Hot new helicopter/rotorcraft news

[Lawman]

It can't be coincidence that all three services (Army, AF, Navy/Marines/USCG) are taking disruptive approach to helicopter/rotorcraft pilot training. And all seem to be reaching similar conclusions.

I've gotten poo-poo'd when I have mentioned this before, but can a consolidated "Defense Flying School" for primary helo training be far off?

God I hope so… if only to wrench it out of the grip of a bunch of decrepit cadre holding the reins and power of what Aviation Branch feels is important.

We do have a buttload of available infrastructure at El Paso now with the reduction of 1AD…. Let’s do this!

 

[Griz882]

We do have a buttload of available infrastructure at El Paso now with the reduction of 1AD…. Let’s do this!

Sorry, that won’t do. The beaches in El Paso suck.
Signed, the ensigns.

 

[Lawman]

Sorry, that won’t do. The beaches in El Paso suck.
Signed, the ensigns.

See I want to put training in shitty places to stop the homesteading comfort job BS that people have in Fort Rucker. You want to teach… you need to be doing it for the right reasons, not because it’s a great place to just retire on active duty.

Way too many of our green suit guys get the ticket of a lifetime to go down there and then just refuse to leave and bring all that “tactical knowledge” to the force.

 

[phrogdriver]

See I want to put training in shitty places to stop the homesteading comfort job BS that people have in Fort Rucker. You want to teach… you need to be doing it for the right reasons, not because it’s a great place to just retire on active duty.

Way too many of our green suit guys get the ticket of a lifetime to go down there and then just refuse to leave and bring all that “tactical knowledge” to the force.

The fact that Fort Rucker is considered a garden spot in the Army shows that you all need to adjust your expectations upwards.

 

[IKE]

See I want to put training in shitty places to stop the homesteading comfort job BS that people have in Fort Rucker. You want to teach… you need to be doing it for the right reasons, not because it’s a great place to just retire on active duty.

Way too many of our green suit guys get the ticket of a lifetime to go down there and then just refuse to leave and bring all that “tactical knowledge” to the force.

OTOH, places like Edwards AFB have trouble finding people willing to work for GS pay, regardless of the impactful and interesting nature of the work.

 

[Lawman]

The fact that Fort Rucker is considered a garden spot in the Army shows that you all need to adjust your expectations upwards.

Less garden location, more garden work hours.

No gunnery, no pulling dumb duties like SDO/FDO (watch), no trips to the field, no Eucom deployments…

It’s almost like getting same pay for a F load less work, and sliding into a 150k year job with a paid off house because you “stabilized” for 7 years…. So when you finally do drop papers because the label on the contracted company may change, but the pilot and maintainer pool doesn’t.

 

[ChuckMK23]

OTOH, places like Edwards AFB have trouble finding people willing to work for GS pay, regardless of the impactful and interesting nature of the work.

Same for San Antonio. An increasing number of T-6 IP's are GS 12, 13, 14 s...

 

[ChuckMK23]

The fact that Fort Rucker is considered a garden spot in the Army shows that you all need to adjust your expectations upwards.

Similarly, Maxwell AFB in AF land.

 

[number9]

The fact that Fort Rucker is considered a garden spot in the Army shows that you all need to adjust your expectations upwards.

"Fort Bliss isn't, but Fort Hood is" remains my favorite aphorism when it comes to Army bases.

 

[FlyNavy03]

I believe COPT-R is a very valuable program that has simply made a mistake by picking a cheap trainer to maximize corporate profits...

That's not entirely true. It has nothing to do with corporations trying to maximize profits and everything to do with minimizing costs. The COPT-R contract is written as an LPTA (Lowest Price Technically Acceptable) contract. That means that the lowest bidder will receive the contract as long as they meet all the requirements (single-engine turbine with glass cockpit). If company A bids $4M and company B bids $4,000,001 then company A gets the award, even if they're in the R66 and company B is offering to do it in the Bell 407.

if I were in the CNATRA office I’d say “You can keep the contract if you dump the Robinson.”

You want a massive lawsuit and GAO investigation? Because that's how you get a massive lawsuit and GAO investigation.

That said, I also believe that if COPT-R renews the contract it will be eventually rolled in to the eventual Army training contract, “Flight School Next” - in short, this is the gateway drug to a service wide helicopter only training pipeline.

I can see where this looks like a possibility, but I've been in on some of the upper-echelon meetings and I haven't seen anything to indicate that anyone is actually considering this. They're copying each other's homework, sure, but no one thinks we could (or should) do it as one contract. The Army and Navy have pretty different goals for their programs.

 

[FlyNavy03]

OK. Can someone give me something concrete on why the R66 is a bad trainer? I understand that they had a higher vulnerability to Mast-Bumping, but that was addressed with the empennage redesign in 2023. I've been in these helos. They fly well, have plenty of power, and have modern avionics (G500 with a GTN750). What am I missing?