"Trapper" said it befor I did.^^^ A very obtuse way to invoke Godwin's Law.
edit: crap, I misspelled it... warily looking around for the spelling nazis right now.
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Woman + Subs
- Thread starter RedFive
- Start date
^^^ A very obtuse way to invoke Godwin's Law.
edit: crap, I misspelled it... warily looking around for the spelling nazis right now.
You axed for it...spelling Nazi....
Mew
Member
So I have a question for everyone who seems unhappy with women on a sub
Do you fundamentally believe that women are not capable/suited to the job?
Or that there is not going to be a deep enough bench of ladies with enough of a sense of humor to be successful if they are one of the few?
Or do you think that the logistical retrofit is a stupid expenditure?
Do you fundamentally believe that women are not capable/suited to the job?
Or that there is not going to be a deep enough bench of ladies with enough of a sense of humor to be successful if they are one of the few?
Or do you think that the logistical retrofit is a stupid expenditure?
Silhouette
Well-Known Member
There is a lot of talk about pregnancy on this thread, but not much about the misconduct that would have to occur to get to that point. Any pregnancy that occurs after departure from wherever should have serious disciplinary consequences -- and not only for the woman. It takes two to tango, and some comments make it sound as though pregnancy is the woman's 'fault' or 'problem' for lack of a better term.
Women aboard subs = pregnancies? I'd like to think that we could give the men and women aboard more credit than that. Does being in a metal tube for a few months mean that people can't keep their pants on? Even knowing the consequences for not doing so?
Someone earlier had alluded to the fact that a woman who worked so hard to get sub quals wouldn't risk throwing it away by getting pregnant before a deployment (or during a deployment). That mentality would extend to both parties if everyone understood that potentially career-ending discipline would result for violating orders, with the added aggravating factor in subs of seriously jeopardizing the mission.
I don't think that came out as eloquently as I would have liked, but there it is. Oh, and nothing disturbs me more than the thought of a woman using pregnancy as a means to get out of anything. This is a human life we're talking about here. I personally don't understand how anyone could do it.
It may take two to tango, but only women get to keep the parting gift. This isn't about laying blame; it's about physiological reality. Misconduct can and should get punished. Surfacing a sub that's supposed to be underway is a big deal.
It also may not be misconduct, but still a big problem--what if mom leaves for deployment with one in the oven that she doesn't know about until she's underway?
It also may not be misconduct, but still a big problem--what if mom leaves for deployment with one in the oven that she doesn't know about until she's underway?
Silhouette
Well-Known Member
Definitely agree. Physiological -- that would be one aspect in that she's the "problem," due to the potential for medical issues/emergencies.
As for being unaware of the pregnancy, that's tough. You've just got to be responsible, though (both parties again). You know something this important is coming up, you've got to take steps to be super careful with your spouse/significant other, etc., in the months leading up. Dependability, judgment, unselfishness... heck, if everyone listened to J.J. Did Tie Buckle, we'd probably keep ourselves out of a lot of trouble.
Are you serious? Just because everyone in this fine Navy is a professional at all times, even when stuck in a small sunless tube for months on end, means that this will never be an issue? Some people at OCS can't even get through that without getting in trouble, or risking it...
Silhouette
Well-Known Member
Yes, I was/am being serious. I didn't say or mean to imply it would be easy. You said "some people at OCS can't even get through that..." I guess my question is were they unable to, or unwilling to? And does that set the stage for how they will be later in their career -- potentially in subs?
Maybe the sub community can do it better, but on the surface side (and aviation at times), it's a maternity ward, often right before deployment.
Silhouette
Well-Known Member
Utilizing anger management techniques. *sigh*
My ship had ~10-15% females after we integrated from an all male crew ~6mo before deployment. Only 1 pregnancy before deployment, and it was a female JO who had planned it around her PRD, so it was little impact...her relief just had to show up a month earlier. No surprise pregnancies during deployment or Love Boat issues either; there were several that were obviously couples, but the CO put out a common sense frat policy and people played by rules that were clearly laid out.
Females as nukes and on ships is nothing new. And on the sex underway issue, I would think that fucking on a sub would be harder to accomplish than on a ship anyway. You can't stop em all, but these are personnel issues we've already managed to figure out in other communities. After an initial transition period, it'll probably all smooth out.
Probably going to be about as eventful as the DADT repeal was.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
I waited off the coast of NC to offload the six pregnancies of our ship prior to going OIF 1.
Had a Marine give birth three months after I got home from OIF 6-08.
Had a pregnant Marine stand before me at Office Hours after OEF. I actually let her sit during the proceedings.
It happens. A lot.
Having said that, this sub deal isn't any different. It'll work because its been preordained to succeed. The costs will be there, but that's just the breaks.
Had a Marine give birth three months after I got home from OIF 6-08.
Had a pregnant Marine stand before me at Office Hours after OEF. I actually let her sit during the proceedings.
It happens. A lot.
Having said that, this sub deal isn't any different. It'll work because its been preordained to succeed. The costs will be there, but that's just the breaks.
Does it matter? You can't operate based on what should be happening, or what everyone should be doing.
