Ive been to XOI's for men who worked for me. I defended them. Even on the issue of DUI's. Especially if they are good workers. It will never change the way I feel about the navy's handling of the situation. There comes a point that the military needs to realize this is a major ongoing problem, and our current way of dealing with it is not working. Every year the safety reports come streaming in about sailors killing and getting killed behind the wheel drunk. So I pose this question, do we just keep saying it's ok because they are hard workers and good people who made a mistake? Or pro-actively try and remedy the situation? Because what we are doing now.... isn't working.
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Ive been to XOI's for men who worked for me. I defended them. Even on the issue of DUI's. Especially if they are good workers. It will never change the way I feel about the navy's handling of the situation. There comes a point that the military needs to realize this is a major ongoing problem, and our current way of dealing with it is not working. Every year the safety reports come streaming in about sailors killing and getting killed behind the wheel drunk. So I pose this question, do we just keep saying it's ok because they are hard workers and good people who made a mistake? Or pro-actively try and remedy the situation? Because what we are doing now.... isn't working.
Yeah, exactly what I was about to ask! You're telling us to grow up but a MATURE person is someone who doesn't just bitch about a problem, they try to work toward a solution! You think the Navy's policies on drunk driving are flawed? Fine, then do something about it! Actions speak louder than words, ever heard of that expression?
Treat a DUI like a crime. Its what I have been saying all along. If the Navy treated DUI like a crime, the numbers would go down. Brig time. That is enough to scare most "good" sailors away from making dumb decisions. Why do people not steal from work? It isnt because they are "good", its because the penalty for it. It is the same for almost anything. If you guys are just going to badger me, then give it up. Either you care or you dont. Doesn't matter to me what you think.
It's interesting that you make no mention of any kind of designated driver programs, or training as a way to cut down on DUI's. Instead you focus only on harsh punishments...it makes you sound like you have a personal vendetta against people who get DUI's.
DeltaVictorFC2
New Member
Im sorry about the seahawks fan thing smittay. Its not fair for me to pin that on you......I, well I was wrong.
-D(v)FC2
-D(v)FC2
DeltaVictorFC2
New Member
BTW, missed you Haubby, thought you were done with these posts until the results came out.
I was asking a question. It's called debate...not badgering.
Again, I think it is command dependent. In my command, the member would receive a summ. court martial and brig time. In other commands, maybe not.
There does come a point where the Navy cannot be responsible for fixing all of the member's problems. These are adults we are employing. I don't think the Navy can prevent DUI. Even with our aggressive handling and proactive stance on preventing DUIs, we still have them. The member needs to take responsibility for themselves and suffer the consequences for their actions. If that means them getting fired, then so be it.
I think it's actually a readiness issue for the Navy. How can we fight the war, when our members are embroiled in civilian jails and criminal litigation?
In comparison to civilian employers, I think the Navy goes well beyond as far as education and action.
Again, I think it is command dependent. In my command, the member would receive a summ. court martial and brig time. In other commands, maybe not.
There does come a point where the Navy cannot be responsible for fixing all of the member's problems. These are adults we are employing. I don't think the Navy can prevent DUI. Even with our aggressive handling and proactive stance on preventing DUIs, we still have them. The member needs to take responsibility for themselves and suffer the consequences for their actions. If that means them getting fired, then so be it.
I think it's actually a readiness issue for the Navy. How can we fight the war, when our members are embroiled in civilian jails and criminal litigation?
In comparison to civilian employers, I think the Navy goes well beyond as far as education and action.
DeltaVictorFC2
New Member
Our command just came up with a policy that if we go 90 days without an alcohol related mishap, we all get a 96 hour lib. so far its been 70 something days. Positive re enforcement can be a powerful thing.
And in phrog's example, that 3rd class made adult decisions, he just lacked the experience in that case. Those are the people we should try to retain, individuals who took precautions and made adult decisions, but still made a mistake. (I'm agreeing with you btw)
A black and white view of all situations does everyone a disservice.
Interesting tactic, I hope that works, if so it would be a great tool.
DeltaVictorFC2
New Member
we shall see....if someone gets a dui this far into the deal, its getting re-aligned in the fan room they have to worry about, not NJP.
Speculation wasn't going anywhere so I had to bail on that thread.
DUI's are bad. We know this and sometimes it happens to good people. People deserve the oppurtunity to redeem themselves and are entitled to a second chance.
No no no no, you got me all wrong. I am ALL about training and DD programs. They work. BUT.. we already have them in place. We train constantly about DUI's. Safety stand downs and such. People know about DD programs, tipsy taxi cards, free parking on VA beach for drunks, but it is up to the members to make the right decisions and use these resources. I would love if there was a way to just fix the problem. There is not though. We need to keep training and keep the resources there.
No matter what you will still have the people who don't think it is a big deal and go out and drive drunk. You have to send them a message that it is not ok. By making brig time, especially for a second offense mandatory and case by case for first offense, I believe you would drive the seriousness of the situation home to people. NOBODY wants to go to a military brig.
All I am saying is people would think twice about their actions if that was an option to C.O.'s. As it stand right now, I have never seen that as an option, just your standard 45/45 and half months pay x2 and reduction in rank.