Concur.Fly Navy said:
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What is your favorite personal defense load?
- Thread starter stevew
- Start date
NozeMan said:
Has to do with the length of the bullet and casing in the given space to work with. If the casing was shorter you would see a more rounded bullet. But given the bullets hight to width ratio cant curve it down without loosing weight and also removing the amount of gripable size they need in order for the machines to load it properly.
(At least thats how it was explained to me when I asked the question about 6 years ago)
Also, Xmid, your gonna want to never ever shoot anyone with a handload. Theres nothing that will effect you as far as the right or wrong of a shoot in criminal court but it can get you crucified in civil court. If there is a manufactured version of the rounds/shells your using get them and use them. Better safe then broke and paying his babys mama after the fact.
Flat nose bullets have always been with us. Think .30-.30 lever gun for example. Full and semi wadcutters in revolvers and bullseye competition as well.NozeMan said:
But the short answer?: .... it's cheaper to produce (not talkin' .30-.30 here -- that's another question re: primers).
ACTUALLY .... and I think we're on the same "target" here ... the "newer" range-grade ammunition (Winchester white box and American Eagle red box, for example) have gone to "flat nose enclosed base" (FNEB) bullets lately for semi-automatics ... say in the last 2-4 years ... to cut production costs and comply with lead concerns @ indoor ranges. Some folks think FNEB bullets are a must-have for shooters that frequent indoor ranges and some new loadings advertise that they virtually eliminate lead exposure at the firing line. A Winchester rep told me all of this -- he also said FN bullets are cheaper to produce in this -- the FNEB configuration as well -- ergo their wider recent use in "range-grade" semi-auto ammunition.
Some auto-loaders will experience trouble in feeding with some of the range-grade FN ammo. I had a Walther PPK/S that experienced this phenomenon. It had no problems with FMJ or HP "ogive" shaped bullets (bullet shapes which usually facilitate feeding) , but the FN ammunition required the Walther to make a trip to the gunsmith for feed ramp polishing. Works fine, now ....
Remington advertises that their "specially designed Flat Nose Enclosed Base (FNEB)" bullet actually prevents the vaporization of lead from the bullet’s base upon firing. That's the type of bullet I believe you are referring to and that's the direction mass production, cheaper grade range ammo is going these days.
Indoor ranges. Production costs. Lead. Environmental concerns. Cough. Cough. Lawyers. Lawsuits. = FNEB bullets. :icon_rast
Lawman said:
You bring up an excellent point and I will definitely look in to getting some of the commercially produced ones. The main reason I have the handloads now is because they are cheap. And while I fully understand that this can be an issue in civil court, I don't understand the logic behind it and this may be yet another example of trying to legislate from the bench. I mean if my security has been breached in such a way that I am warranted the use of deadly force under the law, then why should it matter what I am using? Say someone attacks me and I pull a baseball bat on him, why should it matter whether I bought that bat at Sports Authority or my grandpa made it for me when I was a little boy? Its the same logic.
Its almost like the lawsuit I heard about a while back where a dirt bags family tried to sue a cop because he used a .45 caliber pistol. The officers in his department were given the option of 9mm, .40 cal, or .45 caliber service pistols. The officer that was involved in what ultimately was a "good shoot" used a .45 and the family claimed he was using more pistol than was needed. They said that the .45 was a round meant to kill, instead of just stopping the assailant.
I appreciate the reminder Lawman, I just think its a load of Bull that thats the way it is.
xmid said:
Think about the "jury of your peers". They are most likely very uneducated in matters relating firearms, especially reloading. The prosecution will say things like you specifically reloaded bullets to be more powerful with the purpose of killing. While that may be true (why wouldn't it?), the jury won't have a clue and will just see you as a bad guy, maybe someone who WANTED to kill someone. See what I mean? Prosecutors in many states are NOT your friends when it comes to self-defense.
Again, your fellow Americans will most likely be morons when it comes to guns. They don't KNOW anything.
Oh ... sorry ... I thought you meant THIS defense load. My mistake. @ year old post -- sorry, Fly-guy .. I'm bored tonight.Still a good story.stevew said:
My favorite ammo would have to be found in and around a 40mm Bofors quad mount, mount #42 (if memory serves:sleep_125), onboard USS Casa Grande (LSD-13) in the Med, summer 1968. We were a 1/C cruise, all-midshipman gun crew --- some NROTC, some Academy --- if you don't count the two Gunner's Mates -- one of them the gun captain -- the "phone-talker" in the pix --- the other pety officer supervised the loaders in the gun tub. .
I was the gun trainer --- position of the sailor holding onto the rail in the foreground --- but I sat in the seat (the nearest one -- empty in this photo) and we did it the "old fashioned" way -- in local control (manual) instead of director control -- i.e., no "power steering". By the way, for those of you not lucky enough to have had an opportunity like this, the "trainer" (right control posit) rotates the mount in azimuth and the "pointer" (left control) handles the elevation angle of the barrels and had the firing "key" on his foot pedal.
We were so good, that we were really, really bad (?). We "shot down" the towed sleeve --- shot it right off the tow cable. Really freaked out the tractor driver
. Now, who could know that actually shooting DOWN the sleeve was NOT the object of the exercise ??? Needless to say, the T.G. Commander and the Casa Grande's C.O. were NOT HAPPY with the results of their Middie anti-aircraft gunners' participation in the exercise.
But they sure couldn't complain about our score ..... :icon_rast
Three weeks later, we went to no sh!t general quarters and manned up the 40's while Russian Komars were running through the formation @ night to hassle us. Half sailors, half Middies on our gun mount -- the ship was short of GM's so that's where they stuck us. No shooting ... just a lot of searchlights, starshells, hurling profanities, and muscle flexing on both sides. We pointed barrels --- they left. Some sweating, however.
Czechoslovak invasion and all that ... we were the only grunt presence -- the amphib gator force -- in the Med.So yeah ... I guess you could say the 40(mm) is my all around favorite personal defensive round.
Makes me laugh ... as some guys on another thread are talking about how many "civies" to take on 1/C cruise ... :icon_rast
Shot some in a S&W Model 27 and a S&W 28 (sold them -- wish I still had them). Not bad in the Model 27 ... a little more stout and "bitey" in the Model 28. I got rid of most of my .357 revolvers because of the punch, noise, and flash of the cartridge .... and kept just one revolver in .357.Fly Navy said:
The Colt Python with a 2 1/2 in barrel in Colt Royal Blue. Beautiful, mint condition; no turn marks on the cylinder. Probably the worst one of the bunch to run .357 through ... but I keep her for collectability and $$$ appreciation. Not shooting.
.357 SIG semi-autos are the only ones I shoot today.
A4sForever said:
Now that sounds purty.
I like my .357 Magnum, it's a stainless 4" Ruger GP-100. Very very pretty looking. I like the punch of .357 every now and then, but I also like shooting .38. It's easy on the hands, and since it's a heavy stainless revolver, good to get new shooters on. Plus, I didn't have a revolver in my collection... I needed one
How do you like 357sig?
^ I like it ... quite accurate. It's the only thing I shoot in my (formerly) .40 cal P99 and XD 40. I think the .40 is a "little" easier on the hand when shooting a box or two. But the two H&K's I just purchased were in .40 --- so go figure. Airline stuff.
And there's just too many guns out there. I want to own them all.
Just shows I'm not prejudiced ... :icon_rast
And there's just too many guns out there. I want to own them all.
Just shows I'm not prejudiced ... :icon_rast