Rgr. My point is that paradoxical statistical relationships can make something appear biased, unfair, or unequal, when it’s really not.
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Racism in the Military
- Thread starter Charles Edward
- Start date
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
You must have missed the first page or two of the thread.
The military is committed to treating everyone fairly and takes diversity seriously. Those who go against the each service's core values are held accountable, provided it's reported.
If a prospective sailor is looking for the board to be an emotional echo chamber for some divisive message about how the whole system is rigged against blacks to put fuel on the fire of race relations because of some shallow analysis done by a NYT reporter, they'll have to look elsewhere.
You're never going to get rid of 100% of negative interactions that might occur on an interpersonal level. Sometimes it's easy to blame those interactions on race when it could actually be due to any myriad of personal traits or job performance. Not everyone is going to like each other. And on the rare cases that it is racism, the offender is held accountable. The best you can do is cultivate a culture that those interactions are not okay in order to make sure that those interactions don't boil over into threats or acts of violence, and don't have an impact on the victim's career.
The discussion about the Civil War arose from actual current events where riots are tearing down statues. Presumably the riots goal is to send a message to government to take certain monuments down. Being that we live in a democratic society, civil discourse on which statues should stay and why is entirely appropriate.
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Pay attention Brett or I won't be inclined to buy those beers when we meet some day. I agreed with Flash's post on the subject. I am consistent, if slow to judge in the absence of all the facts.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Flash, you're getting lost in a lot of details that haven't been fleshed out yet.
Bottom line is the cops resigned due to a perceived sudden reduction in benefits as a result of punishment for something they didn't do.
The details are still being fleshed out but from the information that is available it is not the city that said they wouldn't back them, it is the union. That is a very important distinction, with a private entity essentially impairing public safety because they are unhappy with the city leadership. The police are public servants, they ought to act like it.
Not having first hand experience with unions I like the idea of them but I am aware in practice they are sometimes mixed, the fact a union is inhibiting public safety though is dangerous in my opinion.
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I know all this. I replied the way I did precisely because you made it sound like a conspiracy of organized groups of people to subjugate minorities. The assumption was LE. Though I suppose it could have been DMV or USPS.
Thanks though for the clarification.I have said many times in various threads over the years, much is dependent not only on training, but leadership and the circumstances that exist at the time. Not as an excuse, but an explanation. That is how you make improvements, consider all the factors in play so they can be mitigated or improved upon if necessary. Racism, though present in some cases, is way down the list. That is why I find the current focus will not be helpful in the end.
Cool. So much for “solidarity” and all that.
The actual death, nothing. Even if they knew his violent criminal history, it would only have informed their initial approach and cuffing. There would have been no reason to not roll him onto his side or sit him up, which is the standard of care for suspects in that situation.
What matters is that he has become the latest in a false narrative. I'll say it again and refer everyone to their own research, some where other than social media. There is no evidence of systemic racial bias in LE. The narrative is that black males have to fear the police. People, because of the repeated fallacies about race and policing, actually believe that if blacks get pulled over for a speeding ticket they will likely get shot. It simply does not happen that way. Utter bull shit. Every use of force case is different and some times the cop could have done better. Sometimes they are found out of department policy. There are criminal prosecution of officers. BUT, the vast majority of the time it starts with the subject's behavior. NOTHING would have happened if the subject had complied.
Floyd's history matters in that context. For your ordinary black kid that is not breaking the law or when encountering LE for any reason simply complies, getting hurt or going to jail is highly unlikely. The so called "discussion" young black males are supposed to hear should not be that cops are dangerous. That you should fear them. It should be, "Look at Mr Floyd, God bless him, he has provided you a good lesson. Don't live his life. Stay out of trouble. Respect the police. If you have to deal with a rude or racist officer, do as he says and get through it. Come to me and we will fight it court and see his supervisors and the mayor know the type of cop he is."
I drove by some kids holding up signs on a street corner yesterday. In sympathy with BLM they displayed a list of people killed in police custody. Every single one was a justified homicide. Now, you can disagree if you like about the final judgment, and you probably would not if you knew ALL the facts. But, you can not deny, that in every one of those cases, the initial police interest was legit and the subject drove the response of the police. Those are the facts. Facts like that are lost on everyone.
If you think the police need to better understand minority communities, then I submit some minority communities are predisposing their youth to be disrespectful and distrusting of the police. It is not necessary. They need to accept the circumstances that surround these sorts of encounters and understand that if you avoid those circumstances you have noting to fear from the police.
No it isn't. They are being bullied. They are doing it for appearances. It is no different then all the displays of solidarity with BLM we are seeing from corporations and other organizations. It is like when your spouse insists on a apology and you know you were right, but you say "sorry" anyway, to keep the peace. Your parents ever make you shake hands with your bother and make up after he took the first swing? You didn't mean it.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Although the merits of whether police should unionize are debatable, the fact is that these officers work under a labor agreement negotiated by a union that periodically gets reviewed, updated, and renewed. They pay dues to get protection that the agreement is honored. It's bad form to change the terms of the deal. Fully understand officers quitting a special unit based on that.
What these guys are doing pale in comparison to how NYPD behaves if the mayor attempts to do anything they don't like. And their election bloc is strong enough to out or elect anyone they want.
I think it needs to be a two way discussion between police and all the communities they SERVE.
While I understand that, per current rules, the escalation due to lack of compliance, makes it legal for cops to kill anyone they feel is getting too feisty. I'd offer that that is the very thing that is the Crux of this current issue: do we want our cops to be shooting and killing people following a routine traffic stop?
I'd also like to see your evidence (not personal anecdote) for no one evidence of systemic racism in cops since I've seen plenty that says there is.
Just trying to give some context. I suppose a public repudiation is all but required now if the other 55 left because of the reduction in benefits and not the initially reported act of support for the other two officers. Seems onerous if it just turns out to be bad reporting. But that's just like my opinion.
Hole cow Pags!! So much work to be done here. It is not legal to shoot people because they become "fiesty". And cops do not shoot people for a traffic stop. This thinking is exact what I was talking about. You can imagine I feel like you would if some guy in the press wrote something preposterous about helicopter performance.
Same laws apply to police shootings as citizens defending themselves, except there is a higher standard for cops because of their training. And that is true for traffic stops as well as armed robbery in progress or any other scenario.
As to evidence. Much has been pointed out above. More and better can be found for yourself. I am not doing your research for facts you desire and should know before you opine.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Looks like CNO is also banning the Confederate flag. Surprised it took until 2020 to ban military personnel from flying a flag that represents violent rebellion against the US, let alone that the aim of the rebellion was to preserve slavery. Belongs in the same category as the Nazi and ISIL flags.