• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

War with Iraq Continued

Status
Not open for further replies.

EA-6B1

PLC Jrs 1st Inc. Kilo-3
This is like a Military Soap Opera. I can see the title now... These are the "Days of our Lives arguing about Iraq." Just thought some people would like to laugh. Semper Fi.

Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men.
-Col.3:23-
 

kimphil

Registered User
One more thing, the last time I checked, Democrats were allowed to serve in the Marines. But since E5-B wife says I don't know what I'm talking about, I'll defer to her judgement on that.

And NEWS FLASH, some Democrats even make good Marines! There's one whose name escapes me at this moment...wait...I think his name...is John Glenn, former Senator for Ohio (Democrat). He was a Marine aviator in Korea, and first man to orbit the earth. If only he were a Republican, he would be perfect.

Trying to question my motivations about wanting to be a Marine based on my political affiliations is just un-American. You should really do some homework and come up with some legit arguments, not pander to emotional crap about how your family defends this country and personally insulting me.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

"What would Jesus drive?"

Duh. A truck -- Jesus was a carpenter.
 

davidsin

Registered User
I don't know if this is up to date, but I read in B0606 Marine Corps Leadership and Training handout givin at TBS on page B-16 under Professionalism that,

"Relations among all leaders--from corporal to general--should be based on honesty and frankness, regardless of disparity between grades. Until a commander has reached and stated a decision, each subordinate should consider it their duty to provide his honest, professional opinions even though these may be in disagreement with the senior's opinions. However, once the decision has been reached, juniors then must support it as if it were their own."

So questioning the opinions of seniors and having ones own opinion is not only acceptable in the Corps but expected.

-------------------------
Semper Fi
 

O-man

Registered User
Kimphile- You dont motivate me. I have smelled your type before and have no need for you. I dont know what your story is but I am going to just assume that your some officer, and in that case you may have heard this before- but for the love of chesty will you please nock the sand outa your Pus#Y?! E5Bwife had one hell of a good point- being that while the USA IS a democracy, the Corps sure as sh#t is not. Start acting like you wanna be here and stop getting your last little tib-bit in. O-man. 0311
 

e5b-wife

Registered User
Davidsin - Thanks for the clarification. I made my statements assuming the decision has been made. The assumption of course was wrong on my part. However, I never said you couldn't have an opinion, I just said you had to keep to yourself.
Kimphil - I'm not questioning your motivation based solely on your political opinions. I'm questioning your motivation because of the general feel I've gotten from a lot of your posts. And I will apologize for attacking you. I showed poor judgement, this was definitely not the proper place, for that matter I'm sure I could have been much more tactful. In all honesty I question your motivation because your ideals do not seem to be in line with the reasons that most people I've met want to join the Corps. Actually, I'm sincerely curious what makes you want to be a Marine and defend this country that we all so dearly love.
By the way, I never said that Democrats can't be Marines. Please, don't put words in my mouth. Yes, you are entitled to your opinion and you can say whatever you want about anyone or anything in this country but remember that we all can. As far as opinions in the Corps go, like Davidsin pointed out you have the right and duty to let your fellow leaders know your honest opinion but be prepared for a good portion of your peers and superiors to disagree with you, at which point you must suck it up. My husband or I may not always agree with orders that come down but you won't hear us complaining.
A lot of what I had to say to you was most definitely off the topic of the war with Iraq. As far as your opinions about the war go I'm not the happiest camper about the situation myself. I think it has the potential to cause us some major problems in the long run. However, I do believe it needs to be taken care of regardless of oil. You see we could potentially produce enough oil on our own to replace what we could lose from the Middle East but the green minded folks in this country just won't allow it. And good for them for their opinions and taking the initiative to get themselves heard. If Republicans could muster the same force I believe you Democrats would have some serious competition. Of course I'm neither Republican or Democrat so those destinctions don't mean much to me anyway. I'm being pretty general about all of this because most of it has already been said and there's no point in rehashing. I know that this war will happen and now it's just time to be prepared for it.
 

kimphil

Registered User
First of all, I am a civilian, not a Marine. So questioning "orders" when I'm not in the military chain of command is moot. Second, no one has the right to question my motivations for joining the USMC. They could be as simple as wanting adventure, like davidsin, or I could be a baby killer like O-Man. Or they could be more idealistic and personal motivations that aren't incompatible with my political beliefs.

