Mast, NJP, and The Trouble Troops Can Get In...

[Uncle Fester]

Getting adsep'd is a far cry from "getting promoted" to anything.

I don't think he was saying it is. Just that some of the younger, dumber white-hats think it is. "Dude, I'm so sick of this Navy bullshit. My recruiter told me I was gonna be a SEAL, not a fucking mess-crank! I'm gonna take a shit on the Skipper's desk and they'll kick me out with an ADSEP so I can get out of my contract early. It's not a Dishonorable, no one outside the Navy cares about an OTH anyway. Then I'm straight-up going to go get a recording contract...you know I totally owned everybody's ass at berthing freestyle night, right? That or become an Ultimate Fighter...I haven't decided yet."

 

[Harrier Dude]

It's not a Dishonorable, no one outside the Navy cares about an OTH anyway.

Funny you should mention that. A report being circulated at the Navy Justice School said that civilian employers, when asked "which discharge was the worst" disproportionally answered the OTH.

They said it sounded like it was something so bad that it couldn't easily be explained.

Not that it matters much to any rational employer who has served even a day in the National Guard. Anything but Honorable will get you a job flipping burgers at best.

Unless you get a recording contract or make it big in the UFC, I suppose.

 

[dsimonds]

... gonna take a shit on the Skipper's desk and they'll kick me out with an ADSEP so I can get out of my contract early. It's not a Dishonorable, no one outside the Navy cares about an OTH anyway. Then I'm straight-up going to go get a recording contract...you know I totally owned everybody's ass at berthing freestyle night, right? That or become an Ultimate Fighter...I haven't decided yet."

As a former white hat, that is some funny stuff, but it is freaking true and it pisses me off. People need to realize that probably the biggest reason that they join the Navy is to improve their life somehow. They don't understand how to "suck it up". I think that the mentality of some of the people that the Navy recruits is screwed up and I wish there was a better method to weed them out before hand, instead of them weeding themselves out (which usually happens). A lot of time, money, and other resources are wasted on people that shouldn't be here. You know who they are, we all know who they are.

 

[rare21]

I had a very old acquaintance in high school that joined the Navy then got kicked out for popping positive for drugs. When I heard about the initial separation he was all happy that he was out of that shithole and was ecstatic and said he did drugs so he could pop positive and move on. Fast forward about 6 years and I see him at the local red lobster (hadnt talked to him since he got out). He had a wife (that he actually stole from another buddy of mine) and a kid about the same age as my son (4). He was a security guard working 12 hour shifts watching the trailers for big rigs down by the port getting 6 bucks an hour. Didnt know what to say to that.

 

[JIMC5499]

I have seen a Command go a long way out of their way to slam a guy. I have also seen them go just as far to protect somebody. It really depends on who you are and if the powers that be like you.

 

[Boomhower]

Honestly, if I was PO1 who had a wife, kids, etc, I would gladly take bread and water for however many days over a permanent reduction in paygrade that means less food on the table and whatnot.

Just saying.

I had a Skipper that refused to give out reduction in pay or fines for anyone who had kids. Yet, single guys could get the hammer. Used to piss me off.

 

[Flash]

I have seen a Command go a long way out of their way to slam a guy. I have also seen them go just as far to protect somebody. It really depends on who you are and if the powers that be like you.

While what you mentioned were sometimes factored in, from what I saw what the sailor did to get NJP was most important.

 

[navy09]

I have seen a Command go a long way out of their way to slam a guy. I have also seen them go just as far to protect somebody. It really depends on who you are and if the powers that be like you.

I had a Skipper that refused to give out reduction in pay or fines for anyone who had kids. Yet, single guys could get the hammer. Used to piss me off.

Not that I've got a ton of experience with Mast, but it seems like these issues wouldn't exist under a level headed, fair CO.

 

[Cleonard19]

I don't think he was saying it is. Just that some of the younger, dumber white-hats think it is.

Exactly. I wasn't saying that that's how things were, I'm not that stupid. I was saying how a lot of the people i've seen get a size 12 to ass saw it, at least as it was happening.

 

[BigRed389]

Not that I've got a ton of experience with Mast, but it seems like these issues wouldn't exist under a level headed, fair CO.

The CoC comments can and often do sway CO's opinion. Can make the difference between a suspended bust and losing it on the spot.

 

[Harrier Dude]

I had a Skipper that refused to give out reduction in pay or fines for anyone who had kids. Yet, single guys could get the hammer. Used to piss me off.

The thing to remember is that the CO isn't doing anything. The individual is doing it to himself and the institution is holding him accountable.

Whether the Marine has kids or excess money should have nothing to do with it. The only variable should be the nature and severity of the offense.

Not every commander sees it that way, but that's the way it should be.

 

[Clux4]

The thing to remember is that the CO isn't doing anything. The individual is doing it to himself and the institution is holding him accountable.

I agree with you. But can we find ways to punish the individual without punishing his family. Let us remember that a host of other issues could possibly arise, many of which the command will have to get involved.
From the point of view of the commander that will be involved, I can understand his rationale.

 

[navy09]

Yeah, what's next- paying married people more???

 

[MasterBates]

Family was not issued..

AD2 Jones and AM2 Smith get into a brawl. Both equally at fault. Both found guilty of same offenses.

Jones is married, 3 kids. Smith is single.

Not fair to give Smith RIR and 1/2 pay.. when Jones is not given that punishment.

He fucked up. He gets to deal with it and explain it to his family.

Unequal punishments (leniency just because of dependents) is NOT fair to the single sailors.

 

[Clux4]

Family was not issued..

AD2 Jones and AM2 Smith get into a brawl. Both equally at fault. Both found guilty of same offenses.

Jones is married, 3 kids. Smith is single.

Not fair to give Smith RIR and 1/2 pay.. when Jones is not given that punishment.

He fucked up. He gets to deal with it and explain it to his family.

Unequal punishments (leniency just because of dependents) is NOT fair to the single sailors.

I agree. If you are not going to punish one, then you should not punish the other. I was thinking along the lines of AD2 Jones doing something stupid and not necessarily involved with another person.