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COVID-19

Gatordev

Well-Known Member
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor
Forgetting the special relationship that exists between a CO and Branch Medical, the thing to understand about HIPPA is that it doesn't apply to someone outside of the health profession. It does apply to someone acting in the pursuit of a health care duty, which doesn't just mean a doctor or nurse, but could be a billing person, transport person, etc.

The command can ask you health questions because the command isn't a health professional. However the HM2 can't then go tell someone in the command what you may have disclosed.

I know that doesn't solve the overall question of, "how do you know if the unmasked person has been vaccinated," for which I can only say, "I don't really care at this point."
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
Still doesn't explain the HIPAA reference.
I'm a healthcare provider as an EMS person, and I can ask. I am prohibited from sharing the answer with anyone else not in the health care chain of that patient. That's HIPAA.

You could ask your friend, that's not a HIPAA violation. You could tell your other friend what the first friend said, and that's not a HIPAA violation because you are not a provider or otherwise covered under the law. You're just a jerk.

At work I can and do ask since we have restrictions on, for example, traveling without a vaccine, waiverable for folks with special needs (religious, medical, etc.). Or if I am going to be in car for 5 hours with 3 other people from work. I can only share the answer with those in the need to know chain.

I can have an expectation of an honest answer. If they refuse to answer I can treat them differently, for example I can assume they are not vaccinated and ask them to comply with masking. If they lie, there can be repercussions.

EUA has nothing to do with any of it.
 

robav8r

Future performance not guaranteed . . .
None
Contributor
I can have an expectation of an honest answer. If they refuse to answer I can treat them differently, for example I can assume they are not vaccinated and ask them to comply with masking. If they lie, there can be repercussions.
Sweet Jesus . . . .
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
Sweet Jesus . . . .
Here's the exact scenario we talked about yesterday. Someone from here lies and says they are vaccinated when on a visit to a Gov facility, no mask, virus gets transmitted, contact tracing follows, comes back to that person as the virus vector. It gets exposed that they lied about being vaccinated.

You think nothing should happen?
 
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SlickAg

Registered User
pilot
Here's the exact scenario we talked about yesterday. Someone from here lies and says they are vaccinated when on a visit to a Gov facility, no mask, virus gets transmitted, contact tracing follows, comes back to that person as the virus vector.

You think nothing should happen?
What if a vaccinated person ends up being the possible vector? Will they be punished as well?

If your answer is no, the insinuation would that you agree with attempting to punish intent, not the actual outcome (e.g. anyone unvaccinated who “spread” covid did so intentionally). If it’s decreed that someone who has been vaccinated could have no possible intent to spread covid, then you’d be making the vaccine a de facto requirement to avoid persecution by the employer. If that’s a legal hill they want to die on, that’s their choice. So that’s private sector.

Is the government going to prosecute people for attempted murder in the same scenario above? Negligent homicide? Highly doubtful due to the high burden of proof on both intent and culpability.

Do you go around asking employees at work about whether or not they’ve gotten their flu shot each year? Is it a requirement to work where you do? It’s no different than covid. You should be required to wear a mask if you don’t get the shot because the flu can be really deadly for some demographics. The face mask would also let other people know that you don’t believe in science and aren’t a team player. And if you lie and say you have gotten the flu shot and you don’t and someone gets sick and it gets contract traced back to you...there will be hell to pay. You could be culpable too in your supervisory position. Better have a lawyer on retainer, just in case the above situation in regards to the flu snowballs.
 
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taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
What if a vaccinated person ends up being the possible vector? Will they be punished as well?
No, because they were honest. This is about the lying. It's an integrity thing.

That sign on the door when you enter says masks required if not vaccinated. The assumption is people have integrity and will comply, and no one is actually asking.

If, after the fact, it comes out that they implicitly lied by not wearing a mask, you still think there should be no repercussion?

Do you go around asking employees at work about whether or not they’ve gotten their flu shot each year? Is it a requirement to work where you do?
No, and nor are there any signs at entrances to the government facilities I entered requiring a mask without a flu shot.

If there was a requirement, though, and they lied about...
 
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Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
No, because they were honest. This is about the lying. It's an integrity thing.

That sign on the door when you enter says masks required if not vaccinated. The assumption is people have integrity and will comply, and no one is actually asking.

