Engineering in 4 Years and ROTC

[IKE]

Less than 4 years for engineering? For me? Not a chance? And, how many people in the planet can complete an engineering degree in less than 4 years anyway?

Um, granted it was 16 years ago, but many of my peers and I finished Aero Eng at U of MD in 4 years (I think). I AP'ed out of Calc 1&2, but nothing else. I had the benefit of summer classes to knockout core nonsense, but most of my peers did internships or other things in the summer. Most of the mids were criminal justice majors (they all got aviation, so don't pick your major for that reason alone)

Well, for the test pilot or astronaut route, you need a STEM degree, right?

It might as well be a requirement. With very few exceptions, Navy Pilots have to be TPS grads to get astronaut, and aviators need STEM degrees to go to TPS. It's not strictly a requirement, but unless you have a STEM-adjacent degree from somewhere like USNA (where you took Calc & Physics), good luck.

 

[llap_aviator2992]

Hi everyone, first time poster here. Totally not degrading online degrees, but do y'all think Navy TPS would be receptive to applicants having an online master's degree? I'm in the Navy now, just graduated OCS waiting to enter flight training, I have high goals and am looking around at my options.

I have an online 4-year degree and loved the flexibility and how it taught me time management.

 

[Waveoff]

Surely the answer can’t be “no”.

I won’t be the first to say it, but focus on getting through NIFE and flight training first and foremost. Even when you get to your squadron they aren’t going to want to hear the words TPS or whatever until you get to be a fully qualified HAC, PPC, etc.

Not a TPS guy, but I would imagine they would be more inclined to take someone with a good GPA from a technical major who got a great first tour FITREP, over just your average joe even if he/she happens to have a masters.

 

[IKE]

Surely the answer can’t be “no”.

I won’t be the first to say it, but focus on getting through NIFE and flight training first and foremost. Even when you get to your squadron they aren’t going to want to hear the words TPS or whatever until you get to be a fully qualified HAC, PPC, etc.

Not a TPS guy, but I would imagine they would be more inclined to take someone with a good GPA from a technical major who got a great first tour FITREP, over just your average joe even if he/she happens to have a masters.

IMO, masters is more of a tie-breaker. I wouldn't get one just to apply to TPS, and being 80% complete with an online MS, I'd be wary of the quality. That said, GaTech seems to have a pretty solid distance Aero Eng MS ... a number of NAVAIR engineers are doing that program.

 

[BlueDog58]

Hey guys, I've been keeping up with this thread because I'm in the same boat as mfores. My application package is almost done, but I also have some questions about the new AFA. What is considered good numbers?

 

[flgator92]

Dude, OCS is the way to go, 100 percent. I did it... hated it. But *loved* getting through with my commissioning program in only 3 months when ROTC and Academy folks took four years. NROTC will pay for college, so if you're looking for a college meal ticket, that may be your best bet. If you're looking to just commission into the Navy without somebody footing the bill for your tuition, dorm room, and books, then go to OCS after college. Guess what? OCS doesn't even make you have your fancy engineering degree. And, if you go to OCS, you pick your job and then go before a board for that community to get picked up for the program. NROTC, on the other hand, does not guarantee you a specific job. You want to be a shit hot TOPGUN fighter pilot, you say!?!? Get wrecked, guess what!? You're going to be a submariner, or SWO, or intel guy, or whatever. NROTC can do that (and they do, I've seen it firsthand). They'll rack and stack your performance and give you a job based on that. I honestly think OCS is the way to go. I didn't have to wear a uniform around campus, PT early in the AM, spend most of my day at the NROTC unit hurrying up and waiting, etc. I got to party, drink, date, etc., with my free time. It was a blast. And then I went to OCS and picked my job and got what I wanted out of the Navy. Win-win, bro.

