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CNAF/CNATRA Callsign Review Boards?
- Thread starter Treetop Flyer
- Start date
Shack. My callsign is less than complementary, but IDGAF. I can think of other terms, though, that if they'd tried to hang them on me, I'd have been legitimately go-to-the-IG pissed off. As much as we bust on each other (and should), we all know there are lines. I mean, you wouldn't give a non-white aviator a racial slur as their callsign, or a misogynistic one to a female aviator, because that'd be obviously fucked up and wrong. So it's not "are there lines?" It's "where are the lines and how do we not cross them?" Beyond the obvious demographic things, all of us have our own life stories that give us other buttons that are best left unpressed. As an example, I remember being an FNG, remembering something obvious in a conversation, and doing the "finger gun to the head" gesture that in casual conversation usually just means "I'm a dumbass." A senior JO pulled me aside and said "dude, don't do that around here, because LCDR X lost a brother to suicide." Felt like a complete tool, but at least then I knew.
TL;DR, you should know your audience enough to know what's just tweaking them versus what would legitimately have them feeling harassed. Going from the former to the latter isn't "aviation culture," it's "abusing the culture to just be an asshole."
And none of that requires three admirals/generals to draft a policy except to cover their asses and look like they’re “doing something”.
Just think of the fuckery required for three staffs to create that idiotic document and the man (trigger warning) hours required by every command required to read/post/cover their own asses.
Could you possibly explain a little more where the line is for you between “I’m not super pumped about my callsign but oh well” and “I am so fired up about my callsign that I’m going to call the IG”?
I think part of the problem with the current culture is the shoot first ask questions later sort of mentality that seems to be so prevalent. Why go there first and not try to solve things at the lowest possible level?
Because now the burden is on the person employed in a "Harden up/don't be a pussy" career path to alienate themselves in their command by "being a pussy" and complaining about their callsign (I don't feel like thread diving, but didn't this start because a black aviator got a racist callsign?). Easier to just say, "Hey, don't give your black squadronmate a callsign after a mentally challenged black guy."
Yes, I see the slippery slope problem that threatens tradition ("Now anyone can just be soft about any callsign they don't like!"), but in practice, I doubt many people are going to complain about their callsigns (see earlier argument).
But hey, these weren't my traditions, so defending them is less important to me than toeing certain lines that fuck with racism/sexism/etc. Maybe something dear to me now will change in 20 years and I'll wonder what's wrong with the kids these days.
Quick edit and tl;dr: I agree with the overall intent, but I don't like that CNAF has to draft this shitty regulation up to codify the idea. But hey, this is the Navy...
These aren't binary options. And I absolutely don't encourage blindsiding folks by going to the IG first. What I meant to emphasize with that point is whether we're talking about the usual EO issues (blatant racism, misogyny, etc.) or things like my former squadronmate's history of family suicide, there are things for each person in any unit that are off-limits for mockery or callsigns, because they are beyond the pale for that person.
It's nice to think that everybody involved will always be comfortable handling things at the lowest level, and hopefully they will. But regardless of color, gender, or orientation, there's also shit that for that person would be unacceptable. For some of those, sure, that could be a matter of "Skipper, the ready room seems like cool people, I think you and XO are standup people, so here's my history, and that's why that callsign they're talking about can't fly."
But it's naïve to think that that can always be the case. If LTJG Snuffy is a bad fit personality-wise, is part of an immature JOPA, or if the front office is toxic or clueless, LTJG Snuffy may get shoehorned into "accepting" a callsign that they personally think is abominable. Or the unit may just collectively whiff, and try to hang something on LTJG Snuffy that it turns out that in his or her mind, that's equivalent to calling someone one of the slurs I mentioned above . . . for whatever personal reason that doesn't have to make sense to anyone else.
If that happens, stand the hell by, because asking that person to "solve it at the lowest level" is like asking someone who's been harassed sexually or otherwise by their CO, DH, or boss to "solve it at the lowest level." Power relationships are a thing, like it or not. None of us get to tell people how to feel about remarks, comments, or callsigns. That's totally on the person themselves.
Again . . . this isn't about me. I don't give a damn about my own callsign, and I think it's kind of funny. But I've also seen toxic squadron culture in action, and had a rather blunt conversation with my XO about it when I checked out. So I understand that when someone feels ganged-up on, "handle it at the lowest level" can be a joke.
I think where things get confusing are like my original callsign (that ultimately a Skipper did nix). My callsign was based on how I look and where I am from, making fun of a minority segment of the population, although I am not a member of that minority. It certainly could be offensive to some people, and it wasn't particularly offensive to me, but the callsign was simultaneously insulting to a minority group without insulting me personally (ultimately the callsign was just joking that I looked like a "stereotypical" member of that segment of the population, which, I can 100% see what they are talking about). At first, I was mad when it was taken from me as I had it for a couple years, but looking back, it was the right call.
RoarkJr.
Well-Known Member
For those who aren’t sure why we don’t all just “get on board” with the supposedly “new normal” of pc culture, I recommend listening to Zizek. Yes, he’s a communist. But I found his reasoning about why pc culture is terrible pretty convincing.
The TL
R is this: It’s about trust. Being able to tease each other about ethnic stuff actually shows that you really DGAF about it. My enlisted experience corroborates that. Hell, we had a gay transsexual/crossdresser in our shop, but he was one of the best at his job and was respected as a result. But we all teased each other. The truly racist ones probably can’t joke about it.That might be difficult to understand. Especially given that our educational institutions and media are controlled by those sympathetic to critical race theory, Marxism, etc. The jist of it is that PC culture is fundamentally a religious idea based on “equality” being the most important moral, and therefore a violation of that is a cardinal sin. I recommend reading “Sapiens” to get a better (and bigger) picture about how that’s possible.
Anyway, sounds like that’s what the Major was talking about. Trust. If the teasing really bothers you I’d say, first ask yourself why, and then have the courage to say something to those involved.
This is going to get to the point where we don't even call each other by our actual names anymore. I made up a nametag years ago in Kadena that had "CTG 72.2.7.1" as a joke to point out that the command didn't give a shit about people, we were just crew positions on a flight sked. A little before its time but looks like that's what we are trending towards.
Dibs on TK421!
Insert joke about the guy who changed his name to BR-549 so he could have personalized license plates.
Naval Aviation is all about going right to the thin edge, where if you cross it you fail, maybe die. No line to cross...no challenge.
It’s good to have a line to cross on call signs. It makes the game the game.
I love this anecdote. Tell me it doesn’t make you smile, and want to raise a toast on Abrek’s behalf, AKA LT Zilberman, who perished while keeping his Hummer flying, saving his crew.
Naval Aviation is all about going right to the thin edge, where if you cross it you fail, maybe die. No line to cross...no challenge.
It’s good to have a line to cross on call signs. It makes the game the game.
I love this anecdote. Tell me it doesn’t make you smile, and want to raise a toast on Abrek’s behalf, AKA LT Zilberman, who perished while keeping his Hummer flying, saving his crew.
Go back and read the article in the first post of this thread. This started because a couple shitty pilots played the race card when they washed out.