What are some good pilot B- billets?

[phrogdriver]

There's a FAO/RAO board every year. If you already have a strong language background, you'd be in a very good position. It doesn't matter what your primary MOS is; once you're a FAO/RAO, your B-billet assignment will depend on your country/region specialty. If you want to do it, it SHOULD be your first B-billet. After you're a specialist, most of your B tours for the rest of your time in the Corps will be as a FAO/RAO.

To switch gears, the idea that Flight School IP is not good for your career is overblown. It's career NEUTRAL. In the Navy, it's considered much more important to be a FRS IP. I haven't noticed any difference as far as the Corps is concerned. Now, you have to be aggressive while you're an IP. Get your PME done, and/or work on a master's part-time.

People dump on being an IP career wise, yet fail to offer a better alternative. FAC is out there, but that's a 1 year job. Unless your sqdn gave it to you just to get you out of their hair for a year, you still will need to go to a school or another B-billet anyway. EWS--you can do it via the mail; why spend a year of your life there? OSO--not career enhancing. FRS IP--why spend time buzzing around in the pattern with the same aircraft you were flying tactically in the fleet, with not much more flt time? Believe it or not HMX-1 is generally considered a bad career move.

MAWTS-1 IP is definitely a big deal if you can get it. Staff jobs at HQMC can be a good career deal, if you don't mind stabbing yourself in the nuts on a daily basis. There aren't too many of those for capts.

If someone comes up with the company-grade career holy grail, I'm listening. The point I'm slowly making is this. Try for jobs that you'll enjoy. Those are usually the ones you'll do well in. Alternate fleet and non-fleet. Spend time in the fleet in every rank. Things will work out all right. Even if you don't make Col, you'll have a lot of good experiences that you can't get in many places other than the military.

 

[Q-ball]

Don't forget the inter-service exchange programs that are available. For example you can go from Marine CH-53's to flying Air Force Spec Ops MH-53 pavelows for a couple of years.


Q

 

[towbubba]

Last question about FAC or B-billets from me but can you ship over on a FAC tour (stay there) for another year and then return to the fleet? How do Cobras deploy, is it a garanteed 2 deployments/4 years to get "victor coded". And I have two Westpacs already (enlisted) does that mean I have an overseas control date? Thanks to phrogdriver I appreciate your timely response, sir.

 

[Skid27]

Number of deployments and OCD are no longer lim factor in determining if you are a mover. 4 years minimum before moving. I haven't heard of victor codes being assigned to personnel, just deploying units so can't help you on that one. It would be up the monitor to let you extend as a FAC. Would mean having to refresh at FRS. Only folks I have seen do that were guys who didn't want to fly anymore.

 

[Clux4]

Don't forget the inter-service exchange programs that are available. For example you can go from Marine CH-53's to flying Air Force Spec Ops MH-53 pavelows for a couple of years.


Q

I know the whole career development issue has been touched, but will this hurt in anyway as far as an inter-service exchange program. How easy do you get this slots.


Do you think the Marine Corps should make their FACs' from Warrant Officers?

 

[Rainman]

Dude, I've never been a FAC. I've also never poked myself in the eye repeatedly with a sharp stick, yet still feel qualified to advise others on the relative merits of ocular-plant contact, or lack thereof.

Postgraduate school is good, but you have to take a "payback" tour, usually 3 yrs, meaning 2 yrs school+3 yrs payback=5 yrs out of the cockpit.

LMAO. . good stuff phrog. I spoke with a marine that did the Special Education Program and he's saying 2 year payback tours are common AND they are starting to let Marines do the payback tour after a second fleet tour. . Just not getting enough applicants because, like you said, it was 5 years out. . .too long.

Are there any other "short" b billets . .say 2 yrs or less that anyone can think of?

Also, thoughts on TPS (with or w/o grad school). .I would assume that would be career enhancing.

Also, if one does an exchange tour, either with Brits (or other countries), Air Force, or whatever. . is that a B billet? So can one go from fleet squadron to exchange squadron right back to fleet squadron (after FRS stop)?

 

[jarhead]

don't know if you've seen it but attached at the bottom of this post is the Billet list of FY 05 for fixed wing Captains in .doc format. it'll give you an idea of what is typically out there for fixed wing Capts after their first tour. from what i gather, TPS is career enhancing for fixed wing pilots; i'm not sure about exchange fixed wing flying billets. my understanding is that both TPS & fixed wing exchange tours are usually given to senior Captains & junior Majors. you can find more info at the fixed wing Captain monitors webpage, but i would recommend not bugging him (e-mail) until you've been in the fleet over a year ...

the chance for fixed wing guys to stay in a flying billet their 8 years of contract is very slim. it might be possible but remember that the fixed wing Captains monitor is also a fixed wing pilot himself and knows the ropes ... if he's gonna get screwed for 2-3 years out of the cockpit, he's not going to let another pilot slide by by letting him go 3 or 4 years during his first tour in the fleet, then let him go fly as an IP in the RAG or VT's for 3 years, then let him come back to the fleet to fly another 3 or 4 years, just doesn't happen ... maybe in the Helo world, but not fixed wing. but you'll find guys who will push 4 years in the fleet, then go do a year as a FAC or at EWS, then come straight back to the fleet for another 3 or 4 years (FACs & EWS guys are given #1 priority with orders). you'll pick up Major during your second fleet tour, after that, you'll either get out of the Corps or it's off to either a Pentagon tour or some Joint tour, for 2-3 years. then back to the fleet for your department head tour, i.e. AMO, OPSO, XO, etc. after that, you're pretty much done with flying unless you come back as a sqd Skipper.

