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Should I stay or should I go? Or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying And Love HSC.

AllYourBass

I'm okay with the events unfolding currently
pilot
Dumb question: If a Romeo has to do SAR, how much space is in the back to bring someone onboard and perform basic medical attention, vs. gear and seats that are in the way? (notwithstanding the medical training level of the aircrew who would be doing it)

Not a ton. Best case three extra seats besides SO if totally trucked, but more likely fewer. If kitted for a litter, it's just going to be the two crewmen and the survivor.

(This is assuming adherence to seating rules and not a creative HADR op or something)
 

Gatordev

Well-Known Member
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor
Not a ton. Best case three extra seats besides SO if totally trucked, but more likely fewer. If kitted for a litter, it's just going to be the two crewmen and the survivor.

(This is assuming adherence to seating rules and not a creative HADR op or something)

Doing a no-shit SAR will throw some of those rules out the window, as well, and no one will bat an eye. I pulled two ship's company out in a Bravo (same basic config, minus one seat, as a Romeo...only three seats in the back total) with the standard SAR crew (RS and Hoist operator). We just pushed the first survivor up into the tunnel and it worked fine.

All that said, I did call Ops Normal with 15 souls off the Comfort in the HADR configuration (no seats or seat rails in the back). That was my personal best.
 

red_stang65

Well-Known Member
pilot
Dumb question: If a Romeo has to do SAR, how much space is in the back to bring someone onboard and perform basic medical attention, vs. gear and seats that are in the way? (notwithstanding the medical training level of the aircrew who would be doing it)

In the same vein, how much time does it take to configure for SAR (ie: truck out the Romeo), and then configure back for ASW?

If the HSC det goes down a bird, I don’t imagine it’ll be a quick configuration swap, and warfare commanders are going to have to decide what’s more important: a marginal SAR asset configured for ASW, or a SAR configuration with a lost ASW capability. Then factor into that decision whatever time delay for HSC to get their parts and aircraft back up...rinse/repeat throughout the deployment, and I’m sure that O4 OIC will have some interesting perspectives.
 

Hair Warrior

Well-Known Member
Contributor
@red_stang65 and that kind of gets into two scenarios:

A. Romeo does SAR with no-notice (emergency).
B. Romeo does SAR with some amount of notice and time for the maintainers to proactively adjust the bird to better match the mission.
 

red_stang65

Well-Known Member
pilot
Correct, that’s what I’m getting at. The question is how long of a delay for HSC warrants moving from scenario A to B, and how long does that swap take, and then how long to swap back from B to A?

I’d imagine there would probably be calls to bring back one of the CLF Sierras to the carrier temporarily, or the Romeo dets would have to take on the burden of the now trucked-out Romeo. These are all just opportunity cost decisions and are by no means earth shattering, but it just seems like some logistical hoops we’ll inevitably have to jump through.

Could that all be mitigated by a 4-bird Sierra det? Probably. Navy leadership has answered questions about 3 vs 4 bird dets many times before (ie: USAF and Army can do RQS/SOF dets with 3, so why does Navy need 4?), and the answer has always been that Navy maintenance requirements and timelines are different than our sister services, and it usually pans out to needing 4 to make 2 over a full deployment. There will definitely be several D phases that come due on the CVW deployment, and that’s planned maintenance. I’d imagine the HSM squadron would be asked to truck out while HSC does the D phase. In short, our bosses are choosing to line up a lot of holes in the Swiss cheese with a 3-bird det, and our bosses are going to act surprised when the final few inevitably line up.
 

Pags

N/A
pilot
Don't forget that there are other SAR assets around the CSG that can help: ships, boats, and helos. For a CVW the most likely case for a SAR would be 1-2 people from a crew that has to punch for a hornet. Worst case would be if a COD goes down. I'd think with HSC having 4 to make 1 the odds of needing a 60R to cover SAR are slim. And if it has to then it's be over to the Boss to figure out how much SAR he needs for routine ops.
 

insanebikerboy

Internet killed the television star
pilot
None
Contributor
That's when I did mine, as well. I'd argue HSC still has a lot more room without all of those community-saving, mission-having black boxes in the back.

I don’t remember how many people we loaded up on those Haiti flights but I do recall one flight where the left gun sat on the left wing until after we landed. Apparently the cabin was so full of supplies to offload he had nowhere to sit. Of course he didn’t actually tell us he was sitting on the wing till after we landed.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
.jpg stills are so yesteryear, we need full motion .gifs lasting at least a few seconds to keep our attention nowadays- until the next forum thing comes along

:p

giphy.gif
 

Gatordev

Well-Known Member
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor

Gotcha. I was thinking Haiti. But that's actually pretty amusing.

I don’t remember how many people we loaded up on those Haiti flights but I do recall one flight where the left gun sat on the left wing until after we landed. Apparently the cabin was so full of supplies to offload he had nowhere to sit. Of course he didn’t actually tell us he was sitting on the wing till after we landed.

During the first week or so, like you, I'm sure, we would get two Press for every out-and-in from PAP, coupled with supplies. Of course the Dubs would complain about how we could take more supplies without the press, but both had value. But at least in the Bravo, because of all of the mission racks, the only place we could really put them was jammed way up front in the tunnel behind us, then seal them in with MREs and water. Seemed like a decent plan...I'm sure nothing bad could have come from it.
 
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