RetreadRand said:
Well said .... !!!
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NFO retreads VS. SNAs
- Thread starter Malice 1
- Start date
Well said .... !!!
RetreadRand said:
yeah, actually that is kinda what I had in mind.
If a retread went through NFO school in the T34, then I would assume he already has a good systems background on the aircraft. He would be alot more proficient on the simple stuff. Radio calls, IFR stuff, navigation, etc...
Being in the air just gives you more experience. They can probably judge a 3 mile initial better than most of us. THere are alot of simple things that get noob SNAs that retreads might have a leg up on.
Me and some guys speculated that retreads would basically just do a backseat to frontseat transition. We assumed that they came to primary with a slot already assigned in thier old aircraft.
FOr those who think us SNAs should be in the books instead of posting on AW; for those of you who keep telling us not to worry about grades: Lighten up. It's all in fun.
wilsonator
Registered User
There were a couple of retreads going through when I went through. They were treated a little better partially due to rank but mainly due to the fact that they didn't need to be treated like your standard new guy. There is a reason why you don't hang with the IP's and you have to call them sir by the way. One P3 NFO had 1500 hours flying civilian, rocked the program and got his first choice E-6's. One guy did alright and got E-2's. Not sure what the earlier post was saying about their jet slots coming from a different allotment, I don't think that is the case. Anyway, fast forward to advanced in the T-45. A couple of NFO to pilot types didn't make it through. So maybe one could say they're previous experience helped in primary but once you get to the 45, there isn't near enough room for subjectivity. A little but you can either land on the boat or not. If not, your double anchors and railroad tracks can't save you. DITTO on the fact that they've earned it. One thing that I've kept in mind over the last couple of years is that there are tons of NFO's out there that would be SH pilots but didn't have the eye sight. They get PRK in the fleet, kick ass on all their fitreps and compete for a slot (usually less than 10 spots a year). I'd treat those guys with mucho respect and get a feel of what the real Navy is like from them, learn from them and work with them. Remember they've been through a training command program, they'll tell you how to play the game. Don't sweat the jet slots, work together, work your ass off, don't hold grudges, work your ass off, help the other dudes around you, and did I say work your ass off....
Good luck and have fun.
Good luck and have fun.
There are different requirements for Navy and Marine numbers. The Marines may not need as many jet guys one quarter as the Navy, or vice versa. That's why, a while back, there was a Marine jet draft, and if you had a 50 and a pulse, they grabbed you. Yes, the money to train Navy and Marine guys comes from the same pot, so in that sense, they're not different, but the manpower needs are different from service to service. This is why Marines seem to need a 52 and Navy needs a 50 (last I heard).
I agree, I assumed the same thing. BUT, you always hear horror story's from guys losing hydraulics, coming back to the ship, getting the screaming power call and catching the 1 wire full blower, they hop out of the plane and the guy in the back is fat, dumb and happy, unaware of their imminent demise? You can know everything in the world, if you're not a good stick, you're not a good stick.
I find this hard to believe. Come on.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
I have other pilots ignore screaming power calls, try to fly into the hangar, etc, etc, yada yads...
And they HAD the controls (which I took from them) and did not realize that they were seconds from becoming a PLAT tape they show at API.
The screaming power calls, I've one or two in my day, are very hard to ignore. I doubt any NFO would not be aware after one of those calls, period. Now if the pilot simply settles at the ramp, no power call into a taxi one...has happened without so much as a word, different. I'm telling you, as other carrier guys will attest to, no matter what you're doing, when you hear that "power" call with attitude, you stop what you're doing to watch the platt screen. Everytime.
When I was OOD on the TR, we had a Hornet trap that shook everyone up. No radio calls or anything. Instead of adding power as he caught the wires, he went to idle. It was really quite - one of those pin drop moments. Everyone on the flight deck kind of stood there and stared. On the bridge we reacted similarly. Then the CO broke the spell by looking at me and saying "Tell the Boss I want to see that Whisper Jet pilot in my sea cabin NOW!"
Fly_USMC said:
"You always hear ... story's (sic) .... ???? NO WAY....NO HOW.
[NFO threadjack on "quiet recoveries]
"No power calls as the pilot settles into a taxi one" ....??? Not on my ship, unless you're running zip-lip and then ... you'd have flashing green cut lights all the way through the "taxi". The LSO you experienced on that particular day is NOT doing the job ... Idle in the wires is a BIG no-no ... you have to wean it out of the guys early in the game. If there are repeat instances ... they guy is g-o-n-e.
I had one that caught me by surprise one "dark and stormy"night that almost bit me in my LSO behind ... an A-7 driver ... usually a good, but sometimes "unruly" stick ...
TMP SRDIC HFBAR NDTL B>
The FLUF was in idle power as he went sailing past the platform ... eerily quiet at that moment on the flight deck ... he landed flat, nose down at the the #4 wire, hook skipped, and dropped off the angle into the dark ... still silent .... I was screaming "POWER!! POWER!!" as he sailed past my left ear and touched down (not something you normally do with a HFBAR ...
) and someone else ... probably the BOSS screamed "EJECT !!! EJECT !!!" while I was still screaming "POWER!!!" .... when sloooowly ... sloooooooooooowwwwly ... the FLUF peeked up over the deck edge, still "flying" up the BRC ... staggering over the waves as the power/noise/aircraft came up .... again ... all in the dark.
The post mortem: the A-7 driver had chopped the power to idle as he broke it out of a poorly performing auto-throttle and went manual when he went TMP SRDIC after calling the ball with state and "auto" ... but he hadn't called "manual" when he broke out of auto. He chopped the throttle to the stop and when adding power for touchdown ....
.... his flight suit sleeve caught on "something" and that was it for the forward movement of the throttle . As he boltered and went off the angle, he got his sleeve loose, went to MRT with his left hand, ran the throttle friction full up, and moved his left hand to the alternate ejection handle (all faster than you can say it) while nursing the slowly responding FLUF-jet back to flying speed past the bow and forward of the ship.He said if he "felt" the water
, he was going to punch. That was his story and he was stickin' to it .... [/NFO threadjack ... OUT]
So, your saying the pilot didn't bother to let the back seat know THEY have a hyd failure, going through the checklist as a crew? Sounds like another sort of failure to me.
As far a full blower one wire the LSO will be doing the screaming. I'll be doing the ready to leave the jet and take him with me if he doesn't respond.Believe me there nothing I can do otherwise. If he's not responding to paddles it's too late to respond to me.
As has been said, I find it hard to believe and I've BTDT.
Uhhhh, I never heard the one before about the NFO being fat dumb and happy not knowing they lost hyds, missing screaming power calls, etc..........but then again, my bio isn't just blah......
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
Traslation?
I think the B> is a Bolter and TMP is Too Much Power, SRD In Close, HFB At Ramp, NDTL? Bolter.
TMP = Too Much Power (started it all when he came out of an underpowered "auto" condition)
SRDIC = Stop Rate of Descent In Close (direct result of too much power)
HFBAR = High Fast Flat at the Ramp (B is "flat" .. like music ... direct flight path/aircraft attitude result of TMP SRDIC ...)
NDTL = Nose Down to Land (the only way he's gonna get down at this point -- but it usually raises the hook-point resulting in a ... )
BOLTER !!!
Overly descriptive, perhaps ... but it helped me in the subsequent debriefs to provide detail for the pilot when the pass(es) was/were screwed up ....