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What is wrong with the media?

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Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
VetteMuscle427 said:
Any recomendations on shotguns? I like the mossberg 590 or 590? combat shotgun. The one the Marines phased out a while ago.

I have a Remington 870 12 gauge w/ 18" barrel and extended magazine tube. It's got the synthetic black stock and foregrip. I like it a lot. It's great for things that go bump in the night, or for shooting clays with the friends. I want to get a long barrel for it so I can use it better for clay sports.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Patmack18 said:
You can tell Gorpwarp is living in her own little butterfly filled world. Were criminals don't exist, and everyone is supported by the state, and there's no war. Out here where we live, people don't post the amount of personal information she has on the 'net because big bad people would steal her identity, and there's war, poverty, and lazy mofo's sucking up welfare that the bleeding heart left want to keep funneling them... from OUR tax dollars mind you, in a world where the harder you work to make more money, you should have to give more of it up?

You get it Gorp? Not that I'm a theif, bud goddamn, why don't you just post your credit card and bank account #'s on the internet too....

Patmack, what's your problem? Do you think that my having a webpage really puts me in danger? I've had one up for five years, as have many others I know, and never have I had a problem with identity theft etcetera etcera. If some thugs wanted that, all they have to do is sniff your cookies. I mean, if you really want to know, your email isn't really even safe at all (unless you're actually taking the trouble to encrypt your messages and send out your public key).. And have you noticed that there actually really isn't much personal information there? Nothing about my family, my close friends.. Maybe you're just a paranoid looking for others to buy into your Big Brother theories, but if you're afraid of the internet.. that's not my problem.

BTW, guns are awesome, nucs are great, and missiles are sexy. Drum-banging peace-mongers and vegetarians are not.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Fly Navy said:
Humans have no inherent social justice. We are animals. Someone has to think this stuff up. If a person was left to their own devices outside of society, you honestly think they'd develop the same morals as say American society? Take a look at morals in the Arab world, or the Asian world. They can be vastly different.

Late on this one... but will take a stab at it anyway.

Whether we are animals or not is up for debate. (Not here, hopefully, but just.. in general) Some would say that there is a difference between humans and animals - that is, humans have self-awareness, humans have a soul, humans are more than the bazillion chemical reactions inside our cells, humans are not automata.. And, I agree, you're right about American laws having more resemblance to a Judeo-Christian code than do Arab or Asian laws. But that doesn't mean you need Christianity to uphold the laws.

Our laws (or morals embedded in legal codes) are part of a social contract. It's not inherent, I concede, but at some point in time, people sat in a room and agreed that it's not a good idea to kill each other and steal from each other because they wouldn't want to be killed or robbed. It is for practical reasons (we still don't want to be killed or robbed, and the system, the agreement, has worked pretty well to quell the barbarian in us) that we still have that social contract.
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
Humans are INDEED animals. Unless science has broken out with a brand new classification for the Human Being, I'm pretty sure we belong to the animal kingdom and are in fact mammals.

Never said you needed Christianity to hold up the laws.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Patmack18 said:
[snip]...lazy mofo's sucking up welfare that the bleeding heart left want to keep funneling them... from OUR tax dollars mind you, in a world where the harder you work to make more money, you should have to give more of it up?...[snip]

Not sure what you're referring to here, but maybe it's the "tutoring disadvantaged high school students" on the res..

If so, some clarifications: that job paid 17 dollars an hour (pretty good in my book). The money for that school (as for many other charter schools in MA) does not come from tax money; it comes from capitalists who have made their fortune (think Akamai, Microsoft..) and have decided of their own volition that it might be a good idea to unload some of their wealth into the public education system.

Don't try to paint me as a socialist. Capitalism creates progress and increases efficiency.

