Talk to me about the Prowler community

[Punk]

Seeing as how I'm off to Whidbey to fly the venerable mud pig, I have come to realize, I really know very little about the community. So far, talking to former Prowler pilots here in K'rock, I've seen mixed feelings. Some had good experiences, others had lousy experiences. A mixed bag so far.

So what is it like for a Prowler pilot? About the only thing I've heard consistently so far is you just need to be able to bring the thing aboard the boat. I'm hoping there's alittle more to it than that.

Any insight would be much appreciated.



And for you advanced guys still out there, yes, I was Top Hook and from what I was told, that sealed the deal for me even though I graduated first in my selecting class. So take that for what its worth.

 

[beau]

I grew up in Whidbey....great little town.....so much to do with in two hours .....perfect for almost anyone. Great Low Levels in BC (if they still do that) and a close community as far as squadrons go. When grew up there, it rained about 60% of the time, but the days that it does not usually are beautifull. Get used to Ferns, moss and Slugs for it is a rain forest.

Talked to a CO of one of the squadrons up there about a month and a half ago and he had nothing but good things to say.....especially about the nature of the squadrons....more family than indiviual feeling at work. Also when ever you go some place you have some friends to hang out with. And of course the transition in the near future to the Growler is good for pilots because the number of NFO's will go down...making "Command opportunities" more likely. Like I said that was straight from the skippers mouth.

 

[SteveG75]

OK, couple of active Prowler bubba's here. Myself, Brett327 and Flash. Maybe a few others.

Lets see if I can hit a couple of highlights.

Whibey Island:
- Small town living. Good for families, not so good for single guys.
- Seattle is 2 hours, Vancouver almost 3. Cut 1/2 hour of that if you live in Anacortes, almost an hour if you live in Mount Vernon. Of course, your commute to the base will increase accordingly.
- I actually didn't mind the weather. Whidbey actually is not as wet as Seattle or over by the mountains. Gorgeous summers. Dark winters. You can wake up, see the water and the islands, look SW and see snow on the Olympics, look east and see snow on Mt Baker (10,000+ feet).
- Learn to sail. Buy a boat.
- Learn to ski. Good local slopes and Whistler/Blackcomb is less than 4 hours away.

Prowler flying
- Prowler can be a pig to bring back to the boat. All the Hornet bubba's will probably get better grades but you were better when the aircraft was equal. And, don't forget, three frightened ECMO's are relying on you.
- We fly lots of levels through the Cascades. Why? Because it is good for crew coordination and if a pilot can do that well, he can usually fly well at 20,000 feet. AND IT'S FUN!!!!
- Crew coordination is the name of the game. ECMO's may not be pilots but we know the aircraft and the mission. Every crew has a mission commander and 3/4 of the time, it will not be you (you usually get your MC qual after your first cruise). Don't be afraid to listen to your ECMO's.
- Learn the mission. Don't fall into the "bus driver" mindset. You are an integral part of the crew. You don't need to learn how to recognize radar signals, but learn what the threats are, what the reponses are, how the Prowler is employed. You may be the only Prowler guy on a strike planning team, know how the weapons system is employed, not just how to trap.

Now, that I have dumped all that on you. Go to the RAG. Mouth shut, ears open. Learn to fly the airplane and pick peoples brains. It is a great community with a great future.

Remember, if a Hornet breaks on deck, the strike goes. Without the Prowler, no-one goes.

Oh, and if you ever get a SOD (signal of difficulty = RAG pink sheet) from a guy named Dan "Jelly" Gamache, then you are really a Prowler guy. The "velvet hammer" has forgotten more about the jet than most of us will ever know and his NATOPS checks are legendary. Great guy actually.

Good luck.

