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Woman + Subs

desertoasis

Something witty.
None
Contributor
I wonder how that will go. I'm all for it if they can make it work, but it seems to me that it would be a logistical nightmare, or at least force people to shed the boundaries of privacy that surface crews have.

Who knows, maybe it will all work out just fine.
 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Huh. I'll believe it when it happens. Gender politics aside, it'd be tough to refit the fast-attacks with seperate berthing and heads. Boomers/SSGNs have some more room to work with.
 

e6bflyer

Used to Care
pilot
I don't think it will ever happen and hope that it doesn't. There are some places women just don't belong, and subs are one of them.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
I'm gonna threadjack this for a minute. Any time I hear someone beating the retention drum, I think of how often I hear about how the military is supposedly detached from society because so few people in the general population have served in the military. Well if everyone who joins up "stays in for 20" then we'll have even fewer vets in our country, soooo that's why I think retention for retention's sake is a narrow-minded objective. (Yeah, I "get" that it costs money to train people for the job and the concept of a highly skilled all-volunteer force vs low skilled conscripts.) If somebody honorably serves out their 4, 5, 8, whatever commitment on a ship, airplane, submarine, desk, whatever and gets out to work somewhere else, raise children, whatever, then OK.

I do like that one of the notions in this article is a recruitment (vice retention) based approach to "manning." (Pardon the pun.)

Just MHO.
 

scoober78

(HCDAW)
pilot
Contributor
I don't think it will ever happen and hope that it doesn't. There are some places women just don't belong, and subs are one of them.
Patently ridiculous. Period.

Continuing to ask the question "if" and not asking the question "what will this look like" is foolish, just as it was foolish to ask whether women would be allowed on combat surface ships, combat aircraft...just as it was foolish to ask whether blacks would be allowed to be anything other than stewards...just as it was ridiculous....

Come on. Challenges? Absolutely. Don't belong? Unconscionable.
 

Swanee

Self aware since 2014
pilot
Contributor
A good friend of mine is a prior nuke turned E-2 NFO. She spent pretty much all of her enlisted time as an instructor, teaching how to run the back half of a sub. She seemed to think that she could handle herself with the guys just fine.

Do we really need separate berthings and heads?! How about a curtain and a lock on the hatch?
 

Pags

Pope of Chili Town
pilot
I wouldn't be surprised if it did happen, all in the name of diversity of course.

May god have mercy on the first women to go on board the subs.
 

phrogdriver

More humble than you would understand
pilot
Super Moderator
Separate heads? No. Separate berthing? Absolutely.

Obviously physical strength isn't an issue here, as it would be in say, SEALS. I mean, have you looked at any submariners lately?

However, equating this with racial equality is silly. There are actual logistical concerns here. Is the potential gain in quality people worth the money and effort to integrate these boats?
 

JTS11

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Patently ridiculous. Period.

Continuing to ask the question "if" and not asking the question "what will this look like" is foolish, just as it was foolish to ask whether women would be allowed on combat surface ships, combat aircraft...just as it was foolish to ask whether blacks would be allowed to be anything other than stewards...just as it was ridiculous....

Come on. Challenges? Absolutely. Don't belong? Unconscionable.
Let's also stop the discrimination with regards to the selective service sign-up. Women should be allowed to register for the draft. Then we will all be truly equal, and we will have a more perfect union.
 

KBayDog

Well-Known Member
Let's also stop the discrimination with regards to the selective service sign-up. Women should be allowed to register for the draft. Then we will all be truly equal, and we will have a more perfect union.
Let's not stop there! I'm sick and tired of the discrimination that exists in sports. Why should females have their own leagues?

Men should be allowed to compete in the LPGA, WNBA, etc. Then, and only then, will we be equal.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
The article (and the OP) make it sound like this "change" is already in the works. All the article talks about was how CNO thinks it should change. He doesn't make that policy, and while he probably has the ear of those who do, I suspect he is much less likely to pursue such changes when he's not testifying in public before congress. IMO, he said he thinks it should change because that's the PC thing to say in a public forum, but it will result in no action to actually change the policy.

Brett
 

PropAddict

Now with even more awesome!
pilot
Contributor
Men should be allowed to compete in the LPGA, WNBA, etc. Then, and only then, will we be equal.
No way, the money is wayyy better in the PGA and NBA, etc. :D

Break, break.

Back on topic: I doubt it will be as tough as it all sounds. It's still going to be a volunteer community, and there are many women who just "want to be submariners." They'll have no issue with coed heads, or the close quarters berthing. Just watch. Think GI Jane, just a little chunkier, dorkier, and with hair.:eek::D

Heck, women have been going down on that deep submergence research vessel for years, with no ill-effects. The big issue is the entrenched mentality of the community. My sub cruise led me to believe that subs are essentially a floating frat house, just, you know, without the alcohol. Heck, during one of the big PC-crackdowns at USN, I remember ADM Leidig telling us that the only place it was acceptable to utter the word "WUBA" was in a sub under the sea. Sub life sucks. Having to mind one's p's and Q's because there is mixed company aboard, well, it could only make it that much worse.
 

scoolbubba

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Heck, during one of the big PC-crackdowns at USN, I remember ADM Leidig telling us that the only place it was acceptable to utter the word "WUBA" was in a sub under the sea.
So you're saying mando PT at 30 is NOT the place to call out WUBA and Lobsters left and right? Dammit. Sensitivity training here I come.
 
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