What else you got?
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
He's targetting the Left's love of taxes and social programs which merely create a welfare state where it is more profitable to be unemployed than it is to go out and find a job. Kind of like the current state that we are in. It's disgusting and outright destructive.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Fly Navy said:
He's targetting the Left's love of taxes and social programs which merely create a welfare state where it is more profitable to be unemployed than it is to go out and find a job. Kind of like the current state that we are in. It's disgusting and outright destructive.

I guess I must look pretty leftist in this thread. While I disagree with some points of the right, if you haven't guessed by now, I'm an economic libertarian (less so than in the past) and centrist for social issues. When I'm going up against hard-rights, however, any right-ward sympathies I harbor probably pale in comparison.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Don't know if you're asking me this. I thought I'd made clear my views of porch-monkeys and baby-factories. And yea they should be sterilized if you ask me (one of my more extreme views..)

Maybe the minimum wage has something to do with it. Federal minimum wage is 5.15 an hour. In Massachusetts, it's 6.75. Is it a coincidence that MA has a much lower unemployment rate than the national average? The federal minimum wage hasn't changed since 1997, but inflation (as you can observe to an exaggerated degree in the price of gas) has changed the value of money a lot. You say that Bush is the secret to making E-1's able to make ends meet, but how is he going to make work appealing if some burger-flipper or janitor needs to work two other jobs on the side to make ends meet? Do you think he's gonna have anything to do with the minimum wage being raised?

You're right about marriage. It has religious sanctity, so Utah folks should take up as many wives as they can and since the Church forbids divorce, that should be illegal too.
 

NeoCortex

Castle Law for all States!!!
pilot
The answer to the marriage problem is to give Homosexuals the same tax breaks as married people, call it something else, and make marriage a purely religious institution.

There fixed. Why don't I get paid the big bucks?
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
One more reason Massachusetts is awesome (as if you needed anymore)..

The Sox are back on top!
Take that, Jeter! World Series here we come..

And it's 85 degrees!

And it's half-price burger night at the Pour House!

Life is good...
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
gorpwarp said:
Maybe the minimum wage has something to do with it. Federal minimum wage is 5.15 an hour. In Massachusetts, it's 6.75. Is it a coincidence that MA has a much lower unemployment rate than the national average? The federal minimum wage hasn't changed since 1997, but inflation (as you can observe to an exaggerated degree in the price of gas) has changed the value of money a lot. You say that Bush is the secret to making E-1's able to make ends meet, but how is he going to make work appealing if some burger-flipper or janitor needs to work two other jobs on the side to make ends meet? Do you think he's gonna have anything to do with the minimum wage being raised?

You're right about marriage. It has religious sanctity, so Utah folks should take up as many wives as they can and since the Church forbids divorce, that should be illegal too.

I fail to see your correlation between a higher minimum wage and unemployment rates. Explain please.

Some people have to work unskilled jobs. That's the nature of a society. Not everyone can go to a private college and work at a high paying engineering company. Nor should everyone be afforded that. A society of intellects would crumble in a heartbeat. HOWEVER, nothing really stops a person who is determined to rise amongst the social ladder. The only thing stopping someone is their brain and their will.

The minimum wage is higher in MA because the cost of living is higher. Take a look at BAH rates, that's proof enough. If you think a bagger at a grocery store really deserves a huge amount of hourly wage, you have issues. If that's all their brain and/or willpower will afford them in life, well then that is THEIR problem.
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
gorpwarp said:
One more reason Massachusetts is awesome (as if you needed anymore)..

The Sox are back on top!
Take that, Jeter! World Series here we come..

And it's 85 degrees!

And it's half-price burger night at the Pour House!

Life is good...

Massachusetts sucks. I know, I grew up there. The only good things are the Red Sox and Boston ;)
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
NeoCortex said:
The answer to the marriage problem is to give Homosexuals the same tax breaks as married people, call it something else, and make marriage a purely religious institution.

There fixed. Why don't I get paid the big bucks?

I think you're saying what I believe..... sorta.

The government should not be involved in marriage, PERIOD. The ONLY reason it is is because of taxes.
 

gorpwarp

pro-rec'd snfo
Fly Navy said:
I fail to see your correlation between a higher minimum wage and unemployment rates. Explain please.