 

[BlueDog58]

Dude, OCS is the way to go, 100 percent. I did it... hated it. But *loved* getting through with my commissioning program in only 3 months when ROTC and Academy folks took four years. NROTC will pay for college, so if you're looking for a college meal ticket, that may be your best bet. If you're looking to just commission into the Navy without somebody footing the bill for your tuition, dorm room, and books, then go to OCS after college. Guess what? OCS doesn't even make you have your fancy engineering degree. And, if you go to OCS, you pick your job and then go before a board for that community to get picked up for the program. NROTC, on the other hand, does not guarantee you a specific job. You want to be a shit hot TOPGUN fighter pilot, you say!?!? Get wrecked, guess what!? You're going to be a submariner, or SWO, or intel guy, or whatever. NROTC can do that (and they do, I've seen it firsthand). They'll rack and stack your performance and give you a job based on that. I honestly think OCS is the way to go. I didn't have to wear a uniform around campus, PT early in the AM, spend most of my day at the NROTC unit hurrying up and waiting, etc. I got to party, drink, date, etc., with my free time. It was a blast. And then I went to OCS and picked my job and got what I wanted out of the Navy. Win-win, bro.

Yeah, I've thought a lot about this. I was back and forth between OCS and NROTC for a while but decided to stick with my guns and go NROTC. They pay for your college, and you still get to have a great time. I'm pretty set on NROTC, especially since I'm neck deep in the application process. I'm still not completely against OCS, but the "free" college is a big seller for me. I'm confident in my abilities to perform as a midshipman and earn my SNA slot, and I know that it will take a lot of work. So you got SNA through OCS?

 

[John Laurens]

Dude, OCS is the way to go, 100 percent. I did it... hated it. But *loved* getting through with my commissioning program in only 3 months when ROTC and Academy folks took four years. NROTC will pay for college, so if you're looking for a college meal ticket, that may be your best bet. If you're looking to just commission into the Navy without somebody footing the bill for your tuition, dorm room, and books, then go to OCS after college. Guess what? OCS doesn't even make you have your fancy engineering degree. And, if you go to OCS, you pick your job and then go before a board for that community to get picked up for the program. NROTC, on the other hand, does not guarantee you a specific job. You want to be a shit hot TOPGUN fighter pilot, you say!?!? Get wrecked, guess what!? You're going to be a submariner, or SWO, or intel guy, or whatever. NROTC can do that (and they do, I've seen it firsthand). They'll rack and stack your performance and give you a job based on that. I honestly think OCS is the way to go. I didn't have to wear a uniform around campus, PT early in the AM, spend most of my day at the NROTC unit hurrying up and waiting, etc. I got to party, drink, date, etc., with my free time. It was a blast. And then I went to OCS and picked my job and got what I wanted out of the Navy. Win-win, bro.

Thanks for the insight. My priorities is getting the best grades possible in college. I also may need to take summer classes to graduate on time, or 5 years if I go engineering.

Having part or all of college paid for is great. but at what expense? If it means graduating with lower grades than otherwise, then is is it worth it? And, yes, yes, I get that there are some amazing people out there who can do ROTC, play a collegiate sport, and get a 4.0 at the same time. But, I am not talking about water walkers. I am talking about the average human here who needs to get a decent amount of sleep each night.

So, to be clear: with OCS, you do not pull the trigger and attend until the Navy tells you that you have a guaranteed slot in flight school or whichever designator you choose should you successfully complete OCS (does class rank even matter at OCS?)? If so, to contrast with ROTC, in ROTC, you can want Aviation, but end in SWO?

Thanks.

 

[FormerRecruitingGuru]

So, to be clear: with OCS, you do not pull the trigger and attend until the Navy tells you that you have a guaranteed slot in flight school or whichever designator you choose should you successfully complete OCS (does class rank even matter at OCS?)? If so, to contrast with ROTC, in ROTC, you can want Aviation, but end in SWO?

ROTC / USNA - You are committing to the Navy. You submit/apply for your preferences early senior year. You may or may not get your choice, though the odds of that are low - ish.

OCS - You apply and are committing to a certain Navy officer program.

 

[John Laurens]

ROTC / USNA - You are committing to the Navy. You submit/apply for your preferences early senior year. You may or may not get your choice, though the odds of that are low - ish.

OCS - You apply and are committing to a certain Navy officer program.

Ah..thanks...very succinct and cogent..makes perfect sense.

 

[taxi1]

Having part or all of college paid for is great. but at what expense? If it means graduating with lower grades than otherwise, then is is it worth it?

Minor rant, and not suggesting anyone follow my advice, but if you aren't taking courses that put you at risk for some B's and C's, then you are leaving a lot of potential learning on the table. I get it, college is mostly credentialing. It's unfortunate.

