The Eyes have it - All things Vision-related

[exNavyOffRec]

Not to be pedantic, just to be clear: if you were within the limits, it wasn't a "waiver," right? The waiver is for people outside of the limits. It was just some kind of declaration/documentation?

Correct. As long as you fall in the limits, you do not need a waiver.

Plenty of people decide to get PRK/LASIK (which does warrant a very easy waiver) despite being in the limits bc they are close and fear eventually falling outside, they don’t want to wear corrective lenses in the plane or they just want better eyesight…..

If you had LASIK/PRK, you will need a waiver.
Waivers aren't a bad thing.
Bring ALL the paperwork related to the surgery when you go to your fight physical and docs will handle it from there.

I needed a waiver and my eyes were -2.75 no astigmatism. On my PQ letter it just says history of LASIK ….

The waiver thing for LASIK or PRK is from the past, it is no longer needed but all documents need to be submitted to ensure vision is stable and the person met pre surgery requirements.

(3) All forms of corneal surgery are
disqualifying except for PRK, LASEK, and LASIK.
Waivers are not required for members who have had
successful surgery if stable postoperative vision meets
the criteria of MANMED article 15-106 paragraph
(4)(d)(1) of this article and the following are met:

 

[iwrru]

The waiver thing for LASIK or PRK is from the past, it is no longer needed but all documents need to be submitted to ensure vision is stable and the person met pre surgery requirements.

(3) All forms of corneal surgery are
disqualifying except for PRK, LASEK, and LASIK.
Waivers are not required for members who have had
successful surgery if stable postoperative vision meets
the criteria of MANMED article 15-106 paragraph
(4)(d)(1) of this article and the following are met:

Thank you @exNavyOffRec for this clear and authoritative response. This is what I understood as well.

If your pre-operative vision was within certain parameters (and you can document it, of course) NO waiver is needed, as you said.

Rather than posting the relevant 51-page Navy medical file (if you want to view it, here it is), below is an image of the specific parameters which, if you fall within, would mean you need NO waiver.

• Yellow highlight means no waiver
• Red highlight means you'll need a waiver

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Thank you @exNavyOffRec for this clear and authoritative response. This is what I understood as well.

If your pre-operative vision was within certain parameters (and you can document it, of course) NO waiver is needed, as you said.

Rather than posting the relevant 51-page Navy medical file (if you want to view it, here it is), below is an image of the specific parameters which, if you fall within, would mean you need NO waiver.

• Yellow highlight means no waiver
• Red highlight means you'll need a waiver

View attachment 39538

You are looking at NAMI waiver guide which doesn't come into effect for 99% of the people that apply to OCS until after they are in OCS, the Navy Medical Manual is what applicants need to use as a guide.

This is a very common mistake and has resulted in applicants not understanding why they get a DQ from the USN or for a specific program when NAMI waiver guide says a waiver is possible but the medical manual says no.

 

[iwrru]

You are looking at NAMI waiver guide which doesn't come into effect for 99% of the people that apply to OCS until after they are in OCS, the Navy Medical Manual is what applicants need to use as a guide.

This is a very common mistake and has resulted in applicants not understanding why they get a DQ from the USN or for a specific program when NAMI waiver guide says a waiver is possible but the medical manual says no.

Thanks for the additional info. I see a post of yours from March of this year on this topic.

Would this link be the correct source? i.e. the Navy Medical Manual (NAVMED P-117), specifically Chapter 15 sections 32, 34 and 36?

15-32 "Introduction to Physical Standards"

The following list of disqualifying physical and medical conditions is organized generally by organ system and from the head down. If an applicant currently or by history (as appropriate) has none of these conditions then he or she will be found “physically qualified.”

15-34 "Eyes"

3. Cornea

(b) [...] Refractive surgery performed with an eximer laser, including but not limited to photorefractive keratectomy (commonly known as PRK) [...] and laser-assisted in-situ keratomileusis (commonly know as LASIK) is disqualifying if any of the following conditions are met:

(1) Pre-surgical refractive error in either eye exceeds the standards for the program sought (i.e., +/- 8.00 diopters for enlistment, commission, and programs leading to a commission).

(2) Less than 6 months has passed since the last refractive or augmenting procedure and the time of the evaluation.

(3) There is currently a continuing need to ophthalmic medications or treatment.