Some people have to work unskilled jobs. That's the nature of a society. Not everyone can go to a private college and work at a high paying engineering company. Nor should everyone be afforded that. A society of intellects would crumble in a heartbeat. HOWEVER, nothing really stops a person who is determined to rise amongst the social ladder. The only thing stopping someone is their brain and their will.

The minimum wage is higher in MA because the cost of living is higher. Take a look at BAH rates, that's proof enough. If you think a bagger at a grocery store really deserves a huge amount of hourly wage, you have issues. If that's all their brain and/or willpower will afford them in life, well then that is THEIR problem.

What I was saying is this: MA has consistently hovered at a 5.0 to 5.1 percent unemployment. National average has been at 6 to 7, though at its lowest in the past couple years right now at 5.6. I don't know if there is a correlation, I was just wondering if it was a coincidence. If there is a welfare system, it can't be more lucrative than working one's ass off.

That said, there shouldn't be welfare. Sorry, FlyNavy, in hailing MA's high minimum wage, I guess I was just being defensive for MA. In principle, I agree, federally controlled wages are bull donkey. Every labor has a market value. The way it is here, however, that market value has been corrupted by federal standards.

The ideal system (reading this part is optional :) ) is the kind of capitalism that exists in China (minus the Communism) (work with me here :) ) : In China, if you lose your job, you don't wait on your ass for some money to arrive at your door. You go out the next day to the market and start selling whatever you can - your things, any fish you can catch, and so on, or you can bargain the worth of your labor and sell that. That's true capitalism. The US is pretty socialist in comparison.

As for social programs... (a little late or maybe off topic but it would be nice to see what people think). So.. there's this whole thing about "All men are created equal" in the Declaration of Independence, right? Well, that's obviously not true. The point of contention is, should the government instate corrections so that people can kind of start from the same place?

Whether or not you think they should, in the end, it's a democracy and people - rich, poor, screwed by the system or not - all get to vote. How much should we care about the education or otherwise well-being of others? The libertarian in me says, "F*** starving babies. They're not mine, and if their parents find them worth feeding, let them figure it out." Same with education etc. But then somewhere down the line when it came time to vote on the issue, some people, including the wealthy and literate, decided (I'm leaving compassion out of this, btw, since we're operating under the assumption that humans are animals), "Well, maybe it's not in my best interests to have a bunch of savages running around at the bottom of the socio-economic food-chain, because, I don't know, they might 1) steal from me, 2) sell drugs to my kids to make some money, 3) do something crazy cos they don't know better... the list goes on. Yeah sure it's illegal, but what do they have to lose?" So we educate them to the best of the system's abilities and financial resources. And for those itching for some religion in schools, give em vouchers to attend parochial schools. It's a well-known fact that parochial schools are more efficient about money than public schools anyway (in a cost-per-student way).

And meritocracy, well that's a fine idea. It would be ideal and affirmative action wouldn't be necessary, if only there weren't so many biases against minorities built in to the system. Reparations for slavery? Ridiculous. We should just agree that we're not gonna f*** black people over any more. Reparations for the Holocaust? Same thing. Just don't f*** over Jewish people. Reparations for the Japanese internment? Ditto. But we can't get rid of all the biases. The problem with affirmative action is that it's difficult to define an equity between the biases and the corrections.

I'm sure I'm forgetting something, but this should be enough to chew the fat for a while. :)

(go Sox!)
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
gorpwarp said:
What I was saying is this: MA has consistently hovered at a 5.0 to 5.1 percent unemployment. National average has been at 6 to 7, though at its lowest in the past couple years right now at 5.6. I don't know if there is a correlation, I was just wondering if it was a coincidence. If there is a welfare system, it can't be more lucrative than working one's ass off.

