Why are you Leaving?

[RHINOWSO]

Look, slight thread jack here based off my previous post.

I'm not one of those hawkeye fos who whines about equality but my question is still there: why are almost all the CAGs fighter guys? Being a CAG less to do with fighter tactics (which I've already stated that most CAGs I have seen ..their knowledge is outdated) and more with being a manager of assets. So why does it seem to matter what carrier based aircraft you fly? It seems like it's becoming a good old boys network, much like there's a rise in hawkeye fos commanding carriers.

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?

The problem in today's military is we have too many managers and not enough leaders. Leaders lead by doing, preferably from or near the front.

I don't know much about Hawkeying, but as long as I know what you want your cycle times to be, where you need to be stationed to support our mission, and you make sure that L16 is bitching good, it's pretty much covered.

Yes of course there is always more, but that covers the bases.

 

[BigRed389]

How long has it been since you've been hands on with that kind of thing?

Depends on what "that kind of thing" is.

Generally operational stuff? About 2 years.
Doing carrier or aviation shit? See my pin.
Interacting directly with CCSG? Also never.

My point is that something like that should be pretty easily snuffed out by CAG (or whoever the CSG Cdr trusts for aviation advice) leaning over and diplomatically saying "Donny you're out of your element." I've seen O-6's and Flags who were dicks...but none were what I would call stupid, and that sounds like a recipe to end up on the cover of Navy Times if things go south. Again, never worked with CSG Flags or O-6's, but in theory that's where the best/brightest go...
*O-5 is a different story, but there have been far more of those.

 

[hummerhole]

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?

The problem in today's military is we have too many managers and not enough leaders. Leaders lead by doing, preferably from or near the front.

I don't know much about Hawkeying, but as long as I know what you want your cycle times to be, where you need to be stationed to support our mission, and you make sure that L16 is bitching good, it's pretty much covered.

Yes of course there is always more, but that covers the bases.

Oh yeah, let's start a pissing contest. I'll play.

First of all, thanks for the lesson on warfare commanders. Hey guess what? I've been to the big boat too!

"Hawkeyeing", as you put it, requires that we have an encompassing view of the air wing, something you don't have and obviously don't care about: "I know what you want your cycle times to be, where you need to be stationed to support our mission, and you make sure that L16 is bitching good" - awesome professional comments right there. I could cite multiple examples on how many times we've saved y'all (especially the two seat squadrons, weird) from doing or saying something stupid. But I'm not going to argue any of that, because you and I both know I'm right.

Here's my point...Why would I want someone like you as a CAG if you don't give a shit about the rest of the airwing? Just because you know a few things about "blowing shit up"?

Another thing, is that you somehow believe that strike warfare ONLY involves "blowing shit up". You and I both know there is A TON more moving parts than just dropping ordnance. That's just like saying you know more than the JTAC about blowing shit up because you're in the plane when the pilot drops the bomb. Or even better, how about saying "what do you know about blowing shit up if your not even actually doing it because your pilot is and you're just there"? See how stupid and ridiculous that sounds? (by the way, thats how you sound when you talk about my community..ignorant and unprofessional)

I'll re-iterate my point…why would I want someone like you as a CAG if you don't give a shit about the rest of the airwing?

 

[defiant85]

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?

The problem in today's military is we have too many managers and not enough leaders. Leaders lead by doing, preferably from or near the front.

I don't know much about Hawkeying, but as long as I know what you want your cycle times to be, where you need to be stationed to support our mission, and you make sure that L16 is bitching good, it's pretty much covered.

Yes of course there is always more, but that covers the bases.

I typically just lurk on the site, but this response is too much. The only thing you said that you have any business speaking about is the fact you don't know much about hawkeying as that is readily apparent. It's one thing to pontificate your opinions on Rhino things, but you should probably simmer on down when speaking about anything else.

 

[Recovering LSO]

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?

The problem in today's military is we have too many managers and not enough leaders. Leaders lead by doing, preferably from or near the front.

I don't know much about Hawkeying, but as long as I know what you want your cycle times to be, where you need to be stationed to support our mission, and you make sure that L16 is bitching good, it's pretty much covered.

Yes of course there is always more, but that covers the bases.

And what do you know about landing a jet on a ship? Nothing but what you've observed, seen, and been told; but if you decided to sit down and have a conversation about it, you could probably do it, yeah?

The Hawkeye guy doesn't need to know how to weaponeer YOUR weapon. He needs to understand how your aircraft and capabilities fit into the overall strike package mission.

I'm more curious what Hawkeye or helo dude ball dragged your coffee mug?

 

[BusyBee604]

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?.

With that condescnding attitude, I wouldn't want you as my CAG!
BzB

 

[brownshoe]

With that condescnding attitude, I wouldn't want you as my CAG!
BzB

My how times have changed. Aren't we all supposed to be in this together?