(4) Post-surgical refraction in each eye is not considered stable as demonstrated by two separate refractions obtained at least 1 month apart differing by more than +/-0.50 diopters for spherical correction and/or more than +/-0.25 diopters for cylinder correction.

(5) Post-surgical refraction in each eye has not been measured at least one time 3 months or longer after the most recent refractive or augmenting procedure.

15-36 "Vision - Commission and Programs Leading to a Commission"

2. For Entry into a Program Leading to a Commission in the Navy Unrestricted Line

(b) Current spherical refractive error [hyperopia (367.0), myopia (367.1)] or history of spherical refractive error prior to any refractive surgery of worse than -8.00 or +8.00 diopters is disqualifying.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Thanks for the additional info. I see a post of yours from March of this year on this topic.

Would this link be the correct source? i.e. the Navy Medical Manual (NAVMED P-117), specifically Chapter 15 sections 32, 34 and 36?

15-32 "Introduction to Physical Standards"

The following list of disqualifying physical and medical conditions is organized generally by organ system and from the head down. If an applicant currently or by history (as appropriate) has none of these conditions then he or she will be found “physically qualified.”

15-34 "Eyes"

3. Cornea

(b) [...] Refractive surgery performed with an eximer laser, including but not limited to photorefractive keratectomy (commonly known as PRK) [...] and laser-assisted in-situ keratomileusis (commonly know as LASIK) is disqualifying if any of the following conditions are met:

(1) Pre-surgical refractive error in either eye exceeds the standards for the program sought (i.e., +/- 8.00 diopters for enlistment, commission, and programs leading to a commission).

(2) Less than 6 months has passed since the last refractive or augmenting procedure and the time of the evaluation.

(3) There is currently a continuing need to ophthalmic medications or treatment.

(4) Post-surgical refraction in each eye is not considered stable as demonstrated by two separate refractions obtained at least 1 month apart differing by more than +/-0.50 diopters for spherical correction and/or more than +/-0.25 diopters for cylinder correction.

(5) Post-surgical refraction in each eye has not been measured at least one time 3 months or longer after the most recent refractive or augmenting procedure.

15-36 "Vision - Commission and Programs Leading to a Commission"

2. For Entry into a Program Leading to a Commission in the Navy Unrestricted Line

(b) Current spherical refractive error [hyperopia (367.0), myopia (367.1)] or history of spherical refractive error prior to any refractive surgery of worse than -8.00 or +8.00 diopters is disqualifying.

yes, so essentially documents are submitted to confirm a person doesn't meet the DQ parameters as opposed to submitting to get a waiver.

 

[MotorCookie]

You are looking at NAMI waiver guide which doesn't come into effect for 99% of the people that apply to OCS until after they are in OCS, the Navy Medical Manual is what applicants need to use as a guide.

This is a very common mistake and has resulted in applicants not understanding why they get a DQ from the USN or for a specific program when NAMI waiver guide says a waiver is possible but the medical manual says no.

Uh oh. According to the Navy Medical Manual I am a DQ but the NAMI Waiver Guide says I'm not. Since I am already accepted into OCS, only the NAMI Waiver Guide applies to me?

 

[ccm02]

Astigmatism waiver for SNA applicant?
I noticed on the NAMI SNA applicant standards they state astigmatism no greater than -1.00 diopters. My right eye has an astigmatism of -1.50 and my left is -1.00. Would my right eyes astigmatism be waiverable or is it NPQ?

 

[Mouselovr]

Astigmatism waiver for SNA applicant?
I noticed on the NAMI SNA applicant standards they state astigmatism no greater than -1.00 diopters. My right eye has an astigmatism of -1.50 and my left is -1.00. Would my right eyes astigmatism be waiverable or is it NPQ?

Not the most analytical answer bc I'm not an eye doc, but I'm a qualified SNA and my "bad" eye is -1.25.
I didn't need waivers.

I'm just required to wear dorky (super cool) corrective lenses in the plane.

Bring the paperwork to an eye doc and have them look at you then compare to the NAMI numbers.

 

[ccm02]

Not the most analytical answer bc I'm not an eye doc, but I'm a qualified SNA and my "bad" eye is -1.25.
I didn't need waivers.

I'm just required to wear dorky (super cool) corrective lenses in the plane.

Bring the paperwork to an eye doc and have them look at you then compare to the NAMI numbers.