 

[Brett327]

Concur w/ most of what Meat said, except the single life thing. Whidbey has a bad rep as far as single guys, but I think it's undeserved. I spent four years there as a single guy, and while there isn't a big bar district or club scene, for the enterprising JO, there are tons of places to meet chicks without having to travel to Seattle or Vancouver. Let's just say I never had a problem finding someplace to "put it" so to speak. For those times when you do want the big city outing, both of the aforementioned cities are great places to go out, and lots of people have admins in Seattle. Sometimes, it's nice to go down with a group of friends and just get a nice hotel room downtown to crash at, then you can do other city stuff the next day. My favorite parts about Whidbey as a single guy are all the cool outdoors things you can just go do at a moment's notice. Skiing, boating, rock climbing, camping/hiking, fishing, shooting, you name it. I could probably write a book here.

Punk, I have a ton of gouge on the area and many, many contacts there whom I can hook you up with - real estate to RAG instructors. PM me if you have any more specific questions about the area or flying the jet. Welcome to the family, my brother.

Brett

 

[Punk]

Thanks for all the input so far.

I've already been looking into places to live, and so far, its been pretty tough. Been talking to a real estate agent and haven't been having much luck so far. With VQ-2 moving in from Rota, real estate has become pretty much nonexistent. Especially in Anacortes (where so far 9/10 people recommend living). Did find a brand spanking new condo in Oak Harbor on Scenic Heights (3 stories, 2 bed/2 bath). So I got that going for me, which is nice. Once the real estate market settles down there, hopefully I can find something to buy.

Back to the plane. I find being a "bus driver" as exciting as flying a MD-80 from the midwest, so by no means do I plan on sitting idly by. Unfortunately, from what I have gathered, there really doesn't seem that much for the pilot to do. Obviously, I'll be finding this out shortly, but the majority of the mission is on the ECMO's with the pilot just needing to put the jet in the right patch of real estate. That and shooting a HARM everynow and then. And like you said Steve, this requires the pilot to know what the ECMO's are doing and how they are doing it so he can get it right so they can do their jobs. But I'm wondering how much this is gonna change in the Growler. From what I've been told, and of course this could just be sunshine being blown up my butt, that they're selecting pilots now out of advanced with stellar grades because of the transition to the Growler. And in all honesty, if the Growler takes on more of a Wild Weasel mission like the F-4G's did, that would be pretty damn cool. I'm sure someone has an idea, and I know I don't. Lot of stuff to learn.

Nonetheless, it'll be fun and challenging. I'll just keep bringing my A game.

And I've been skiing since I was 2, went to school in CO, and have been going through withdrawl every since. Did get my 1 day of skiing in this last season by bringing a T-45 out to CO. So that'll be nice.

 

[ea6bflyr]

Punk,
Congrats and welcome to the community. At the RAG you'll fly about 150 hours in the Sim before you'll ever get to set foot in the jet. Don't worry about the boat thing until you get to that stage....lots of other work needs to be done before you get there.

BUY A HOUSE. You'll never regret it. Rent out the other rooms. Consider using the Member Move service from NFCU or USAA...you'll get money back. Buy a house during the winter. Houses tend to move a bit slower in the winter (Buyers market). Enjoy the great NW.

Meat: How could you forget about me?

ea6bflyr

 

[Brett327]

Thanks for all the input so far.

I've already been looking into places to live, and so far, its been pretty tough. Been talking to a real estate agent and haven't been having much luck so far. With VQ-2 moving in from Rota, real estate has become pretty much nonexistent. Especially in Anacortes (where so far 9/10 people recommend living). Did find a brand spanking new condo in Oak Harbor on Scenic Heights (3 stories, 2 bed/2 bath). So I got that going for me, which is nice. Once the real estate market settles down there, hopefully I can find something to buy.

Back to the plane. I find being a "bus driver" as exciting as flying a MD-80 from the midwest, so by no means do I plan on sitting idly by. Unfortunately, from what I have gathered, there really doesn't seem that much for the pilot to do. Obviously, I'll be finding this out shortly, but the majority of the mission is on the ECMO's with the pilot just needing to put the jet in the right patch of real estate. That and shooting a HARM everynow and then. And like you said Steve, this requires the pilot to know what the ECMO's are doing and how they are doing it so he can get it right so they can do their jobs. But I'm wondering how much this is gonna change in the Growler. From what I've been told, and of course this could just be sunshine being blown up my butt, that they're selecting pilots now out of advanced with stellar grades because of the transition to the Growler. And in all honesty, if the Growler takes on more of a Wild Weasel mission like the F-4G's did, that would be pretty damn cool. I'm sure someone has an idea, and I know I don't. Lot of stuff to learn.

