house that isn't his? Of course, as I've mentioned, perhaps the fact that Ahmaud was in a house that wasn't his has zero relevance to this case. That's an outstanding question.

3) You can try to racialize this all you want, and note that you haven't been shot for certain actions because you're #NotBlack. But, as I've mentioned before, such a narrative is silly and not supported by the actual data on the ground. Again, year after year blacks kill substantially more whites in this country than the reverse is true, despite there being substantially more whites in this country than blacks. While that, alone, is likewise not proof of any racism, it would be more compelling on the other side of things using your logic.

 

[CWO_change]

Brown walking away from Officer Wilson is not consistent with him being shot in the top of the head. Just as the coroner stated.

Bingo. Its clear that some people are historical revisionists.

 

[wlawr005]

Brown walking away from Officer Wilson is not consistent with him being shot in the top of the head. Just as the coroner stated.

I agree. Brown did a sneaky tactic called "turning around" at some point after the officer started following him.

 

[Ken_gone_flying]

I agree. Brown did a sneaky tactic called "turning around" at some point after the officer started following him.

Just curious how you know step for step what Brown did. The coroners office had to look at the physical evidence to determine what actually unfolded. That physical evidence led to Officer Wilson being cleared in this case. It makes me wonder where you got your information.

 

[CWO_change]

Just curious how you know step for step what Brown did. The coroners office had to look at the physical evidence to determine what actually unfolded. That physical evidence led to Officer Wilson being cleared in this case. It makes me wonder where you got your information.

That's part of the problem. People are letting their views on race lead them to, ironically, prejudge others on account of race, the actual facts and evidence be damned.

 

[wink]

I agree 100%. This is why I hate the police practice (in officer involved shooters) of not even attempting to question officers until an association rep arrives. Sometimes this means days go by before an officer is questioned, at which time someone who is up to no good can use the time and information released over that time to hone their story to fit a certain narrative. Such practices are unacceptable.

Cops have constitutional rights too. They have no duty to talk to the criminal investigators. The implication is that they are given a break by their department. Fact is, they just choose not to talk like any smart person would. After consulting a lawyer they may talk to criminal investigators. The union rep being present and hours or days late interview is not the criminal case. It is the professional standards interview. They can be ordered to cooperate, or be fired. But what they say is never allowed to be used in the criminal case since it was compelled.

 

[CWO_change]

Cops have constitutional rights too. They have no duty to talk to the criminal investigators. The implication is that they are given a break by their department. Fact is, they just choose not to talk like any smart person would. After consulting a lawyer they may talk to criminal investigators. The union rep being present and hours or days late interview is not the criminal case. It is the professional standards interview. They can be ordered to cooperate, or be fired. But what they say is never allowed to be used in the criminal case since it was compelled.

This is true. But its dangerous to even have such a policy as a starting point, I argue. If a police officer wants to assert her constitutional right to remain silent and seek legal counsel, so be it. But--and I'm sure not every department has this policy--those departments that have a policy of not even trying to question a fellow officer (who may possibly be willing to talk) until she has met with her union rep is troubling.