Form landing??

[wink]

Back to the original question, I just sat through an Instrument Ground School refresher, where this came up as a bonus question during our review. According to our instructor, OPNAV (3710.7, I assume) specifically prohibits section touch and goes, but does allow section T/O and landings.

Penguin

Just for fun I looked at my 3710.7J. Yes boys and girls the is J as in Juliet, very early 1980s. That version of 3710 does in fact prohibit section touch and goes (did anyone really have to be told that is a bad idea). But it does not specifically mention section landings to a full stop. It simply speaks to the proper way to obtain a safe interval for landing after a section approach. So, unless the modern read is different, in keeping with the spirit of NAVAIR, if not told specifically something is prohibited, carry on...

 

[A4sForever]

Just for fun I looked at my 3710.7J. .... if not told specifically something is prohibited, carry on...

Just don't screw it up ...

 

[wink]

Just don't screw it up ...

Or you will end up inspiring a new entry in 3710.

 

[skidkid]

yeah a book that only seems to get bigger and more restrictive

 

[The Stinkster]

Sarcasm obviously didn't come through very well. I am well aware I don't have the details. I heard about the incident during a Friday ORM brief, and very few details were provided. At the time, I didn't ask for anything more, and I certainly didn't know there were deaths involved. I am told there is a Grampaw Pettibone article about the incident, maybe I will look it up. If I offended you, I'm sorry for making light of a tragic situation.

No offense taken. Sarcasm is sometimes hard to judge when typed. In situations such as that one, something terrible happened from doing something stupid, and any muddling of the facts tends to lead to a new story that could end up misrepresenting the situation or those involved. There could be people on this board much more closely related to the incident and with much greater interest in not having the story turn into something that it was not. No hard feelings on my end!

 

[wink]

Thread jack approved

yeah a book that only seems to get bigger and more restrictive

Would that be because we have more guys doing stupid things, abusing the relative freedoms we have over the Air Farce, or is it just a fearful risk averse leadership restricting the judgement of fleet aviators/warriors by design, warranted or not? My gut feeling is that it is the latter. So what is the perspective from the current active aviators? Do we have more knuckleheads of questionable judgement requiring written direction to stay out of trouble, or more micro managing leadership sitting too far back in the saddle?

Hey, I started the thread so I can authorize wholesale thread jack.

 

[A4sForever]

Would that be because we have more guys doing stupid things, abusing the relative freedoms we have over the Air Farce, or is it just a fearful risk averse leadership restricting the judgement of fleet aviators/warriors by design, warranted or not? ....

Yes, yes, and .......... and a really, really big yes.

 

[skidkid]

concur with above

 

[beau]

The weird thing about my first Section landing was it was solo. It wasent a big deal...but I can see why it can be dangerous.....blown tire...etc. In fact, having not done a section takeoff since my days in the T-34 (not allowed in T-45 land while I was going through), in one flight, first solo form in the Hornet, we got a section T/O and Landing......just fly parade until your wheels touch! :icon_smil

 

[TurnandBurn55]

Ehhh... I've done a section takeoff once (first form flight in the RAG) and a section landing zero times. I'll have to take a look at NATOPS/SOP for the Rhino, but with the brake and anti-skid issues the -18E/F has, I'd say it's dicey. Definetely wouldn't do it with the arresting gear up in battery.

Now, did the narrator in the Blues video call that a "diamond", or am I hearing things??

 

[QuiksilverHg]

I'm at Vance now, we get about 14 formation flights and every single one is a section (wing) takeoff (except one required interval takeoff). Wing landings are not common, but many people will get to do one or two. I would have done one the other day, but the air force has rules against landing if there isn't a T-6 qualled instructor 'observing' the runway you land on. Stupid I know...air force.

So we ended up doing a low approach and then taking spacing on the break for the VFR runway. Wing landings don't seem like a big deal in the T-6, my instructor seemed like he was ready to let me land it until the tower said we had to low approach because of lack of observer.

 

[Harrier Dude]

Wait a minute. You had an IP in your aircraft and they wouldn't let you land? Were you solo?

Still sounds as gay as man-on-man dancing.

 

[dingo155]

We seem to do a lot of them here at Oceana... maybe b/c the weather is usually bad and most guys have to come in for an approach and it keeps the flow going pretty well. splitting up for the duals is an option, but then it clobbers both runways so no one can take off. I have done 10-ish section landings in the hornet. if the weather is really bad then the section landing is briefed. circling mins = speed split or split the duals.
Just back from a 3 day, 8 leg cross country to fallon for a top gun flight and we did section takeoffs on every leg, except the one from fallon. only did a couple section approaches due to weather and took speed split on final.
as for air force primary... we did mostly section go's in the t-6 (at moody) and then about half were section landings, kinda crazy when you only have 75hrs total.

 

[Harrier Dude]

Re-read above. I think the whole point was landing in formation. No speed splits on final.

 

[Brett327]

We seem to do a lot of them here at Oceana... maybe b/c the weather is usually bad and most guys have to come in for an approach and it keeps the flow going pretty well. splitting up for the duals is an option, but then it clobbers both runways so no one can take off. I have done 10-ish section landings in the hornet. if the weather is really bad then the section landing is briefed. circling mins = speed split or split the duals.
Just back from a 3 day, 8 leg cross country to fallon for a top gun flight and we did section takeoffs on every leg, except the one from fallon. only did a couple section approaches due to weather and took speed split on final.
as for air force primary... we did mostly section go's in the t-6 (at moody) and then about half were section landings, kinda crazy when you only have 75hrs total.

Seriously? 4 legs coast to coast? Prowlers can do West to East in 2, 3 the other way.

Brett