Advanced Attrites

[Dorkman]

Hey everyone, I am selecting this week and am curious about what will happen if I get my first choice and not do very well. I am looking to select jets and I have buddies in Kingsville and Meridian thet are telling me that it is easy to attrite from there. Also, what if I start and do not find it is the right community for me. I guess what I am asking is are they letting people go to other flying communities if they do not make through advanced?

Just looking for advice before I decide on my next adventure. Thanks

 

[ChunksJR]

if I get my first choice and not do very well.

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU THINKING!?!?! HOW THE HELL ARE YOU GOING TO CATCH A HOOK AT NIGHT ON A 2% ILLUM THINKING ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO IF YOU MISS!!!!!!!

EYE ON THE PRIZE MAN! EYE ON THE PRIZE.

[/rant]

Seriously though. Jet guys get a bad rep for being "cocky" or "a$$holes". Some are. But I'll tell you what. I've been on a Carrier on a dark night. I've seen what they have to do. I WANT ALL OF THEM TO BE COCKY/A$$HOLES AND KNOW THEY ARE GOING TO CATCH THE 3 WIRE ON FINAL.

Naval aviation in and of itself is scary. Don't let you psych yourself out.

Good luck and don't worry about attriting until you've given your all and still find yourself in khakis/whites. It'll only be more dangerous for yourself and those around you.

~D

 

[Fly Navy]

Do you want to fly jets? Then man up and ask for it.

Seriously, they're not out to attrite anyone, unless you really... REALLY suck, then they'll gun for you, but that's because you'd be dangerous to yourself and others. People attrite out of here, but not as many as you'd think. The whole 3 downs and your out? It seems very rare for someone with 3 downs to attrite, unless maybe they're NoFOD or whatnot.

 

[Banjo33]

Don't sweat it. They've got jets for idiots too, they're called Hornets.

 

[Bevo16]

Does anyone have a current answer for the guy? I didn't hear him ask for a lecture.

My info is 2 years old, but back then they did let guys who did not make it through the jet pipeline go to HT's or fly P-3's.

 

[Fly Navy]

On occasion guys can switch communities. The last I know of was a NFO re-tread who DQ'd at the boat. They let him go fly P-3s. I never ever ever hear of it happening with Marines. This is several months ago. I think if you make it all the way to the boat, you're going to be much more valuable than say, attriting in BIs.

 

[ChunksJR]

Does anyone have a current answer for the guy? I didn't hear him ask for a lecture.

My info is 2 years old, but back then they did let guys who did not make it through the jet pipeline go to HT's or fly P-3's.

4 things I saw (granted this was 4 years ago) but I've heard this from DHs that were instructors...(Helo advanced)

1) You DOR at any stage and good luck finding people in your Chain-of-command to fight for you to do something else.

2) You can't carrier qual or something on jets, then you have a chance in some other cockpit.

3) You get a DUI or some similar bonehead thing, you'll not be looked upon kindly (ie, you may even get processed out)

4)You have a few headwork issues that can be worked out, they'll work with you.

"If you don’t think you’re the best pilot in the business, MAYBE you’re in the wrong business. If you think you could never make a mistake, you are REALLY in the wrong business." ~-- Randy Sohn

I hope this helps.

 

[BugDriver]

Anecdotes from the last year in Kingsville:

- A Marine who double-DQ'd at the boat was recommended for transition to another pipeline.

- A Marine O3 MP transition received multiple pink sheets, his final in Tac Form, was recommended for attrition, and went back to being an MP.

- A Navy strike student who received multiple pink sheets in Phase II (Weapons, Tac Form, ACM etc...) was recommended for transition to E2/C2, subsequently CQ'd and sent off to Corpus for the multi-engine syllabus.

 

[nocal80]

Don't sweat it. They've got jets for idiots too, they're called Hornets.

baaa-zing!

 

[pilot_man]

Don't sweat it. They've got jets for idiots too, they're called Hornets.

Don't hate us because we are beautiful.:icon_smil

 

[gregsivers]

Don't hate us because we are beautiful.:icon_smil

Beautiful? Man the TH-57 is a beautiful aircraft if I ever saw one.

On the subject of advanced attrites, I don't know of anyone who has attrited from the HTs while I've been here, but from what I understand they won't send you to another advanced (read props). Granted this answer isn't about jet advanced, but I thought I'd throw in my limited knowledge on the subject.

 

[brd2881]

Don't sweat it. They've got jets for idiots too, they're called Hornets.

Well...at least Hornets fly...redstripe anyone...how long is the RAG? I concur with pilotman....and can't believe I am partaking in this endless circus of harriers vs. hornets...btw three of the Marine advanced attrites all went back to the ground side...the individual with the double DQ was sort of a special circumstance as he got "drafted" into the jet community because of needs of the Corps (funny how that works huh?) at the time...senior Marines in Kingsville went to bat for him and it worked out...very fortunate...

 

[Brett327]

I don't know of anyone who has attrited from the HTs

That's because it's the HTs.

Brett

 

[Schnugg]

I guess what I am asking is are they letting people go to other flying communities if they do not make through advanced?

No, if you attrite because you suck, I'd think you're done. As stated above, the CV is a big obstacle you must overcome and be good at.

If not good at the boat and a good stick, you may have a chance elsewhere. If not good at the boat and a dirtbag/bad rep/whiner, etc...you're done.

In the fleet the humorous mantra is..."Be very good at landing aboard the carrier or very good at inflight refuleing...Pick your evil..

 

[Catmando]

Hey everyone, I am selecting this week and am curious about what will happen if I get my first choice and not do very well. I am looking to select jets and I have buddies in Kingsville and Meridian thet are telling me that it is easy to attrite from there. Also, what if I start and do not find it is the right community for me. I guess what I am asking is are they letting people go to other flying communities if they do not make through advanced?

Just looking for advice before I decide on my next adventure. Thanks

Advance attrites should never happen… but they do.
(I think it is often a failure of the system, more than the SNA at that level.)

I have long been out of the loop, but I can speak with some authority on the subject.

I wonder, by your question, are you really looking for an escape valve, and already setting yourself up for failure?

Or are you just a cautious individual that wisely keeps their options and safety nets open?

It is impossible for me to tell from your post, but these are crucial questions.

Nevertheless, while your 1st post here suggests some requisite courage and intelligence; your moniker suggests otherwise. Ultimately though, it is your skill and perseverance that will endure and determine your future.


Assuming your question is legitimate, I can tell you that if you apply yourself, and have a modicum of skills, instructors will bend over backwards to make sure you succeed.

The advanced attrites I remember from long ago were either skilled aviators who got caught lying, cheating, or stealing on a "significant" level; or were in the "wrong business" – because of family or outside pressures, and being "non-quitters" they continued on with something they could do, but had no desire to do. (I had 2 attrites thank me for doing what they could not do for themselves.) Unfortunately, there is always that third group – honest pilots who desperately wanted the prize, but were severely challenged. Fortunately, they were very rare. Also fortunately, they never made it to the fleet where they could kill other squadron or shipmates.

This is a most difficult business, with lives beyond our own at stake. If you give it your honest effort, the process will take care of you and your fellow aviators. Give it your best shot and all will work out. Focus on success, not failure… but always have a bug-out maneuver in mind. And if you find you are in the wrong business, give your buddies a break. Make the decision yourself.

Good luck and buck up.