Good to see you active again, Hugh.

 

[picklesuit]

With that condescnding attitude, I wouldn't want you as my CAG!
BzB

Shit just got real...

 

[RHINOWSO]

I could cite multiple examples on how many times we've saved y'all (especially the two seat squadrons, weird) from doing or saying something stupid. But I'm not going to argue any of that, because you and I both know I'm right.

Ok, sure...

And your JTAC comment actually proves my point and your lack of experience there. I wonder why a large majority of JTACs will ask the plane what bomb / tactic would be most effective for the desired effects? Hmmm... gee, I wonder...

Thanks, its not always so easy.

I'm more curious what Hawkeye or helo dude ball dragged your coffee mug?

Lol, none. I guess having 'thick skin' isn't as common in certain communities.

Also interesting how people can't separate war-fighting from administrivia and getting a shot a climbing the corporate ladder, which we all know is what the CAG fight is about (communities getting stars).

But in the interest of good will, I'll ask...

 

[nittany03]

words

Lol, none. I guess having 'thick skin' isn't as common in certain communities.

Wow, so when you roll in hot on someone, it's "productive discussion," but when someone offers a counterpoint, it's "thin skin." Umm . . . ok.

The entire airwing needs to be firing on all cylinders to get those bombs on target. Whoever pickles the ordnance in the end. You're already halfway to the truth when you say that you "don't know much about Hawkeyeing." Yet guess what? I don't know much about Hawkeyeing or Horneting as a VAQ guy either. Though I have spent an inordinate amount of time briefing Hornet guys over and over how to correctly employ a weapon off their own damn jet, but I digress. The point is anyone from any community is inherently only a SME for some things.

If VAW fongs it away, someone gets schwacked by a PL-12. If VAQ fongs it away, someone gets tagged by an SA-10. If HSC fongs it away, you rot in a jail cell eating fish heads in someone else's pajamas.

CAG needs to be able to supervise all these things. I don't care what community CAG comes from; he or she will always have a strong suit and a weak suit. But hopefully, we've picked someone who, by virtue of being smart, cruising many many times as a JO, DH, XO, and CO, has worked with the larger TACAIR picture enough to learn what they need to know about the entire airwing. And to have the professionalism to rely on their COs and XOs, as well as a CAG staff which is manned by most if not every T/M/S in the airwing. Dick-measuring contests not required.

 

[Beans]

If VAW fongs it away, someone gets schwacked by a PL-12. If VAQ fongs it away, someone gets tagged by an SA-10. If HSC fongs it away, you rot in a jail cell eating fish heads in someone else's pajamas.

... and if HSM fongs it away, surprise swim call for all hands!

 

[Brett327]

I love swim call.

P.S. RhinoWSO, your parochial attitude diminishes some of the legitimately good points you've brought up in this thread. You've lost me for good.

 

[robav8r]

In short, he's the strike warfare commander. What do you as a Hawkeye guy know about blowing shit up?

The problem in today's military is we have too many managers and not enough leaders. Leaders lead by doing, preferably from or near the front.

Come on dude, regardless of your platform or level of experience, you're starting to sound pretty unprofessional for a NA/NFO.

Honest question: where in doctrine does it say that CAG "shall/should/will" be the strike lead during the various phases of a campaign ???

 

[hummerhole]

Ok, sure...

And your JTAC comment actually proves my point and your lack of experience there. I wonder why a large majority of JTACs will ask the plane what bomb / tactic would be most effective for the desired effects? Hmmm... gee, I wonder...

Thanks, its not always so easy.


Lol, none. I guess having 'thick skin' isn't as common in certain communities.

Also interesting how people can't separate war-fighting from administrivia and getting a shot a climbing the corporate ladder, which we all know is what the CAG fight is about (communities getting stars).

But in the interest of good will, I'll ask...

So instead of responding to the points I made, your response is that I don't have a thick skin. Roger. You have a horrible case of "talking out of your ass". Thank god most hornet guys I've worked with he don't have your poor attitude and sense of entitlement.

You are part of the problem. Or you WERE. I saw from your profile that you are no longer active duty, and haven't been for quite some time. Good, the system actually worked. I just hope you haven't been an instructor in Pensacola these last couple of years, for fear that you may have been spreading your bullshit to our young SNFOs.

 

[Recovering LSO]

I guess having 'thick skin' isn't as common in certain communities.

And since we're throwing around baseless generalities... Being a dick is more common in some communities than others.

But in the interest of good will, I'll ask...

Yeah dude, we can all get a long. Keep this in mind though: this place is runs like a ready room, and regardless of how important you believe yourself to be, you're a new guy here. What would you have thought of a new guy rolling into you last ready room and telling everyone how f'ed up they were? It wouldn't matter if some of his comments were on target or not. Like Brett and others have mentioned, you've made some decent points, but ease up on the douche and you might find your arguments more effective.