Nonetheless, it'll be fun and challenging. I'll just keep bringing my A game.

And I've been skiing since I was 2, went to school in CO, and have been going through withdrawl every since. Did get my 1 day of skiing in this last season by bringing a T-45 out to CO. So that'll be nice.

Best thing to do for housing is to wait to buy anything until you're done with the RAG. There's a slim, but real chance that you could go to 136 in Japan, so keep that in mind. As for the flying, it is far from "just driving a bus." There's plenty of very dynamic flying going on between low levels, BFMC, and the various evasive maneuvers we train to. It's no fighter, but it's still a very fun jet to fly, especially down at 500 FT. It's hard to get any more specific without angering the OPSEC gods, but trust me, you'll have a blast.

Brett

 

[SteveG75]

But I'm wondering how much this is gonna change in the Growler. From what I've been told, and of course this could just be sunshine being blown up my butt, that they're selecting pilots now out of advanced with stellar grades because of the transition to the Growler. And in all honesty, if the Growler takes on more of a Wild Weasel mission like the F-4G's did, that would be pretty damn cool.

IMHO, I don't see the Growler as much of a Wild Weasel, CJ type aircraft. First, big heavy jamming pods will reduce the ability to duel with SAMS. Factor in the limited number of SEAD assets. There is also a different mindset between AF and Navy SEAD. I have done some work at Nellis and it is a different world.

Anyway, as to the Growler. The mission will be the same but I expect the pilot will be more involved. The Growler will have the same system as the ICAP III Prowler so you will be doing the job of 4 people with 2. Think of it this way:

EA-6B Crew Duties (by no means all inclusive, and this is Meat's point of view (which could be AFU )):
Pilot: Fly, a little comms, some nav, pulls the trigger on the HARM, SA.
ECMO 1: Nav, A/G radar, comm (unsecure and secure), HARM targetting, comm jammer, backs up pilot on SA and aircraft, checklists
ECMO2/3 (share duties): ES system, Jammers, HARM, comm jammer, secure comms, mission SA.

EA-18G:
Pilot: Fly, nav, comms, A/A radar, A/A tactics, SA
WSO: ES, jammers, HARM, comm jammer, secure comms, A/G radar, SA

Automation will help but it will be one busy airplane.

 

[Dawgfan]

I bought a house as soon as I got here, and am glad I did. Prices are up 25% since I bought, and I could not afford where I'm living now if I hadn't bought early. If you can find a place to stay for 6-7 months, look into buying into a new neighborhood. You'll get the most for your money, plus get to pick out all of the junk that goes into your house. You can lock into a price now and when it's built you'll probably already be ahead. For a typical 3 or 4 bedroom in Oak Harbor you'll be looking ~300,000, in Anacortes that same house will be ~350,000 - 400,000. I live in Anacortes and love it. Doesn't have the feeling of a "military" town ( ie, no Walmart).

http://www.windermere.com

-Click on Washington
-Click on Skagit County
-Select Anacortes, try $275-350 for prices

People are going crazy right now, so they are probably a little inflated. If you wait till Oct or Nov it might cool down, but by then Q2 will be here.

If you do get Japan, you can always rent it out (might not be able to cover your mortgage, but you'll make $$$ in Japan). If you have any other questions let me know.

 

[A4sForever]

Prowlers are great --- Intruders were better. But given the new Fleet seat you're heading towards today --- it might set you up for EF-18's ... depends on timing, you, and needs of the Navy. All of the housing gouge given has been good --- there are a couple of realtors I would stay away from, based on experience. There's just a lot of different personal viewpoints and priorities expressed herein, and you are going to have to figure out which are yours. There is not too much decent housing available right now --- save building your own --- that will take 8-12 months. Lots of crap, but not a lot of good stuff. The driving to Anacortes/Mt. Vernon/Burlington is starting to become problematical as traffic increases. 35 years ago --- 2 out of 3 automobiles in Oak Harbor had military stickers. Now, it's about 1 in 3 .... unscientific survey.