If, after the fact, it comes out that they implicitly lied by not wearing a mask, you still think there should be no repercussion?


No, and nor are there any signs at entrances to the government facilities I entered requiring a mask without a flu shot.

If there was a requirement, though, and they lied about...
Integrity would be taking the sign down. Masks always were pointless. People choosing not to be vaccinated own their decision. Let it go, because it’s over.
 

SlickAg

Registered User
pilot
No, because they were honest. This is about the lying. It's an integrity thing.

That sign on the door when you enter says masks required if not vaccinated. The assumption is people have integrity and will comply, and no one is actually asking.

If, after the fact, it comes out that they implicitly lied by not wearing a mask, you still think there should be no repercussion?

No, and nor are there any signs at entrances to the government facilities I entered requiring a mask without a flu shot.

If there was a requirement, though, and they lied about...
Just like it’s your ethical duty to disregard everything Donald Trump said? Integrity and all...

“Dating back to last spring, then-president Trump openly touted the effectiveness of the drug and even took it himself. It earned him pushback from medical experts, including his own White House coronavirus team member Dr. Anthony Fauci, and political pundits who dismissed his claims and maintained the drug was ineffective.

Last summer, Twitter restricted the account of Trump’s son, Donald Trump Jr., after he posted a video of doctors touting the effectiveness of the drug. The social media platform accused him of "spreading misleading and potentially harmful misinformation" related to the coronavirus.”

 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
Yet I hear from my CO that HIPAA is what prevents them from even asking whether a member has gotten the C19 shot.
Your CO is wrong. The Navy can ask all the want. In fact, the Navy can demand health care information of service members and military medical has to provide it. Civilian health care can tell the Navy to f' off but if the military has a valid need to know, a servicemember's military health records are an open book.

It is a DOD or Navy policy not to ask about the vaccinations, not HIPAA. IMHO, that policy is because of the political climate under the current civilian leadership.

When I was the PRP (nuclear weapons Personal Reliability Program) Officer on Theodore Roosevelt, I had full access to the medical, dental and service records of everyone in the program. I could walk into the medical and dental records rooms and grab what I needed off the shelf. No questions asked.
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
Just like it’s your ethical duty to disregard everything Donald Trump said?
I certainly don’t trust anything he says. Verify first.

So Trump was taking HCQ to keep from getting Covid? This from the paper cited by the article you linked to.

According to our data, HCQ is not associated with prolongation.

Hey, guess what works better than HCQ and AZM? The vaccine. And you don't even have to wait until you're on a ventilator and about to die to use it.

Not sure why he spouted off so much about HCQ but got the vaccine in secret. Was that ethical, @SlickAg? WTF? Why not publicly? Be a leader, set an example. It would have saved lives.
 

SlickAg

Registered User
pilot
I certainly don’t trust anything he says. Verify first.

So Trump was taking HCQ to keep from getting Covid? This from the paper cited by the article you linked to.

According to our data, HCQ is not associated with prolongation.

Hey, guess what works better than HCQ and AZM? The vaccine. And you don't even have to wait until you're on a ventilator and about to die to use it.

Not sure why he spouted off so much about HCQ but got the vaccine in secret. Was that ethical, @SlickAg? WTF? Why not publicly? Be a leader, set an example. It would have saved lives.
If he’d gotten the vaccine you would’ve decried that too. TDS. He’s wrong no matter what, right?

I could not care less if people get the vaccine. Same with any other medication or vaccine they choose to take, or anything else in their medical history for that matter. It’s available to take if people want to. Continuing to obsess over people’s vaccination status is silly. Especially when having had covid is just as effective.

Let’s not forget the high incident rates of myocarditis in young men who’ve been vaccinated as well. Why take a vaccine when you’re at basically zero risk? Funny how the CDC is calling an emergency meeting one week from now to discuss...

 

SlickAg

Registered User
pilot
In 333 pages has anyone changed their views on this topic at all?

This thing belongs afire in the dumpster next to the warzone politics thread...
If this thread doesn’t interest you anymore you can always 1) ignore it and/or 2) not respond...

I must say I am always amused and befuddled by other people who come on this forum and seem to enjoy trying to dictate what other forum members may or may not discuss.
 
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