What I have expressed here is my reservations as to why we are fighting in Iraq. I've made it clear there is misinformation coming from the Bush administration. I've not said one disparing thing about the military or the Marine Corps. I've also raised questions about American energy policy, our foreign policy, and our involvement in past wars. These issues aren't specific to this current President, to Republicans or to Democrats. So even if I were a Marine, raising questions about the absurdity of our energy policy, for example, (and our enoromous consumption of Middle East oil) doesn't come close to "questioning orders."

Making the leap that raising legit questions as a private citizen to willful disobedience of orders IF I'm a Marine is absurd.

PS -- O-Man, if you don't like my scent, close your damn mouth and you might not smell it. Don't make any assumptions about me, read my posts before you make anymore stupid comments.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

"What would Jesus drive?"

Duh. A truck -- Jesus was a carpenter.
 

O-man

Registered User
QUICK! some one hire Kimphil while he still knows everything! No seriously though- while I dont mind your duality and open minded view, I think your just taken with the finer points of the USMC- But I don't think your going to enjoy the culture that is the corps just as much that you (as I found out after re-reading you posts) have no idea about. and I don't want to hear about who you know and what they did- because there is a deference between understanding and KNowing. And that's ok, but you're all over the place with your nice little well chosen words and well-researched facts that you use to get people annoyed. Call a radio talk show or something- don't get all self-righteous here.
 

jason12

Registered User
Kimphil...get off the defensive standpoint i'm sure your input would be a little more appreciated, and from what i have read, no one questioned your motives, but instead asked a question. What's so wrong with that..? You say you want to be a Marine (you know the group of individuals who will not hesitate to bring to your attention what it is they do, and why the hell they do it) You want to be a Marine why...simple question...simple answer. I mean just to let you know, i doubt any Marine alive would ever think twice about telling you that he is in fact a Marine, nor would an individual dedicated to becoming one. I don't see the problem? Everyone in here listens to your political savvy bullsh@t yet you offer no one a chance to understand where you're coming from...You say you offer valid points to valid arguments, yet all you do in every one of your posts is tell everyone what you DIDN'T say in the latter argument.....As for the War in Iraq...remember you're a citizen not a Marine as you said..so what the hell does it matter what you think anyway?? Until you put a rifle in your hand and get a target in your sights the info you provide is as valid as all the other hippie anti-war idiots out there. I suggest you take your open minded crap out to california and hit the streets with a basket of dandelions and a beret on your head where it will be more appreciated.
 

davidsin

Registered User
haha...out of the 35,000,000 people here so far I never met a hippie in my life. But if I do, I wouldn’t mind sitting with him for a chat just to see his/her point of view.

Since Marine officers are a small group of people within a small group of people, I’m sure I’ll run into a lot of you guys in the future if I were to get past OCS, TBS etc.--looking forward to it actually. I bet it’s very reassuring to Philip Kim to know that he’s meeting a lot of friends before even getting to OCS. I’m sure everyone is eager to give you nice warm welcome Phil.

A lot of these marines are pretty cool people. You should try to understand their disposition, and you’ll realize that they’re a lot like one another. You know there’s a glue that binds them together. It’s called esprit de Corps. It’s an ethos that is very simple to understand yet hard to explain, and from the looks of it, you’re going against the grain every time you try to save yourself.

You should treat them as if one day your life will depend on them, and they’ll do the same to you regardless of your political views. Take some Initiative to get to know them. Use some Tact to defuse any quarrels. Be Enthusiastic when talking to them. And try to fit in by showing some Loyalty to the Corps. Heck might as well start now.

It’s not a science, and it does not require too much logic—just a bit of Courage and Integrity.

ps. O-man might not be the most eloquent individual, but he's Semper Fi do or die, and he loves the Corps.--far from a baby killer. You just misunderstand him--sorta like the trend you're setting with everyone else.


-------------------------
Semper Fi
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top