Do Carrier COs and XOs Fly?

[wlawr005]

Tough to do combat flight these days if you don't maintain nx currency, which most 1310 CVN COs don't.

100% true. We did have an all day combat line (probably the same one you guys did) but if you had to divert or extend it was night before you would get back.

My favorite mission was the first go (0900ish launch) followed by an out-gas fallout which led to us diverting to Incirlik and landing around 1530...followed by 4 hours of bullshit trying to get gas...followed by CAG telling us to come home now. I think I landed around 2100

 

[wink]

Interesting experiences. Ranger and Big E in the 80s, CO and XO never flew. I had a good buddy that was XO on Kitty Hawk and he didn't fly.

 

[pilot_man]

Tough to do combat flight these days if you don't maintain nx currency, which most 1310 CVN COs don't.

It isn't that hard to get night current, if needed. Especially if you are the boat CO.

And I don't know that I would say CAG and the boat CO are equal. Boat skippers are usually pretty senior to CAGs since their pipeline is so long.

 

[robav8r]

During the same TR cruise I referenced earlier, I think the CSG (JAWS Winnefeld) flew a mission and actually had to abort in CENTCOM somewhere. @Recovering LSO may remember that as well . . .

 

[DanMa1156]

It isn't that hard to get night current, if needed. Especially if you are the boat CO.

And I don't know that I would say CAG and the boat CO are equal. Boat skippers are usually pretty senior to CAGs since their pipeline is so long.

Maybe in terms of far they are apart in timeline they aren't equal, but correct me if I'm wrong, but all the principals immediately below the CSG within the CWC are equals in terms of their rank on that chain of command, are they not? They are just responsible for different missions. I don't want to say anything I'm not allowed to say here...

 

[Brett327]

It isn't that hard to get night current, if needed. Especially if you are the boat CO.

And I don't know that I would say CAG and the boat CO are equal. Boat skippers are usually pretty senior to CAGs since their pipeline is so long.

It’s not hard, but they usually can’t devote that much time to flying. My hat is off to those who can, but I have yet to see it. Same goes for the 1310 CCSGs.

 

[BACONATOR]

First CO when I showed up didn't, as far as I remember. The one who replaced him on cruise, did a fair bit. I guess it depends on their priorities and/or desires.

 

[JWL]

Thanks for all the responses. So, it seem that most COs and XOs can fly if they want to. Is it considered a faux pas if they, however? I see some comments that allude to the fact that such flying cuts into the flying time of junior aviators.

And, when the CO does fly, does he fly under the command of the CAG? What does it mean in terms of command structure when a carrier CO or XO flies?

Finally, does an O-6 aviator generally have a choice between become a CAG (or deputy CAG) or carrier CO (or XO)? This assuming, of course, that such an O-6 is even qualified or being considered for both tracks. Is one track considered more desirable than another? I am also assuming that if the goal is to fly as much as possible, it is better to be a CAG than a carrier CO. However, is carrier CO deemed the way to go if someone wants flag rank?

 

[cfam]

It's not necessarily a faux pas, but it could raise some eyebrows if they fly constantly, given that they're taking flight time away from squadron aircrew. It completely depends on the airwing/ship.

There's no change in the command structure when the CO/XO flies. If something critical were to come up, it would likely be handled by the remainder of the CVN's chain of command. The CO/XO aren't under CAG's command while they're flying.

It depends on their professional record up until that point. Aviators go before a major command screen board (when they're O-5s), which selects them for major command positions (CAG, Carrier CO track, Base Command, etc.). In order to be competitive at that board, they need to have been a top performer in their squadron command tour. If selected for CAG, they will first serve as the DCAG, then "fleet up" to replace CAG at the conclusion of his/her tour.

Again it depends...some officers aspire to CVN command, while others prefer the CAG route. One track is not necessarily more desirable than the other, it's largely dependent on personal preference. A CAG/DCAG will definitely fly more than a CVN CO. An aviator has better odds of making flag rank if they go the Carrier CO route vice the CAG route.

 

[wlawr005]

Thanks for all the responses. So, it seem that most COs and XOs can fly if they want to. Is it considered a faux pas if they, however? I see some comments that allude to the fact that such flying cuts into the flying time of junior aviators.

And, when the CO does fly, does he fly under the command of the CAG? What does it mean in terms of command structure when a carrier CO or XO flies?

Finally, does an O-6 aviator generally have a choice between become a CAG (or deputy CAG) or carrier CO (or XO)? This assuming, of course, that such an O-6 is even qualified or being considered for both tracks. Is one track considered more desirable than another? I am also assuming that if the goal is to fly as much as possible, it is better to be a CAG than a carrier CO. However, is carrier CO deemed the way to go if someone wants flag rank?

One thing to consider is that the CVN CO track commits you to two years of Nuke School followed by a CVN XO tour and a CO tour on a deep draft ship before you become a CVN CO. It's 5-6 years of being in/on/around ships and a lot of time away from home and factors heavily into personal decisions regarding whether someone wants to do it.

 

[cfam]

One thing to consider is that the CVN CO track commits you to two years of Nuke School followed by a CVN XO tour and a CO tour on a deep draft ship before you become a CVN CO. It's 5-6 years of being in/on/around ships and a lot of time away from home and factors heavily into personal decisions regarding whether someone wants to do it.

To add to that, there's no guarantee an aviator will actually get CVN command even if they've progressed through that entire pipeline. They could have a successful deep draft ship tour and timing (i.e. no available CVN XO billets) can preclude them from getting a carrier.

 

[Uncle Fester]

Again it depends...some officers aspire to CVN command, while others prefer the CAG route. One track is not necessarily more desirable than the other, it's largely dependent on personal preference. A CAG/DCAG will definitely fly more than a CVN CO. An aviator has better odds of making flag rank if they go the Carrier CO route vice the CAG route.

Is that the case? I always had the impression that they were about equal, in terms of odds of making Flag, but never bothered to look at the stats.

 

[cfam]

Is that the case? I always had the impression that they were about equal, in terms of odds of making Flag, but never bothered to look at the stats.

I don't have the stats to quote, but I was having this conversation with my O-6 CO this week (just picked up major command), and that was the gouge he received from his detailer. Anecdotally, all four of the CCSGs I've worked for were CVN CO backgrounds.

 

[JWL]

Great info..thanks. I guess, for the most part, and excluding some exceptions, an aviators flying career if effectively over if they get chosen for the XO carrier route? It sounds like the DCAG/CAG route is the last flying gig for an aviator?

And, when going to nuke school to learn, presumably, among other things to be a ship driver, do the prospective carrier XOs get instructed by those junior in rank to them?

 

[jmcquate]

Had a conversation with the XO Strike Fighter Group Atlantic (mostly about the PBS gig) he said he still got to strap on a 106 jet every once in a while. He's the president of Tailhook now.