You seem to have a different definition of buzz than most people. A single drink imparts some psychoactive effect, albeit mild. That’s what we’re talking about with both substances.
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USN Cannabidiol (CBD) and the Navy
- Thread starter Hair Warrior
- Start date
There's a lot of different and mixed ideas in here. Here's what I see as what folks need to figure out:
- CBD policy: is CBD something that could affect people at work? If not, does it matter? If the only issue is that CBD trips the drug test then the drug test needs to be updated to screen better. Laziness isn't an answer for Big Pee. Because of the proliferation of CBD the Navy is going to have to get smarter to not unduly fire people who unknowingly use CBD.
- What happens if/when feds legalize marijuana? USN will need data to determine what the policy should be for pot use and how it relates to duty. 12hrs toke to yoke and free of effects? Is it any different than booze?
- Effects of marijuana/thc/cbd in comparison to alcohol. Many of us probably lack "hands on experience" with marijuana but have lots of experience with booze. Also any possible experience with marijuana may have been years ago and the goals of a teenage using any substance are very different than older folks. Kids drink busch lite to get hammered, older folks drink to enjoy the drink and less focus on getting black out drunk. Can you do the same with marijuana? How does CBD play into that?
- CBD: does the science say we need to treat it like smoking weed? If I use CBD shampoo is that the same as smoking pot?
Topic drift, but I worked as a volunteer EMT at a beer festival. Tons of breweries selling their craft. All of the attendees were sophisticated tasters, going around discussing the nature and sourcing of various hops, the finer points of how to make a gose, types of ales, etc.
And yet by the end the sophisticated clientele were all staggering around shit faced drunk like a bunch of frat boys at a kegger. ?
I mean, I'm a raving fan of wine and frequent many a tasting, but I've never used the spit bucket.... ?♂️
exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
I feel number 3 needs to be studied before anything else happens, we know that alcohol will be out of the blood stream in X hours after consuming X amount of drinks with some differences depending on the individual.
THC metabolizes as a much different level and how long does that impairment last? in one of the test done a person showed up who used regularly and even though hadn't smoked since the day before was still over the limit.
The other thing is the strength of the THC has gone up significantly over the past 50 years while the strength of beer has essentially remained the same, what if the feds did legalize it and capped the THC level at what it was back in 1970 as they found that was a level that a person could smoke a "joint" and be able to legally drive after 5 hours?
exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
unfortunately they have been finding that even though companies that produce CBD products are supposed to be free of CBD that some have THC when they are saying they do not. If the manufacturing process was cleaned up so that no CBD products checked had THC the views might be a bit different.
CBD =/= weed. It is physically impossible for CBD to get you high.
I’ve done a lot of work with veterans groups and I’ve seen guys dealing with PTSD and other ailments use CBD to great effect. There’s arguments about placebo affect but from what I’ve seen, CBD has a place and use. Even the VA has found creative ways to employ CBD.
That said, I doubt the Navy will ever allow it while THC is still technically a schedule 1 drug. Even if THC/weed/CBD was completely legalized, I doubt NAMI would allow flyers to use it, just like we aren’t supposed to self medicate with most anything.
I’ve done a lot of work with veterans groups and I’ve seen guys dealing with PTSD and other ailments use CBD to great effect. There’s arguments about placebo affect but from what I’ve seen, CBD has a place and use. Even the VA has found creative ways to employ CBD.
That said, I doubt the Navy will ever allow it while THC is still technically a schedule 1 drug. Even if THC/weed/CBD was completely legalized, I doubt NAMI would allow flyers to use it, just like we aren’t supposed to self medicate with most anything.
Data like this? We definitely need more, but there's a lot of data already out there.
THE EFFECT OF CANNABIS COMPARED WITH ALCOHOL ON DRIVING
The prevalence of both alcohol and cannabis use and the high morbidity associated with motor vehicle crashes has lead to a plethora of research on the link between the two. Drunk drivers are involved in 25% of motor vehicle fatalities, and many accidents ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Speaking anecdotally, I don't know anyone who has used THC products and NOT become impaired. I know plenty of people who have one or two drinks and are still just fine to function like a normal human being. Not mention the fact that you can contract a secondhand high from being around people blazing the chronic but you can't become secondhand drunk. I just don't see how THC usage could be tenable with military service.
Also, the reason the Navy uses such a terrible test (It produces a lot of false results) is largely driven by money. If you consider that by instruction, the entire service has its pee tested at least once a year (this isn't actually true) this a large expenditure and the Navy cuts costs wherever it can. I don't think there would be an appetite for a more accurate test.
I also wouldn't be surprised to also see the opposite, too - companies putting "CBD infused" on the label, but the shampoo has almost no CBD in it and is just a normal shampoo trying to cash in on the market.
Like those cereals that say "good source of protein" and its like 3g protein along with 20g carbs.
Strength of beer has remained the same? What? The strength of beer varies based on type and brewing process. IPAs and DIPAs are FAR more prevalent then 50yrs ago when most beers were macrobrews that were variations on "sex in a canoe."
Perhaps then the solution would be to require weed to illustrate the strength of what you're buying on the package like proof or %alcohol as is done for booze. That way consumers can make informed decisions.
Also not sure what the difference is between a guy who smokes so much that he's still not free of effects a few days later and a guy who drinks so much he's not free of effects until a few days later. That can and does happen with booze. Hence why there's the "12hrs and free of effects" clause. Just because I downed 15 shots 12+02 before I need to show up to work doesn't mean I'll be free of effects. We have ways to measure that with booze (breathalyzer) and will need ways to do that with marijuana.
Yeah, I'm sure the data is out there. I don't care enough to dig it up. USN decision makers will have to use data like this and others to decide their policy.Data like this? We definitely need more, but there's a lot of data already out there.
THE EFFECT OF CANNABIS COMPARED WITH ALCOHOL ON DRIVING
The prevalence of both alcohol and cannabis use and the high morbidity associated with motor vehicle crashes has lead to a plethora of research on the link between the two. Drunk drivers are involved in 25% of motor vehicle fatalities, and many accidents ...
Speaking anecdotally, I don't know anyone who has used THC products and NOT become impaired. I know plenty of people who have one or two drinks and are still just fine to function like a normal human being. Not mention the fact that you can contract a secondhand high from being around people blazing the chronic but you can't become secondhand drunk. I just don't see how THC usage could be tenable with military service.
Also, the reason the Navy uses such a terrible test (It produces a lot of false results) is largely driven by money. If you consider that by instruction, the entire service has its pee tested at least once a year (this isn't actually true) this a large expenditure and the Navy cuts costs wherever it can. I don't think there would be an appetite for a more accurate test.
In a purely technical sense you're impaired the instant you take one sip of booze. The fact that some can operate normally with booze in their system isn't a good litmus test. Some true alcoholics can seemingly function perfectly despite heroic quantities of booze in their system.
I think these two are related.
I don't care what Airman, Seaman, or LCpl Timmy does in his off time wrt alcohol or pot or whatever have you. But I don't want him high while he's at work (just like most every other job out there).
We can test for alcohol, but I'm not sure that there is an objective test that correlates to inebriation like BAC does.
exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
well a lot of beer that is cheap has about 5% ABV, many of the IPA's I have seen on the boards of bars I would go into seemed to be in teens for ABV, now I am not a beer drinker so don't go seeking out beer so this is just from what I happened to see when out with coworkers of family.
back in the 70's THC content was about 3-4%, now it is standard to see 20% THC content and can be up to 30% THC content, that is a huge jump.