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The Great Milestone Thread (1000 traps club + Carrier milestones)
- Thread starter The Chief
- Start date
He did get the traps...I was there.....1000 Trap Club and he did it when everyone was done. He had the pattern to himself....turn downwind immediately vice the stud 1nm upwind and then turn. Plus, I don't think he had any problems with boltering. He is a solid all-around guy who remembers names, says hi all the time and introduces himself to everyone by his first name.
99% of the time orange and white don't mix with grey jets (I think it is against AIRLANT instructions?), unless strings (the A in FWA) are pulled.
Don't let allegiance get in the way of calling a spade a spade.
Let the LSO's or the OIC utilize whatever deck time is remains. LSO's who should be the kung fu masters of all things "boat" should be using the traps to aid in passing on the torch to the next generation. In an era of economics per "X", there is way more bang for the buck getting a JO with instructional sorties to teach a trap than some self seeker a plaque and a line in the program in the Tailhook program booklet.
I'll guarantee someone at the boat det wanted to go back and bag and was bumped, on more than one boat det.:icon_wink
Don't let allegiance get in the way of calling a spade a spade.
Let the LSO's or the OIC utilize whatever deck time is remains. LSO's who should be the kung fu masters of all things "boat" should be using the traps to aid in passing on the torch to the next generation. In an era of economics per "X", there is way more bang for the buck getting a JO with instructional sorties to teach a trap than some self seeker a plaque and a line in the program in the Tailhook program booklet.
I'll guarantee someone at the boat det wanted to go back and bag and was bumped, on more than one boat det.:icon_wink
With all due respect Sir, you throw alot of stones thinking a disclaimer is going to make you look like something other than a douchebag. (Disclaimer:By saying With all due respect, you can pretty much say anything, right?)
My Dad had several fleet tours in Phantoms and Tomcats and was the skipper of a VT in Kingsville about 20 years ago. He ended up with something like 975 traps.... I don't think it would have ever occured to him to bump a stud or IP to get that magic 1000.
I think I have 232 to hit the 1000 box lunch club!
Sour grapes anyone?
For what it's worth, the captain in question lead me to the break at the boat for my first time, so I can't help but look up to him. I thought he was a good instructor and the kind of senior leadership we could use more of in the Navy. I'm glad he got his 1000th trap. Only 974 to go for me...
Hell yeah, sir, my classmates and IP's love that patch (the COD guys don't quite get it though)
No strings or abuse at all. I fly with orange and white jets during every CNATRA det. It's just who is flying the jets that is the issue. If it's students, you can't mix. If it's instructors/winged guys, then party on.
As for the OP question- let it go. I have seen quite a few pilots reach the 1000 trap point, And I've donated some CQ time to them. They are all people who were leaders and someone to look up too. If we (big Navy) cut off post command Officers from flying at the boat, who would the JO's have to look up too? You can bag next time...
RANT ALERT
Gee, there's so much to work with here...where do I begin?
"I'm not an NFO hater, but..." That sounds as sincere as "I'm not a racist, but..." Guess what? If you weren't, you wouldn't feel the need to disclaim.
What makes you think JOs "deserve" traps? They may need them more to gain experience, and leadership may think JOs need them for retention, but I don't see where they "deserve" Jack.
Many moons ago I flew with the Carrier Group Commander (1-star). Not sure why you don't think his traps count. Does he incur less risk than any other Naval Aviator by virtue of his rank? Flying every few days gave him a different perspective on the readiness and capability of the ship / air wing team. If anyone "deserved" to get out of the office for the day and log a 2.2 and a trap, it ought to be the Old Man, in my opinion.
As for the "NFOs don't rate traps" diatribe, that's a bunch of crap. Granted, they should call them something else, like "trips."
Just remember, on your worst pass behind the boat in the fleet in the Tomcat, whether it was you who was AFU, or the Boat, or the weather, or just "because," there was some poor SOB riding shotgun. He / She may have been nothing but 200# of dead weight, or he / she might have been the only thing that helped you from becoming a statistic that flight. Regardless, they earned the recognition.
Finally, while one can argue that as a Naval Aviator progresses, he / she gains experience such that each trap may become less of a personal challenge (something I don't believe as each trap is probably a unique event), the lowly NFO often finds that as his / her experience increases, they get the pleasure of flying with Shakey Jake, or FUBAR, or a cast of other marginal pilots who need some special attention to avoid becoming a statistic or being sent home.
In my short flying career before I left active duty I got to fly with:
- CAGs who didn't know what / where most of the switches were.
- DCAGs who when in a pinch would want to do Bold Face EPs for their primary aircraft, instead of the one they were in.
- Flag officers whose vision was shot.
- Foreign Exchange pilots who had 3000+ hours in F-104s, Tornados, etc, but who had a real hard time w/ meatball, lineup, AoA.
- CAG Paddles (Hawkeye guy) who wanted to cross train in the A-6E, and got overwhelmed on a varsity day, and had to learn waveoff technique, bingo profile, and in extremis first time ever tanking off an S-3, all in one flight, and then land on the boat. (No slight on the E-2C bubbas - a jet guy put in a Hawkeye would have been set up for failure that day as well).
- The RAG student pilot who attrited the first time at the boat and now you need to be NFO, co-pilot, cheerleader, and child psychologist so he can get the gremlins out of his head.
How magnanimous of you to allow an NFO to get credit for a night trap if he is fortunate enough to get a seat with a view. Before you pontificate any further, perhaps you might want to volunteer for an E-2C NFO appreciation ride back in the tunnel on a night trap. I've known the names of "Moles" lost at sea in two different Hawkeye bolter mishaps where the plane went off the angle into the great unknown...
Give me a break.
End of rant.
Gooooood god pass the KOOOOL-AID, my mug is empty.
Points on the "trips", very nice. I'll buy beer at the reunion when they put that on the plaque.
If senior leadership is leading warfighters into country, bag away. If senior leadership is riding clown jets every det burning gas to get an arbitrary patch, plaque and pat on the back, does that deserve respect? I'll speak for the paddles (the JO's who I obviously believe deserve those traps) of my era: resounding NO. The dudes on the flight deck would rather be in their racks, paddles would rather be on the cod on the way home or in someones back seat on their way to a frosty oat soda.
1000 traps grey fleet airplane deems respect. Getting your last 200 for a thousand on a shore tour in a clownjet doesn't in my opinion. Thats the point of the question starting this thread...
Im off the riding/flying thing, we won't collectivelly change our opinions ever.
Points on the "trips", very nice. I'll buy beer at the reunion when they put that on the plaque.
If senior leadership is leading warfighters into country, bag away. If senior leadership is riding clown jets every det burning gas to get an arbitrary patch, plaque and pat on the back, does that deserve respect? I'll speak for the paddles (the JO's who I obviously believe deserve those traps) of my era: resounding NO. The dudes on the flight deck would rather be in their racks, paddles would rather be on the cod on the way home or in someones back seat on their way to a frosty oat soda.
1000 traps grey fleet airplane deems respect. Getting your last 200 for a thousand on a shore tour in a clownjet doesn't in my opinion. Thats the point of the question starting this thread...
Im off the riding/flying thing, we won't collectivelly change our opinions ever.
FormerRecruitingGuru
Making Recruiting Great Again
Maybe its time to close this thread? Seems to be going downhill now.