hell right now, first tour Captains with 2 years on station have a huge B/E on their noggin's for 6-8 month Individual Augment tours to Iraq and other cozy Middle East & Horn of Africa locations ... literally guys coming into work and being told to goto supply & draw their gear & pack their bags, it happened to two guys in my sqd, one three weeks ago & the other one just this past week (we've lost 4 pilots in all to IA tours this summer) ... people want to know why the Corps is "hurting" for fixed wing guys, this is one of the main reasons ...

s/f

LMAO. . good stuff phrog. I spoke with a marine that did the Special Education Program and he's saying 2 year payback tours are common AND they are starting to let Marines do the payback tour after a second fleet tour. . Just not getting enough applicants because, like you said, it was 5 years out. . .too long.

Are there any other "short" b billets . .say 2 yrs or less that anyone can think of?

Also, thoughts on TPS (with or w/o grad school). .I would assume that would be career enhancing.

Also, if one does an exchange tour, either with Brits (or other countries), Air Force, or whatever. . is that a B billet? So can one go from fleet squadron to exchange squadron right back to fleet squadron (after FRS stop)?

 

[N866DA]

Okay, I know the B-billet thing has been discussed to death, but I haven't been able to find the answer to this question anywhere....

The officers that are assigned to the companies of ceremonial marchers at 8th and I... are those strictly infantry guys or are those billets available to aviators as B-billets?

 

[jwperkns]

B-Billets

This might sound dumb but what does FAC stand for? And what does it entail?

 

[skidkid]

Forward Air controller- and one of the most rewarding though sometimes painful jobs you can do. You call air support in for infantry and tanks and basically serve as an aviation expert to a ground unit. It does have some career enhancing qualities and sonetimes you get a good deal on the back side others not. Right now with the state of teh world there are no non-deploying FAC tours and once you have the MOS you mgiht find yourself on the short list to get yanked out of a flying job to round out a war bound unit.
As far as career stuff, do what you think you will enjoy and let the career stuff take care of itself jsut do a good job. If you choose billets only becasue you think you will be a squadron CO you may find yourself miserable burned out and still not a CO. I recomend the FAC experience but not for more than a year not flying and getting rained on is a bad combination for any longer. Right now we are so short of pilots that you can almost write your own ticket but heaven forbid they give rotor guys a good signing bonus (OK enough bitterness, I try to keep that away from the youngsters) If anyone wants to talk FAC stuff PM me I had a great time not everyone does though like everyhting else it depends on the people.
off cold

 

[46Driver]

Forward Air controller- and one of the most rewarding though sometimes painful jobs you can do. You call air support in for infantry and tanks and basically serve as an aviation expert to a ground unit. It does have some career enhancing qualities and sonetimes you get a good deal on the back side others not. Right now with the state of teh world there are no non-deploying FAC tours and once you have the MOS you mgiht find yourself on the short list to get yanked out of a flying job to round out a war bound unit.
As far as career stuff, do what you think you will enjoy and let the career stuff take care of itself jsut do a good job. If you choose billets only becasue you think you will be a squadron CO you may find yourself miserable burned out and still not a CO. I recomend the FAC experience but not for more than a year not flying and getting rained on is a bad combination for any longer. Right now we are so short of pilots that you can almost write your own ticket but heaven forbid they give rotor guys a good signing bonus (OK enough bitterness, I try to keep that away from the youngsters) If anyone wants to talk FAC stuff PM me I had a great time not everyone does though like everyhting else it depends on the people.
off cold

Very well said - enjoy your time in, do the best job you can, and let your career stuff take care of itself. If you are miserable in taking billets because you are trying to punch your ticket, something is wrong.

 

[phrogdriver]

Clux4--warrants in the Corps are technical guys--former NCOs who are specialists in such things as avionics, NBC, etc. I guess you could establish a special FAC career path, but it would probably be more efficient to allow experienced NCOs in fields like artillery to be FACs to augment or replace pilots in the role.

 

[Clux4]

Don't you think that will be too much reponsibility on the shoulders of an NCO. I mean, it can be very difficult to hold some of these NCO's accountable sometimes. Like you said, they can have Artillery warrant officers who are basically tasked with FAC duties. Kind of in the situation of Range Officers. I don't think there are any shortages of Warrant Officers right now in the Marine Corps.

 

[phrogdriver]

I didn't say "artillery WOs." I said that experienced Arty NCOs could be FACs. It's not too much responsibility for an NCO. It's just a matter of training. SOCOM enlisted are calling in air on a regular basis. Train the skill and let them do the bulk of the FAC duties. Keep an Air Officer pilot-type at battalion to coordinate lift and so-forth, but free up pilots to fly.

 

[Clux4]

I did not know SOCOM used the enlisted on a regular basis. I definitely agree with any policy that can put more pilots in the air.
Who know why they have things this way. I guess they have to have some B-billet to put pilots.