They didn’t require you to get a waiver even though your astigmatism is greater than 1.00?

 

[ccm02]

They didn’t require you to get a waiver even though your astigmatism is greater than 1.00?

Not the most analytical answer bc I'm not an eye doc, but I'm a qualified SNA and my "bad" eye is -1.25.
I didn't need waivers.

I'm just required to wear dorky (super cool) corrective lenses in the plane.

Bring the paperwork to an eye doc and have them look at you then compare to the NAMI numbers.

Also, just to clarify I’m talking about astigmatism not nearsightedness.

 

[Mouselovr]

They didn’t require you to get a waiver even though your astigmatism is greater than 1.00?

No. No one has said anything in all my subsequent eye exams since my first flight physical where they told me I'd need glasses.

I just peaked at the NAMI waiver guide. I do see their point about no greater than -1.00 but *i think* that only applies to another condition in conjunction with an astigmatism. As long as you meet all other minimums uncorrected and then are correctable to 20/20 with lenses, you'll be golden.
Waivers are just extra paperwork. The issue lies if you flat-out DQ/are not eligible for a waiver.

 

[ccm02]

All the other numbers of my prescription are within the range and I can see 20/20 uncorrected and corrected. What do you mean by “another condition in conjunction with an astigmatism”? Do you mean like if your visual acuity is worse than 20/40 for example?

 

[Mouselovr]

All the other numbers of my prescription are within the range and I can see 20/20 uncorrected and corrected. What do you mean by “another condition in conjunction with an astigmatism”? Do you mean like if your visual acuity is worse than 20/40 for example?

https://www.med.navy.mil/Portals/62/Documents/NMFSC/NMOTC/NAMI/ARWG/Miscellaneous/12_Ophthalmology_210301 - JAN23.pdf?ver=uNRNoKRjWFzdo0t7JMpc1A==
Look at p26

"AEROMEDICAL CONCERNS: A pterygium is an elevated wedge of fibrovascular tissue that extends onto the cornea. This should not be confused with a similar condition, pinguecula, that is only present on the conjunctiva, but not on the cornea, and is not considered disqualifying unless it interferes with blinking. The slow, progressive encroachment of a pterygium upon the cornea may lead to progressive astigmatism and refractive error that may not correct with spectacles....Asymptomatic ptyergia up to and including 1.0 mm corneal invasion (measured from the limbal border at the slit lamp) are NCD for both applicants and designated aviation personnel, provided vision is 20/20 or corrects to 20/20 with spectacles. Designated aviation personnel with symptomatic pterygia or pterygia with greater than 1.0 mm corneal invasion are CD, but a waiver will be considered if vision is 20/20 or corrects to 20/20 with spectacles and symptoms, if present, are controlled with conservative measures such as artificial tears."

A "pterygium" is what I was talking about. This condition is the only thing mentioned with a -1.0 astigmatism.
If your vision is worse than 20/40 uncorrected, its a DQ from pilot. No waiver.

 

[ccm02]

Oh, that makes sense. I’m 20/20 uncorrected and 20/20 corrected so hopefully I’m good. Thanks for all the info

 

[x15adam]

Hey everyone, like a few of you I initially failed my MEPS depth perception test. Today I had the opportunity to retake the test with a military optometrist (at an Air Force base) and get the necessary documentation sent to N33 for evaluation. In preparation for the test I scavenged the various threads and online resources for advice on the AFVT depth perception test (MEPS machine). Surprisingly, my retake did not use the AFVT and instead utilized the Randot stereotest (book with glasses). Below is a list of tips based on what I've found online and what I've discovered first hand.

1. Take your time (there is no time limit).
2. The answer on the AFVT is allegedly never the first or last circle/dot. (Not the case for the Randot Test)
3. Try looking through/past the general area of the circles/dots rather than directly at them. Some eye divergence can help bring out the answers (Didn't do much for me on the Randot test but people like it for the AFVT)
4. Try tilting or shifting your head side to side (Didn't do much for me on the Randot test but people like it for the AFVT)
5. Try using your peripheral vision and see which circle/dot stands out (I forgot to try this trick, but maybe it'll work for you)
6. You can actually buy a Randot Stereotest book and practice with it (probably would've bought one if I knew ahead of time - they're pricey though)
7. Need to score 40 arcseconds or better in order to be eligible for SNA. (Better = Lower Number)