So no answer. I guess I can’t claim that I saw this coming as you’ve spouted the same dumbass non-answer the last time this argument took place. And the time before.
-
Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?
Go here:
Edit Account Details and Profile
COVID-19
- Thread starter Treetop Flyer
- Start date
What do you think led to the different outcomes between Sweden, Norway, and Finland?
Taps toes while waiting for some bullshit non-answer about meatballs and lutefisk.
I haven’t spent much time thinking about it. Maybe a combination of factors, like demographics, population density, cultural norms, reporting criteria and policies, dumb luck, and on and on.
Just kidding obviously the answer is leadership and selflessness. Same reason Texas and California achieved essentially identical results IRT covid but differed greatly on economic, societal, and educational impacts. Because Texas lacks leadership and is selfish.
He means selflessness and leadership from people like from Dr. Leana Wen (clip posted earlier in thread), who said that the Biden administration should take away all freedoms and give them back like privileges one by one based on vaccination status.
I just love that even after “two weeks to flatten the curve!” has been going on for a year now, with EVERYTHING that has happened, people can still cling to the belief that masks and lockdowns work. Proof is in the pudding. We messed up. Big time. These same people would just as soon leave everything closed until the end of time, because “if it saves just one life...”
Last edited:
You might be on to something about shitty leadership though.
Impending doom! Be scared.
But turns out we were full of shit, vaccinated people aren’t a threat to carry the virus.
Just kidding, maybe they can!
But it’s safe to travel if you’re fully vaccinated, so there’s that.
But don’t. Because there are cases and that’s scary even if I can’t explain why that’s relevant to someone fully vaccinated.
Excellent leadership, clear message, fully science-y
Impending doom! Be scared.
But turns out we were full of shit, vaccinated people aren’t a threat to carry the virus.
Just kidding, maybe they can!
But it’s safe to travel if you’re fully vaccinated, so there’s that.
But don’t. Because there are cases and that’s scary even if I can’t explain why that’s relevant to someone fully vaccinated.
Excellent leadership, clear message, fully science-y
In all of those factors you list they are almost identical countries. They've run the controlled experiment for us.
It's policy.
So would we call that a progressive spin, or an aggravated spin? If you put in pro-spin inputs and it doesn't recover, it's because you didn't do it hard enough, or for long enough. Just hold on a liiiiittle longer, and it'll all be over. ??
Walensky is leading with her emotions, namely fear. I'm sure her credentials in the medical field are outstanding (although she gets a below for objectivity), but as a leader, I'm not impressed. She seems hell bent on capitalizing on the emotional aspects of the pandemic, which is exactly what we don't need.
Separately, I have to wonder how many of the conflicting messages are due to the absolutely astonishing amount of information out there circulating. Some lackey says "up" after leadership says "down", and both get attributed to the organization, that kind of thing.
Not saying it excuses anything, just makes it harder for John Q. Citizen when the narrative itself gets buried in a mudslide of fear-mongering click bait.
So how has policy differed between Norway, Finland, and Sweden? If you’re going to say “leadership and selflessness” again don’t bother wasting your time.
This is from November but seems relevant.
How Finland and Norway Proved Sweden’s Approach to COVID-19 Works
Norway and Finland have some of the lowest COVID-19 death rates in the world. Many have pointed to their success as a contrast to Sweden, which has a much higher COVID-19 death rate. But a key factor is being overlooked.
fee.org
An article from November 13th...go back and look at the chart I posted. See when Sweden's second big surge got going.
Answer the question
It's in here
SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals
Subscription and open access journals from SAGE Publishing, the world's leading independent academic publisher.
Is it? It looks like they all were pretty similar, and definitely no smoking gun. It’s also from last spring and summer which is strange because you used timeframe to dismiss the article I posted. It’s also strange that study attributed differences in demographics as a major factor (which sounds familiar for some reason) even though you just assured us those countries are identical. I guess I’ll add “policy” to “leadership and selflessness” to your hand wave hindsight non-answers.It's in here
SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals
Subscription and open access journals from SAGE Publishing, the world's leading independent academic publisher.journals.sagepub.com
You didn't actually read it, did you?
From the first paragraph in the paper, "Sweden had a higher incidence rate across all ages, a higher COVID-19-related death rate only partially explained by population demographics"
From the second paragraph in the paper, "The intensity of implementation—both from the perspective of government recommendations compared with mandates as well as the adherence to recommendations by the public—have resulted in different outcomes across countries with similar population demographics, economic systems, and health care infrastructures."
I especially liked the part about how Sweden altered policy and got case counts down to a similar level as their neighbors. Spoiler alert, it came back. Also the part about mandates only accounting for a small fraction of reduced mobility was kind of important.