I give grad students, particularly PhD students, crap all the time for worrying about their GPA. I tell them to take some hard out-of-major courses, where everyone else in the class is (say) a Statistics major and you are rolling in with an engineering or comp sci background. You'll probably get a B because you are missing so much back matter, but you'll get firehosed with a perspective you didn't know existed. Well worth it!

John, keep doing what you are doing and ignore this post.

 

[John Laurens]

Minor rant, and not suggesting anyone follow my advice, but if you aren't taking courses that put you at risk for some B's and C's, then you are leaving a lot of potential learning on the table. I get it, college is mostly credentialing. It's unfortunate.

I give grad students, particularly PhD students, crap all the time for worrying about their GPA. I tell them to take some hard out-of-major courses, where everyone else in the class is (say) a Statistics major and you are rolling in with an engineering or comp sci background. You'll probably get a B because you are missing so much back matter, but you'll get firehosed with a perspective you didn't know existed. Well worth it!

John, keep doing what you are doing and ignore this post.

Taxi, I won't ignore the post as I appreciate all perspectives. I appreciate your point, but we also know that the reality is that for grad school and jobs, GPA can make or break you, especially if you did not graduate from the Ivy League or MIT or Stanford.

 

[Gatordev]

Having part or all of college paid for is great. but at what expense? If it means graduating with lower grades than otherwise, then is is it worth it? And, yes, yes, I get that there are some amazing people out there who can do ROTC, play a collegiate sport, and get a 4.0 at the same time. But, I am not talking about water walkers. I am talking about the average human here who needs to get a decent amount of sleep each night.

If OCS is the right choice for you, by all means go for it, especially if you can get into BDCP, but there's value with ROTC as well, and it shouldn't be discounted. To help put things in perspective with the time requirement...it's minimal at a normal state university. As a freshman/sophomore, I had to participate in 7 hours a week specifically for ROTC requirements. 3 of those hours were mandatory study hours. 4 of those hours were ROTC-specific classroom time. They know those 4 hours add to a course load which is why they also give you the 5-year option as an engineer. The 3 hours of study time includes free tutors, and it's not like you aren't going to be studying each week as an engineering major.

My overall point is that it's a very low amount of time that's actually required of students. By the time I was a senior, that total time didn't change, but the mandatory study time went away. I would just continue to volunteer to be a watch stander for it to force myself to study 2 hours a week.

 

[Waveoff]

ROTC: you want to be an aviator, but you agree to become a Naval Officer first, bonus to have most education expenses paid for. No guarantee of job pathway, but if the prospect of wanting pilot/NFO and getting your second or third choice doesn't phase you in the long run, its a fine option.

OCS: you want to be an aviator first, with unlimited freedom to turn down the military if they cant guarantee an OCS slot for the career you want. You pay for college.

 

[FlyingGator]

If OCS is the right choice for you, by all means go for it, especially if you can get into BDCP, but there's value with ROTC as well, and it shouldn't be discounted. To help put things in perspective with the time requirement...it's minimal at a normal state university. As a freshman/sophomore, I had to participate in 7 hours a week specifically for ROTC requirements. 3 of those hours were mandatory study hours. 4 of those hours were ROTC-specific classroom time. They know those 4 hours add to a course load which is why they also give you the 5-year option as an engineer. The 3 hours of study time includes free tutors, and it's not like you aren't going to be studying each week as an engineering major.

My overall point is that it's a very low amount of time that's actually required of students. By the time I was a senior, that total time didn't change, but the mandatory study time went away. I would just continue to volunteer to be a watch stander for it to force myself to study 2 hours a week.

Gator,
As someone who literally did this like a couple months ago, shits changed. We averaged 12-15 hrs a week of commitments.
We had 8 mandatory study hours (more if you got a C or below in a class) that weren’t tutored, and 4 hours of class a week. Also there is only one mandatory watch standing unit in the nation for NROTC, so there isn’t much forced studying past the 4/C year. This is just the bare minimum.

NROTC isn’t a cake walk lol, thinking that was the first mistake I made. I agree that NROTC would be a great match for John, but that was a bit of an oversell.