USAF Enlisted Pilots, The Right Stuff, Stolen Bikes, AIC, and SWO pipe dreams.

[RobLyman]

Time to add SWO vs Flyboys and SWO vs H-60S guys to the title of the thread!

 

[Recovering LSO]

I could go on for pages as to how the SWO community is flawed, and for the reasons of FTZ and JSM. But it has nothing to do with parochialism.

The last part of this statement calls the first part into question.

For all the legitimate gripes you can make against SWOs, we wouldn't do something as retarded as to send our people to a totally different community where they will be treated like shit for a few years.

You're right, instead you'd let your "due course" dudes go five years between DH tour and XO/CO. That's good for proficiency - real good. You'd also waste the first two years of a JO's tour making sure he understands the right way to fill out a TPS report instead of learning how to drive/fight his ship, but go on....

Can I name every sensor? No. But I know that Romeos do SSC and ASW. Sierras dream of doing SEAL/PR shit, but in reality, do VERTREP and PAXFER. Is that 95% right?

You really are pretty stupid aren't you.

While I have great respect for our airwings, they are totally outsticked by our peers.

As the kids say, "I can't even....."

SWOs...stand more effectively against our potential adversaries.

Yep, and when you guys can stop running into each other (and others) during NON-combat operations maybe more people will take you and your colleagues seriously. If you want to point to MASON and use that as an example of a ship having its collective shit together, I'll give you that - but that's one example. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath waiting for others.

You're entire community is suffering form a culture/identity problem, and much like alcoholism, it won't get better until you first admit you have a problem. You? You should pour another drink and take a knee.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

This comment was in response to your retarded statement that, "As far as I know destroyers mostly launch tomohawks (sic) and collide with other ships."

I maintain that you are retarded; and that when MH-60S pilots set 'max tactical' they are critical to me getting my Amazon Prime packages in one piece.

Well I guess I am retarded for thinking for an instant a swo posting on airwarriors might have a valid outsider’s persepective to offer. Instead I’ve wasted my time asking you to explain what the hell you meant. Thanks warfighter.

 

[Brett327]

FWIW, this delightful exchange has made my morning.

 

[RobLyman]

It's interesting that earlier in this conversation it was pointed out that your prior enlisted folks have trouble adjusting when placed into a warrant officer role. I have seen the same thing in Army Aviation from folks coming from the Navy, specifically as junior warrant officers. I haven't seen them take well to the warrant officer culture, I think because they have preconceived notions based on their interactions with officers during their time in the Navy. I don't really see the same thing from the Army side, generally their enlisted time makes them well rounded.

Obviously there are exceptions in both cases. It's not just prior enlisted struggling either. I'm a street to seater, and I'll tell you there are major culture problems amongst my peers as well. Especially in their ability to suck it up and deal with the Army side of the job.

Anyways, when it comes to flying an aircraft and understanding the battle space they weren't at an advantage nor a disadvantage to any other aviator.

I agree Navy enlisted sometimes have difficulty adjusting to the Army. But I can't say they are any worse than non-Navy as a whole. Navy commissioned officers reverting to Army warrant seem to suffer when trying to adapt. I think it is equally due to a reluctance to "lower themselves" and a disbelief in some of the incredible bull$hit the Army serves up.

 

[Jim123]

 

[azguy]

Words...

Give it a rest - at least SWOs aren't colliding with each other or "falling out of the sky" all by themselves. In terms of letting a whole community of people get outsticked/behind the curve (talk to your AI for specifics), it's pretty horrific.

 

[Recovering LSO]

Give it a rest - at least SWOs aren't colliding with each other or "falling out of the sky" all by themselves. In terms of letting a whole community of people get outsticked/behind the curve (talk to your AI for specifics), it's pretty horrific.

Ignore, ignore, deflect. A pretty good sign that one’s argument has fallen apart.

 

[azguy]

Ignore, ignore, deflect. A pretty good sign that one’s argument has fallen apart.

Really? Not my intention. Raise your points.

 

[robav8r]

Really? Not my intention. Raise your points.

I notice that you try (unsuccessfully) to segregate and discount the various platforms and designators within Navy & Marine Corps Aviation. We are now, and always have been, one team, working together, across platforms, missions and AOR’s. According to you, the only person/platform that matters is the one at the end of the kill chain. Shame on you shipmate. Your community remains monumentally fucked up, in large part due to what Pickle highlights below, but there are other, cultural issues that I hope someday, gets fixed.

The difference between most SWO JO’s and most Aviation JO’s is we will be able to independently operate with weapons release authority (offensive and defensive) as a LTJG or LT, whereas your basic SWO won’t generally see that until they are at least a DH.

 

[RedFive]

Wrong. You send pilots to ships because you have an arbitrary MSR and are overmanned for flying billets.

You do know that words mean things, right? There's nothing arbitrary about our MSR, the Navy invests a ton of money into us and they need experienced aviators to unfuck SWOland on the back-end because, as you have clearly demonstrated here, SWOs generally don't give a shit about aircraft. There are gems out there and I've been fortunate enough to work for them, but why do you think the CVN is an AIRFOR asset? If that's not the biggest dick slap to the face, I don't know what is. Otherwise they would just cut us loose like the old days, a la Donald Rumsfeld who served a mere 3 years as a pilot.