That said, there shouldn't be welfare. Sorry, FlyNavy, in hailing MA's high minimum wage, I guess I was just being defensive for MA. In principle, I agree, federally controlled wages are bull donkey. Every labor has a market value. The way it is here, however, that market value has been corrupted by federal standards.

The ideal system (reading this part is optional :) ) is the kind of capitalism that exists in China (minus the Communism) (work with me here :) ) : In China, if you lose your job, you don't wait on your ass for some money to arrive at your door. You go out the next day to the market and start selling whatever you can - your things, any fish you can catch, and so on, or you can bargain the worth of your labor and sell that. That's true capitalism. The US is pretty socialist in comparison.

As for social programs... (a little late or maybe off topic but it would be nice to see what people think). So.. there's this whole thing about "All men are created equal" in the Declaration of Independence, right? Well, that's obviously not true. The point of contention is, should the government instate corrections so that people can kind of start from the same place?

Whether or not you think they should, in the end, it's a democracy and people - rich, poor, screwed by the system or not - all get to vote. How much should we care about the education or otherwise well-being of others? The libertarian in me says, "F*** starving babies. They're not mine, and if their parents find them worth feeding, let them figure it out." Same with education etc. But then somewhere down the line when it came time to vote on the issue, some people, including the wealthy and literate, decided (I'm leaving compassion out of this, btw, since we're operating under the assumption that humans are animals), "Well, maybe it's not in my best interests to have a bunch of savages running around at the bottom of the socio-economic food-chain, because, I don't know, they might 1) steal from me, 2) sell drugs to my kids to make some money, 3) do something crazy cos they don't know better... the list goes on. Yeah sure it's illegal, but what do they have to lose?" So we educate them to the best of the system's abilities and financial resources. And for those itching for some religion in schools, give em vouchers to attend parochial schools. It's a well-known fact that parochial schools are more efficient about money than public schools anyway (in a cost-per-student way).

And meritocracy, well that's a fine idea. It would be ideal and affirmative action wouldn't be necessary, if only there weren't so many biases against minorities built in to the system. Reparations for slavery? Ridiculous. We should just agree that we're not gonna f*** black people over any more. Reparations for the Holocaust? Same thing. Just don't f*** over Jewish people. Reparations for the Japanese internment? Ditto. But we can't get rid of all the biases. The problem with affirmative action is that it's difficult to define an equity between the biases and the corrections.

I'm sure I'm forgetting something, but this should be enough to chew the fat for a while. :)

(go Sox!)

Welfare in Mass. is some of the worst. The people of that state seem to think that giving money to crackwhores is the answer to the poverty problem. It's a classic example of "the real solution is too hard, therefore, let's throw money at the problem and hope that works."

Well, for the motivated, if you lose your job, you go out and get another or do what you can. Unfortunately, people have learned and have created a system where they can lounge around and do nothing for a while, because the government, aka the people, will support them. Then it self perpetuates with a lot of people and they grow to like the welfare state. They don't have to do anything and they get to make money.

"All men are created equal" refers to how the government sees and treats the people, in my mind. It has nothing to do with equal footing, equal treatment by others, etc. If I want to call someone a racial slur, I can, the government can't tell me otherwise. HOWEVER, thanks to IDIOTS with bleeding hearts (this isn't aimed at you, I'm talking about retards like Rosie O'Donnell), we get things such as Hate Crime Legislation. This kind of legislation is the worst. It's PURE thought control. It is against the very fabric of the United States, and it needs to be abolished NOW. I'd like to find the reasoning behind why it's worse to kill a black man and call him a n&*(er while I do it, than kill a white guy without any comment.

Yes, I know how the a Representative Democracy works, aka a Republic. We're not a pure democracy, and if we were, it'd be terrible. It's also a fact that a democratic government can only last as long as it takes for the people to realize they can vote themselves more money. That's a loose paraphrase of a famous quote. And it's absolutely true.

I'm not even TOUCHING the race issue you put there on the last comment. Not on a public board. Sorry, I'd love to debate it, but I'm not going there.
 
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