SELRES VT Life

[Flash]

....I am still trying to figure out which forms of active duty count towards reducing your retirement age. I did find this - clear as mud.

5. REDUCED ELIGIBILITY AGE FOR RECEIPT OF RETIRED PAY FOR NON-REGULAR SERVICE ...section 12301(d)...section 12301(h)...

Clear as mud..... Does this mean ADSW? ADT? AT?

So I did quite a bit of research on this when I was ADSW and as usual the Navy was lacking in info as to what actually counted. In my searching I did find some Army references but what was really helpful was a USAF site, unfortunately can't find it now, that broke down exactly what counted and what didn't with the applicable codes all in pretty plain English.

What counts? Pretty much all active duty, ADSW, ADT and AT included, except for National Guard duty if called by the Governor and orders extended due to medical issues (though I know a few that is counted for). With ADT and AT it is really hard to get to 90 within a FY but it should count if you get there just keep your orders and be prepared to prove it when the time comes. My ADSW counted and it had one of the qualifying sections, 12301(d) I believe, right at the top of my orders.

 

[DanMa1156]

words

Yeah I figured that would be the case. We shall see.

 

[Randy Daytona]

So I did quite a bit of research on this when I was ADSW and as usual the Navy was lacking in info as to what actually counted. In my searching I did find some Army references but what was really helpful was a USAF site, unfortunately can't find it now, that broke down exactly what counted and what didn't with the applicable codes all in pretty plain English.

What counts? Pretty much all active duty, ADSW, ADT and AT included, except for National Guard duty if called by the Governor and orders extended due to medical issues (though I know a few that is counted for). With ADT and AT it is really hard to get to 90 within a FY but it should count if you get there just keep your orders and be prepared to prove it when the time comes. My ADSW counted and it had one of the qualifying sections, 12301(d) I believe, right at the top of my orders.

Unfortunately all of my major deployments were in the 04-06 time frame so none of those count for reducing retirement age. However I do have buckets of AT and ADT which in aggregate would accumulate more than 90 days in a fiscal year for 3 or 4 years - so that might be a winner. Unfortunately, I do not have the actual orders anymore. Anyone have any idea how far back in NROWS you can go to pull orders?

 

[Uncle Fester]

Unfortunately all of my major deployments were in the 04-06 time frame so none of those count for reducing retirement age. However I do have buckets of AT and ADT which in aggregate would accumulate more than 90 days in a fiscal year for 3 or 4 years - so that might be a winner. Unfortunately, I do not have the actual orders anymore. Anyone have any idea how far back in NROWS you can go to pull orders?

Shouldn't you be able to figure out all your days from your APR/ASOSH?

 

[Randy Daytona]

Good question. Logically, yes. But I am planning on a slog with the bureaucracy...

 

[Rg9]

To the original post...

Congressional minimums are 48 drills and 14 days of orders. As an O-3, that amounts to a little over $14k on the year. Usually, CNATRA also gives out 72 additional drills for flying (AFTPs), but every now and then (see FY16) they mismanage funding and cut those back. Those 72 additional drills at O-3 pay equal about $16k. There are also lots of options to go on short orders - there's lots of different funding streams - though you won't get paid as much per day on orders compared to drills.

All that said, unless another job is keeping you from doing SELRES, bank on about $30k/yr as an O-3 for only about 90 days of work.

The promotion time to O-4 is pretty much solely based on when you get looked at. I won't say it's a guarantee, but I also don't know of a single SELRES O-3 in CNATRA that didn't get picked up on the first look. You have 10+ years of URL officer service, going against SWOs that did 4 or 5 and are now drilling at a NOSC. If the Active board is skewed to them, the Reserve board is skewed to us.

To the early retirement pay... so I still haven't found a straight answer, but I THINK doing regular ADT/AT doesn't count towards early retirement. I've read through the title 10 stuff already cited here before, and I THINK our ADT/AT, because it's considered training, doesn't allow an early retirement pay. Maybe ADSW is coded differently? I THINK the orders have to use the "123xx" code to qualify? I hope I'm wrong. Any other thoughts on this are appreciated. I'm trying to plan out next FY and potential for an earlier retirement check would alter my plans...

 

[Flash]

Congressional minimums are 48 drills and 14 days of orders....

It is actually 12 days.

To the early retirement pay... so I still haven't found a straight answer, but I THINK doing regular ADT/AT doesn't count towards early retirement. I've read through the title 10 stuff already cited here before, and I THINK our ADT/AT, because it's considered training, doesn't allow an early retirement pay. Maybe ADSW is coded differently? I THINK the orders have to use the "123xx" code to qualify? I hope I'm wrong. Any other thoughts on this are appreciated. I'm trying to plan out next FY and potential for an earlier retirement check would alter my plans...

I am pretty sure all but state-directed mobs and medical extensions don't qualify, if you accumulate 90 days of AT/ADT in a FY I think it counts. I'll try to dig a bit further this week to find out for sure. The catch? How the heck are you going to get 90 days of AT/ADT?

 

[Griz882]

To the early retirement pay... so I still haven't found a straight answer, but I THINK doing regular ADT/AT doesn't count towards early retirement. I've read through the title 10 stuff already cited here before, and I THINK our ADT/AT, because it's considered training, doesn't allow an early retirement pay. Maybe ADSW is coded differently? I THINK the orders have to use the "123xx" code to qualify? I hope I'm wrong. Any other thoughts on this are appreciated. I'm trying to plan out next FY and potential for an earlier retirement check would alter my plans...