I have to laugh at some of these NFO's who think the pilot is a glorified bus driver when describing the division of labor in the EA-6B. I don't know who they've been flying with, and I realize some of it is in jest; but with a 3-1 numerical advantage over Naval Aviators, some NFO's might lose perspective. I once had a B/N (we were both LT's at the time) , who later went on to become the VA-128 RAG C.O., tell me late one night through alcohol-tinted glasses @ the Cubi BOQ bar:

"You know .... *burp* .... there's not one thing you can do that I can't do better .... *burp* " ...... Said he of the bad attitude and too many Cubi Specials.

To which I responded: "Oh yeah, G****, well I know one thing you can't do .... you can't land on the boat .... "

He had previously been an Aviator and had lost his Wings at the ship at night. He stared straight ahead for nearly 30 seconds in silence ... a long time .... ordered me another drink on his tab, got up to leave, turned and said: "You know, you've got a point .... you're right ... "

I think that was the last one-on-one conversation we ever had .... ... drunk or sober.

 

[A4sForever]

Funny .... I just looked at "Who's Online" and all the B/N ECMO NFO's are responding .... how strange .... ... bring it on, as the C-inC says .....

 

[Brett327]

I have to laugh at some of these NFO's who think the pilot is a glorified bus driver when describing the division of labor in the EA-6B. I don't know who they've been flying with, and I realize some of it is in jest; but with a 3-1 numerical advantage over Naval Aviators, some NFO's might lose perspective.

Concur w/ A4s. In our ECMO-centric world, it's easy to lose perspective on the role of the pilot. The flip side of that coin is that it becomes equally easy for a pilot to fall into the "voice actutated autopilot" role and not get into the nitty gritty of the tactics. Things like timing, positioning, general SA about the strikers you're protecting, and executing a good scram if it comes down to that are huge and will differentiate the "bus driver" from a top notch Prowler driver.

Brett

 

[SteveG75]

I have to laugh at some of these NFO's who think the pilot is a glorified bus driver when describing the division of labor in the EA-6B. I don't know who they've been flying with, and I realize some of it is in jest; but with a 3-1 numerical advantage over Naval Aviators, some NFO's might lose perspective.

Hey A4's, I didn't mean it to be taken that way. :icon_smil

There are pilots in the Prowler community who let themselves become bus drivers. They have no interest in the weapons system and just let the ECMO tell them where to go. A good Prowler pilot not only knows how to fly the jet but can also plan like an ECMO. After all, when planning, CAG doesn't want to hear his Prowler rep say, "Let me get an ECMO to answer that question about pod loadout and jammer go/no go criteria, sir." I have flown with both and I much prefer a guy who knows what we (ECMO's) do.

 

[SteveG75]

Funny .... I just looked at "Who's Online" and all the B/N ECMO NFO's are responding .... how strange .... ... bring it on, as the C-inC says .....

Hey, I loved the Intruder. I always said that on the ground the only way to tell an Intruder pilot from a B/N was to look at the wings. :icon_smil Everyone on the ready room knew how to plan, fight and and employ that plane.

 

[A4sForever]

Hey A4's, I didn't mean it to be taken that way. :icon_smil

There are pilots in the Prowler community who let themselves become bus drivers. .....

Bingo .... and I know, I know ... for both you AND Brett ... like I said, in jest .... and I don't mean Jungle Escape and Survival Training. And you are right --- there are too many pilots who allow themselves to become the functional equivalent of a living and breathing auto-pilot. Seen it before, see it today .... if I was a B/N or an ECMO, I would want the pilot right in there with me getting the job done --- just like I wanted (demanded?) that my B/Ns do in days gone by. It goes without saying that we worked together --- not at cross purposes.

But some pilots --- don't ask me why --- just sit there and wait for someone to take care of them. I was fortunate to fly with 66% OUTSTANDING B/Ns during my tenure in the A-6 ... we made a good team because we understood the airplane, the mission, and each other.