For all the legitimate gripes you can make against SWOs, we wouldn't do something as retarded as to send our people to a totally different community where they will be treated like shit for a few years.

You're right about one thing, someone with your attitude would be treated like shit at a squadron. Fortunately, not all SWOs are like you. @BigRed389

What the hell does a MH-60S or C-2 pilot know about "weapons or tactics?"

I won't speak for the C-2 community, but your statements about Romeos and Sierras show how little you know about the resources available to you. And even if the only thing helos ever did for you was logistics, you'd be DIW faster than shit through a goose without Supply and Aviation supporting you.

I'm not going to waste any more of my time on you, it's easier to make a few clicks and quote the past....and quite entertaining, actually...

Yeah, as a "shoe," I do know dick about how the CVW works... Whereas those knowledges will come later for you...

Point is... yes, sure there are very, very few rotorheads that have shot a Hellfire in combat or dropped frogmen off in the sand... keep in mind, many, many more SWOs that have boarded a non-compliant dhow/ship or shot TLAMs. But let's keep in real here bro... 98% of the time, -60 guys are picking up my moldy lettuce and 2 month old mail...and we appreciate it!

If you have reports of super awesome shit that Navy -60 pilots are doing, hit me up for JWICS address so I can share in your successes...lol...

You win?

I think the original poster should follow azguys advice and try and go SWO out of HT's, sounds like you will be boarding ships and shooting TLAMs nonstop left and right!! Who knew being a SWO was so intense all the time!

No joke, you're talking to a guy that was a die hard pilot wannabe until that last minute. I totally believe being an -18 driver is the best job you can have as a Navy O... Wasn't worth the risk to me (with no prior flight experience) to go to fight school and get props or helos.

And yes, if I were at HTs, selected for helo, I would absolutely go SWO...or -18 NFO, or Sub driver, or bartender, or...well...you get the point...

I'd standby for some serious flamespraying.

It's fitting that a skid Q&A turned into a contest to find the biggest asshole.

/smilies

Pssssst. Who do you think was covering you on those non-compliant boardings? For the last 20+ years?

And you and your bro's are responsible for unclogging his shitters and giving him hot water, and sucking at those things pretty hard. Whats your point?

I can't figure out if you're being sarcastic, and trolling for attention or...

If you are the subject of your own example...

Either way, good luck to you in your trade of choice. At least those who showed up to flight school, regardless of the outcome, never have to go through life wondering what their lives would have been like if they hadn't passed on the chance to go. A lot gets lost on the internet, but if your posts are a reflection of your personality in public, you likely never would have made through primary. Thanks for stepping aside and giving someone else an opportunity to follow their dream.

You made the right decision... for all of us. Your sarcasm is much more suited for a SWO wardroom, than a ready room.

Amen.
BzB

Didn't mean to piss in anyone's Wheaties... this thread at the level of standard shit talking that goes on in fleet Wardrooms.

No hard feelings...

Just spit coke all over my computer.

Go back to Sailor Bob.

 

[Brett327]

^^Sicker burn.

 

[azguy]

You do know that words mean things, right? There's nothing arbitrary about our MSR, the Navy invests a ton of money into us and they need experienced aviators to unfuck SWOland on the back-end because, as you have clearly demonstrated here, SWOs generally don't give a shit about aircraft. There are gems out there and I've been fortunate enough to work for them, but why do you think the CVN is an AIRFOR asset? If that's not the biggest dick slap to the face, I don't know what is. Otherwise they would just cut us loose like the old days, a la Donald Rumsfeld who served a mere 3 years as a pilot.

The CVN is an AIRFOR asset because their one and only mission to to launch a strike package. Same (kinda) goes for LHD/LHA, which is a SURFOR asset and cycles between Air and SWO CO's. On every other navy ship, aviation is support.

You're right about one thing, someone with your attitude would be treated like shit at a squadron. Fortunately, not all SWOs are like you.

OK, thanks.

I won't speak for the C-2 community, but your statements about Romeos and Sierras show how little you know about the resources available to you. And even if the only thing helos ever did for you was logistics, you'd be DIW faster than shit through a goose without Supply and Aviation supporting you.

This is an absolutely ridiculous statement and a total acknowledgment of what you were so butthurt about a page or two ago. I think I have a near-perfect understanding of what those assets offer me. LOG is absolutely, and perfectly, in your wheelhouse...be proud of what your platform has to offer.

 

[azguy]

I notice that you try (unsuccessfully) to segregate and discount the various platforms and designators within Navy & Marine Corps Aviation. We are now, and always have been, one team, working together, across platforms, missions and AOR’s. According to you, the only person/platform that matters is the one at the end of the kill chain. Shame on you shipmate. Your community remains monumentally fucked up, in large part due to what Pickle highlights below, but there are other, cultural issues that I hope someday, gets fixed.

We're all on the same team dude. My squad happens to be pretty kill-chain-centric, sure. As @RedFive aptly points out above, a $2B warship can be brought to its knees without the right LOG support brought by C-2s and Helos.

Is the SWO community "monumentally fucked up?" No, but we certainly have our fair share, and then some, of problems to work though.

Still, your post wreaks of the guy in the mail room telling the guy in corner office that he is "monumentally fucked up."

 

[Brett327]

Still, your post wreaks of the guy in the mail room telling the guy in corner office that he is "monumentally fucked up."

Nope, no parochialism here. FFS.