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Flight Pay Changes

I would say the exploitation comes from the corporations who outsource their labor to foreign countries… Such as whirlpool, Magnavox, Phillips… Go to Monterey, Mexico, and you will see the logos of formerly proud American corporations on every building.

We outsource our labor to Mexico, then claim those Mexicans are coming North to steal American jobs...the reality is those jobs were stolen years ago by the corporations who moved their plants South.


Read Hard Landing-pay special attention to the sections about Frank Lorenzo.
THAT’S why unions are not antiquated.

Will do; thanks. And it’s a good point. But, I started a business that failed— it was more a side hustle. I was kind of amazed at the entitlement of the few employees... do you believe that the corporations you mention owe anything to anyone other than their shareholders?
Smoke Screen... Expert of an industry that he ain’t even a part of..

Tell more about how bad the Airlines are.. All the while I sit here on my month off thanks to 10 days of my 29 days of vacation. I can’t tell you what 10 years can cost you but I can tell you what 14 years can cost you. $315,042.83. Gross pay for 2017. 196 hours min block CY17

Expert? Very plainly asked questions. The hostility is interesting to me though in the context of my points. I am earnestly, so earnestly, happy for some of my best friends on earth who are now making the $315,000 and not working much. That’s great. I’m saying that kind of largesse would personally makes me nervous because it seems like too good of a deal in a world where the fat gets trimmed routinely, as has happened often in the history of the airlines.
 
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Deleted member 24525

Guest
In one year, you made roughly triple O-5 pay.
You get a pension from your company, a 401k contribution, and if you’re a reservist you’ll get a pension from them too.
Not to mention the opportunity cost of staying on AD.
If you get furloughed? Get back on orders. Or have a side job.
However, you being as senior as you are, a furlough isn’t a reality.
But you’re not worth that much money!

Guess what, Fred, Frank, Oscar, Gary, and Dave aren’t worth the millions they get paid either.
 

scoolbubba

Brett327 gargles ballsacks
pilot
Contributor
What's the upside to staying in? I've watched my purchasing power erode, prodigiously, over the last 4 years. For instance, BAH for Oahu got cut two years in a row. The idea of phasing in 5% housing costs over 5 years? Laughable when they chop 5%....two years straight. Rents sure didn't decrease after they did that, just the quality of housing one could afford.

My responsibilities increase, but the pay does not go up in a commensurate manner. At this point, they need something more than the red white and blue to keep me in. The latest ACIP/AVIP shenanigans were a big fuck you to anyone on the fence, and I hope the brass gets the raw deal they deserve when the full ramifications of the pilot retention crisis come home to roost.

The retirement? If you think the government won't renege on its obligations to service members in the next 20 years, I've got some ocean front property in Arizona I can sell you. The idea that more costs won't be transferred to the member and that you have any kind of stability an a defined benefit backed by the government is retarded. Uncle Sugar will slowly chip away at your 'guaranteed' retirement until you're left holding your dick and a quarter of what you thought you were going to get.

I'll take the certainty of retirements over the next 15 years, getting hired early in the wave, profitability due to consolidation, and the ability to earn enough to be self-insured over continuing to trust the good intentions of our elected officials to take care of me in exchange for 9 more years of turd sandwich good deals and deployments to shitholes so we can shwack douchebags who haven't mastered the use of toilet paper.
 

FrankTheTank

Professional Pot Stirrer
pilot
Expert? Very plainly asked questions. The hostility is interesting to me though in the context of my points. I am earnestly, so earnestly, happy for some of my best friends on earth who are now making the $315,000 and not working much. That’s great. I’m saying that kind of largesse would personally makes me nervous because it seems like too good of a deal in a world where the fat gets trimmed routinely, as has happened often in the history of the airlines.
I’m not really being hostile.. I just feel you’re giving out bad gouge. I also think your data point folks are either doing the airline thing wrong or wouldn’t be happy regardless.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Such a strange phenomenon for someone to try to justify their career decisions like smoke screen. The airlines aren’t for everyone. I don’t know what you do, but I also have no desire to tell you about people I know in your industry and the potential drawbacks.
 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
Smoke-screen,

Beside flying the plane and making sure my pax are safe, I make decisions every flight that can cost the company $10k, $20k, $50k, $100k or more. One divert on a PEK flight is a minimum of $250k.

We are paid not just for the monkey skills but for the responsibility we hold. And a very large amount of financial decision making that can definitely affect the economic viability of the company.
 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
1/3rd of the year was Narrowbody Captain pay. And I’m also still not at the top of the pay scale. I hit the top (year15) October bid month.
To be fair, about $175k of that was retro and contract related. This year will be around $400k.

But also not reflected in that is the one-time $180k payment I got into a medical savings account or the $45k put into my 401k.
 
Smoke-screen,

Beside flying the plane and making sure my pax are safe, I make decisions every flight that can cost the company $10k, $20k, $50k, $100k or more. One divert on a PEK flight is a minimum of $250k.

We are paid not just for the monkey skills but for the responsibility we hold. And a very large amount of financial decision making that can definitely affect the economic viability of the company.

Totally get that. And it’s super valid. Same can be said of drawbridge operator or lock tender making $40k or whatever, on the potential cost side, or many professions on the lives side. It’s not meant to be belittling, remember I am a proud naval aviator and talk about all the time, but the worst non Fenab pilot I’ve ever seen— straddling the line of unsafe, now on with United.

What’s my point? Again that airlines aren’t dumb and they may realize there is a talent— pay gap in some situations.
The title of this thread is “flight pay changes”
And...? It was about the trade off of staying in the navy, which is a decision I get. You don’t seem to get why anyone would do it.
 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
It was about the trade off of staying in the navy, which is a decision I get. You don’t seem to get why anyone would do it.
We get some people want to stay in the Navy, it’s just your justification that is all fucked up.

Stay if you want but don’t try and justify it using dollars. The Navy will always lose.

And belittling us a not with the money we earn is bullshit too.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
What exactly have I said that makes you think I “don’t get” why someone would stay in the navy? Feel free to quote me.

What I don’t get is your apparent need to warn people about the airline industry, while demonstrating a tenuous understanding of it, at best.
 

FrankTheTank

Professional Pot Stirrer
pilot
To be fair, about $175k of that was retro and contract related. This year will be around $400k.

But also not reflected in that is the one-time $180k payment I got into a medical savings account or the $45k put into my 401k.
Mine doesn’t include $21,600 in B Plan and $500 in 401k. And Yes that 500 is not a typo. But we do still have an A Plan
 
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