They are both ALPA pilot groups -- combining the seniority lists will be "run" by ALPA according to ALPA merger policy. It worked for NWA/Republic .... kinda.
Conversely ... It didn't work too well for UAL/PAA ...
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Northwest Airlines and Delta Airlines Merger
- Thread starter Ken_gone_flying
- Start date
Conversely ... It didn't work too well for UAL/PAA ...
Technically, not a "merger". NWA bought REP ... with NWA dollars .... lock, stock, and barrel.
Lots of problems w/ a "big guy" assimilating a "little guy", but it worked overall ... if anything, the NWA pilot group was "too easy" and the REP pilot group was just the opposite.
DAL and NWA pilot groups have worked together in the past on pilot issues, I anticipate two similar sized airline groups who respect each other to flow more smoothly.... we'll see.
It's always about $$$$$
Baloney. Who have you been listening to ... ???
I know all the players @ NWA. They're the toughest in the industry. They butted heads with the toughest management groups in the industry. Other pilot groups come to them for advice.
And they/we have been planning an AA or DELTA merge for a long, long, long time ...
I still anticipate "it" going better than most -- chiefly because of the high quality of both pilot groups and their histories ...
phrogpilot73
Well-Known Member
The seniority lists merging is what interests me. Why not just create a new list from scratch based on original hire date with the airline? That seems the most fair way to do it without fucking too many people, but I don't know shit about the airlines other than I have to have my tray table up and seatback upright on takeoff and landing.
Never happen. In a perfect world your suggestion might work, but there's just too many variables with aircraft types, routes, domiciles, pension/no pension, longevity, etc, etc....
For example: why would a 15 year international wide-body captain want to become the junior partner to a 20 year domestic narrow-body captain ... ??? And only because the domestic airline didn't go overseas/fly 18-wheelers???
Perhaps not the best example (I'll try to think of others), but it was certainly a consideration w/ NWA/REP.
Actually A4s, that is a good example, because a lot of the older DAL guys have retired (they went early to take the lump sum). If NWA-DAL went date of hire, it would screw over the DAL guys and give a windfall to the NWA guys.
More likely scenario is a cut and shuffle deal. "Cut" the big widebodies and then shuffle the two groups that fly them together. Then "Cut" the 757 guys and shuffle them together. The shuffle would be based on a ratio of who had how many to begin with (example: if DAL has 700 757CA and NWA has 500 757 CA, then for every 5 NWA guys, there would be 7 DAL guys in a block of pilots.)
More likely scenario is a cut and shuffle deal. "Cut" the big widebodies and then shuffle the two groups that fly them together. Then "Cut" the 757 guys and shuffle them together. The shuffle would be based on a ratio of who had how many to begin with (example: if DAL has 700 757CA and NWA has 500 757 CA, then for every 5 NWA guys, there would be 7 DAL guys in a block of pilots.)
One more thing no one's mentioned -- just though of it myself: future HIRING.
A NWA/DAL merger might hurt potential hiring, at least in the near(er) future. There will be some "consolidation" of routes and capacity, and there's still some "eligible" pilots who bypassed recall and will have to be brought back -- or at least have the opportunity to come back -- prior to any new hiring.
And then there's the regulators and politicians to deal with ... but those "votes" are usually counted long before anything concrete ends up on the table.
Moral of the story: get your Navy retirement, then go airlines. Or do it concurrently ...
A NWA/DAL merger might hurt potential hiring, at least in the near(er) future. There will be some "consolidation" of routes and capacity, and there's still some "eligible" pilots who bypassed recall and will have to be brought back -- or at least have the opportunity to come back -- prior to any new hiring.
And then there's the regulators and politicians to deal with ... but those "votes" are usually counted long before anything concrete ends up on the table.
Moral of the story: get your Navy retirement, then go airlines. Or do it concurrently ...
Listen to him, young ones, for he is wise.
Both airlines have been hiring for a while now. Everyone that was furloughed is either back, gone, or on bypass (still out by choice.)
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Interesting. When I made the stay/go decision by taking the bonus, many of my peers thought I was stupid/crazy for staying. Lots got out. Many (maybe most?) got laid off.
I stayed because I still enjoyed the Marines and military flying, but it's interesting to see that the conventional wisdom is now to stay until retirement. I base that on the posts above and the thread where Hacker took the time to spell it out in terms of money.
I guess it's better to be lucky than good.
I'd be curious to see if there are any retired/retiring career airline pilots that made it through a career without being laid off.
Call it whatever you want, but they are keeping Delta's name. There will be bo more Northwest, there will be Delta.
Man thats going to require a lot of new paint
BTW, I just got a job offer from Mesaba and have a real good friend who's a NW Capt. So I am watching this thing really close
At Hawaiian it is about 50-50. 50% never furloughed and 50% with at least 1 if not more furloughs.
It's all in the timing. There was a Captain upgrade in my just finished ground school that was hired 2 years before me and has never been furloughed from Hawaiian. I've been furloughed twice.
Not me ... I opted for the whole enchilada.
Furloughs, bankruptcies, merger, liquidation, divorce, and flying the past 14 years in the left seat of the Whale ...
I like lots of everything.