Early reserve retirement pay must fall under GWOT or GWOT support and only counts time since the law was enacted in 2007. Thus, VT work would not count but a job preparing other naval reservists to deploy to GWOT would - as would orders to sand box. As an Army National Guard guy I got almost two years off the 60 years old age limit just for training soldiers and sailors on specific deployment tasks. If you really want man-days or active duty, join a Navy Civil Affairs unit. I think I sent about 500 of those guys overseas before I enter the "grey area."

 

[Randy Daytona]

I am pretty sure all but state-directed mobs and medical extensions don't qualify, if you accumulate 90 days of AT/ADT in a FY I think it counts. I'll try to dig a bit further this week to find out for sure. The catch? How the heck are you going to get 90 days of AT/ADT?

Whiting had large amounts of ADT for years. How much do you want? Not sure if it was that way throughout the training command or is now, but we almost never had a problem getting orders as the active duty counted on us for production. I could see my retirement age dropping by 15 months if that is case but I think Griz just shot up parts of my bucket list.

 

[Griz882]

Yeah, sorry Randy. Da rulz be da rulz. Still, you get the points and the points add to your retirement. Equally, when you leave the active reserves (drilling unit) make sure you ask for assignment to the retired reserve vice a discharge. You don't make points, but your retirement years continue to add up.

 

[Flash]

Early reserve retirement pay must fall under GWOT or GWOT support and only counts time since the law was enacted in 2007. Thus, VT work would not count but a job preparing other naval reservists to deploy to GWOT would - as would orders to sand box.....

That is incorrect. I did a year of ADSW that did not have anything to do with GWOT or GWOT support and it is still good for the earlier retirement.

I found the USAF page that lays everything out that qualifies and everything that doesn't. ADSW and ADT, which fall under Title 10, U.S.C., Section 12301(d), both qualify. Unfortunately I was wrong and AT doesn't qualify since it falls under Title 10, U.S.C., Section 12301(b).

Here is the USAF page: http://www.arpc.afrc.af.mil/Service...10/Article/580954/reduced-retirement-age.aspx

And a handy guide that delineates which orders fall under which code: http://www.public.navy.mil/bupers-npc/career/education/GIBill/Documents/Post 9-11 GI Bill/SELRESPOST9_11E.pdf

 

[Griz882]

That is incorrect. I did a year of ADSW that did not have anything to do with GWOT or GWOT support and it is still good for the earlier retirement.

Negative there hot rod. Title 10 orders under U.S.C., Sections 688, 12301(a), 12302, 12304, 12305, and 12406 are all issued under the broad rubric of GWOT or GWOT Support in that they all fall under Presidential emergency authority. Your job may not have had anything to do with GWOT, but your orders were paid under that act. Perhaps the shop you worked for supported a GWOT mission. Section 12301(d) orders are those in support of non-combat activities like ADSW.

 

[Flash]

Negative there hot rod. Title 10 orders under U.S.C., Sections 688, 12301(a), 12302, 12304, 12305, and 12406 are all issued under the broad rubric of GWOT or GWOT Support in that they all fall under Presidential emergency authority. Your job may not have had anything to do with GWOT, but your orders were paid under that act. Perhaps the shop you worked for supported a GWOT mission. Section 12301(d) orders are those in support of non-combat activities like ADSW.

Show me something official where it says that then, it isn't anywhere in the links I provided.

 

[Rg9]

It is actually 12 days.



I am pretty sure all but state-directed mobs and medical extensions don't qualify, if you accumulate 90 days of AT/ADT in a FY I think it counts. I'll try to dig a bit further this week to find out for sure. The catch? How the heck are you going to get 90 days of AT/ADT?

As stated, in the VTs this is very feasible. And title 10 talks about 90 days within 2 consecutive FYs. So if you do this very normal activity in 2 years: 14 days AT extended to 29 with E-AT, and 16 days ADT... and that all counts, you'd hit the 90 days over the 2 years.

But I think the orders have to use the correct afformentioned 123xx coding. I went back and didn't see any on the AT or ADT orders.

Uh, yeah 12 days. 24/2 = 12. Math hard.

 

[Griz882]

Show me something official where it says that then, it isn't anywhere in the links I provided.

Long story short, the military has gotten into the habit of using the reserves and National Guard to augment the authorized end-strength of the active force. To do this they use contingency funding…NOT the general service fund. So, that brings us to the portion of the law that covers activating part-timers without and with their consent.

OK, so the lynch pin of all of this is Title 10 USC, Section 12301 which starts with paragraph (a) “In time of war or of national emergency declared by Congress, or when otherwise authorized by law, an authority designated by the Secretary concerned may, without the consent of the persons affected, order any unit, and any member not assigned to a unit…” This is the cornerstone clause. If your orders do not begin with some element of Section 12301 you DO NOT get a reduction on your retirement age.

From there it flows to Section 12302, the various elements of the reserves to include reserve and NG…it opens with (a) “In time of national emergency declared by the President after January 1, 1953, or when otherwise authorized by law, an authority designated by the Secretary concerned may, without the consent of the persons concerned, order any unit, and any member…”

For those in individual status Section 12304 states…“Notwithstanding the provisions of section 12302(a) or any other provision of law, when the President determines that it is necessary to augment the active forces for any named operational mission or that it is necessary to provide assistance…”

Later Sections 12305 has to do with promotions of non-active personnel while on orders under the rubric of 12301 while Section 12306 has to do with medical issues of reservists called to active duty.

Section 12301(d) is allowed but this paragraph of the act means that the activation is voluntary, however, these orders are previously coded as part of Section 12301 which identify their funding as “contingency.”

You may not like my use of the words GWOT or GWOT support, I admit that is a broad swath, but your work had to have been “contingency” or “emergency” funded for them to reduce your retirement age.