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Navy Reserve COVID Vaccinations by October

UInavy said:
Not following a direct order hurts readiness. If those folks get sick, it hurts readiness. There aren’t going to be tens of thousands of separations, at least in the Navy. Look at private sector mandates where timelines are to the left of DoD’s as leading indicators. UAL is a good one. The math works out very well on who you may lose versus the costs of allowing an order to be violated.
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If you want orders to be followed it’s a good idea to issue orders that will be followed. A lesson apparently not learned from covid restrictions which were of course all followed
 
UInavy said:
Not following a direct order hurts readiness. If those folks get sick, it hurts readiness. There aren’t going to be tens of thousands of separations, at least in the Navy. Look at private sector mandates where timelines are to the left of DoD’s as leading indicators. UAL is a good one. The math works out very well on who you may lose versus the costs of allowing an order to be violated.
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Geez, hope the command bonus was worth it. Did they pay you in rubles?

That’s one airline. Now, tell us how Southwest and American are doing with their pilot groups and mandates.
 
SlickAg said:
Geez, hope the command bonus was worth it. Did they pay you in rubles?

That’s one airline. Now, tell us how Southwest and American are doing with their pilot groups and mandates.
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Math=communism?
 
SlickAg said:
Geez, hope the command bonus was worth it. Did they pay you in rubles?

That’s one airline. Now, tell us how Southwest and American are doing with their pilot groups and mandates.
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Dude, the 1500+ cancellations over the last two days are because of ATC. For some reason it only affected SWA though. It will get better when they fire people right before Christmas
 
UInavy said:
Math=communism?
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Nope.

But proudly telling us how effective corporate mandates like "take this medicine you don't want or lose the ability to feed and clothe your family, and put a roof over their heads!" are seems decidedly more Soviet than American, wouldn't you say?

If you're paying attention to the Why are JOs Leaving Thread, add people in leadership roles saying things like that to the list. High up there, too.

I also find it interesting that there’s so many people out there, Naval Officers(!!), who are so angry about military members questioning the mandate. The aftermath of “shut up and follow orders” is not something that has historically gone well for the people telling that to their subordinates.
 
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Brett327 said:
Your argument seems to be that people should be able to choose which orders they follow, or pursue waivers to those orders they don't happen to like. Is that really the stance a Naval Officer should be promoting?
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Negative, if that’s the impression, then I am not being clear enough. We adhere to and carry out the policy… but we also have a responsibility to advocate for our troops and, as appropriate, voice up the chain the practical ramifications of a policy.
 
SlickAg said:
Nope.

But proudly telling us how effective corporate mandates like "take this medicine you don't want or lose the ability to feed and clothe your family, and put a roof over their heads!" are seems decidedly more Soviet than American, wouldn't you say?

If you're paying attention to the Why are JOs Leaving Thread, add people in leadership roles saying things like that to the list. High up there, too.
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You’re describing how orders work. Fairly confident there are exactly zero JOs leaving because of a vaccine mandate.
 
UInavy said:
You’re describing how orders work. Fairly confident there are exactly zero JOs leaving because of a vaccine mandate.
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Ah, yes. The Nuremberg Defense. Go check out my edited post.

I actually know a few who are planning on leaving unvaccinated. We must run in different circles. You should go chime in on the Why JOs Are Leaving thread. I’m sure they’d love to hear you tell them why they’re getting out.

Also, how many SEAL JOs are leaving? Because I heard a lot of them were, but it wasn’t on CNN so it’s not a credible source.
 
Hair Warrior said:
Negative, if that’s the impression, then I am not being clear enough. We adhere to and carry out the policy… but we also have a responsibility to advocate for our troops and, as appropriate, voice up the chain the practical ramifications of a policy.
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There are medical and religious exemptions available, where applicable. Outside of that, I'm not going to advocate for anyone who makes poor choices based on a steady diet of vaccine disinformation. I'm going to do everything I can to persuade those people to follow the order. Other than the aforementioned exemptions, there is no sound reason for not getting vaccinated.

What are these "practical ramifications" of the policy you're referring to?
 
Brett327 said:
There are medical and religious exemptions available, where applicable. Outside of that, I'm not going to advocate for anyone who makes poor choices based on a steady diet of vaccine disinformation. I'm going to do everything I can to persuade those people to follow the order. Other than the aforementioned exemptions, there is no sound reason for not getting vaccinated.

What are these "practical ramifications" of the policy you're referring to?
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Do you not find it odd that natural immunity, which has now been proven to be 95% effective after at least year (because of the limitations of the samples), is not considered as effective as the Pfizer vaccine for our military, which has like a 47% efficacy rate after six months?

Or the fact that some countries have stopped giving Moderna to males under 30 due to risks of side effects, and we haven’t done that for our military, majorly comprised of males under 30?

Do you think those are two examples of vaccine disinformation? I’ve cited them on the other thread if you need that to answer.
 
SlickAg said:
But proudly telling us how effective corporate mandates like "take this medicine you don't want or lose the ability to feed and clothe your family, and put a roof over their heads!" are seems decidedly more Soviet than American, wouldn't you say?
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Allowing private companies to weigh the risk of spreading disease against continued employment is definitely more American than Soviet.
 
Spekkio said:
Allowing private companies to weigh the risk of spreading disease against continued employment is definitely more American than Soviet.
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Funny how these companies didn’t mandate flu shots before this because that would be an invasion of medical privacy.

Is this where I put the GIF of Sam Neill’s look of amazement at traveling from state to state in America without papers?
 
SlickAg said:
Do you not find it odd that natural immunity, which has now been proven to be 95% effective after at least year (because of the limitations of the samples), is not considered as effective as the Pfizer vaccine for our military, which has like a 47% efficacy rate after six months?

Or the fact that some countries have stopped giving Moderna to males under 30 due to risks of side effects, and we haven’t done that for our military, majorly comprised of males under 30?

Do you think those are two examples of vaccine disinformation? I’ve cited them on the other thread if you need that to answer.
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I'm not going to discuss your views on COVID and vaccines. We're all well aware of your stance. I'm here to discuss the policy and how it will be enforced.
 
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