Just curious, are you building a F-18 tanking off another F-18 or are you building a KC-10/135 too?
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Refueling Basket (current) dimensions???
- Thread starter Citation3
- Start date
I spent a bit of time researching and this is the best image I can find. Is it safe to assume this version is one that could refuel a Super Hornet?
Citation, do you have this shot in a higher res? I'd love to put it in my desktop slideshow.
We called it "Hitting the tanker" or simply "Getting gas".
Depends on how much you need, obviously. I'd say average time spent in the basket is probably 10 minutes. Sometimes there are people ahead of you in line when you get there, so you may have to wait your turn. Everything is supposed to be all planned out on the ATO, but that usually goes out the window once everyone is airborne, so managing the amount of gas available (and who gets it) for a theater is a huge job that gets a lot of visibility from the brass.
Brett
TANKER POSIT???
Weapons det -- Fallon -- RAG STUDs
eek -- 1st night tank -- 
....
After the bombing portion of the hop, the flight lead (STUD) was to take the 4-plane over to the waiting 'on station' TEXACO and all 4 bombing birds were to plug.
Lead RAG-STUD called 'TANKER POSIT" ... to which TEX' dutifully replied .. "Point 1", delineating where he was in the tanker orbit according to the pre-flight brief ... and so the flight lead drove us all over to point "1" ... the problem being, TEXACO had flown in the interim over to "Point 4" on the counter-clockwise circle ... makes sense, yea-as???
Soooooooo ... when we arrived @ 'Point 1' ... there was no tanker, of course.
"TANKER POSIT" ...
"POINT 4" ...
So the lead drove us over to Point 4 ... meanwhile, the tanker had flown around the circle to point 3 ... makes sense once again, yea-as ... ???
"TANKER POSIT" ...
"POINT 3" ...
Annnnnnnnnnddd ... so it went for about 2-3 more iterations, whereupon the RAG Instructor riding in one of the planes came up on freq. and said:
"LEAD ... I want you to take this flight and land it. I want you to take this flight and land it back @ Fallon. I want you to take this flight and land it NOW ... I just have one question: do you have any questions .... ????
Whereupon followed some minor 'squeaking' on the freq. in response to the Instructor's direction ... and the flight RTB'd to Fallon and landed uneventfully ... minus some fuel and a night tank-ex "X" in the box.
Years later ... the same former RAG STUD brought an A-6 into the break @ CUBI @ warp-overdrive speed, snapped it in a Shit-Hot break, chopped both throttles off thus shutting both engines down, and he and his below average B/N both punched holding hands across the channel from Grande Island ... the B/N retired ... the pilot later became a Catholic Priest.
Things really DO have a way of working themselves out ... don't they ???
Weapons det -- Fallon -- RAG STUDs
eek -- 1st night tank -- ....After the bombing portion of the hop, the flight lead (STUD) was to take the 4-plane over to the waiting 'on station' TEXACO and all 4 bombing birds were to plug.
Lead RAG-STUD called 'TANKER POSIT" ... to which TEX' dutifully replied .. "Point 1", delineating where he was in the tanker orbit according to the pre-flight brief ... and so the flight lead drove us all over to point "1" ... the problem being, TEXACO had flown in the interim over to "Point 4" on the counter-clockwise circle ... makes sense, yea-as???
Soooooooo ... when we arrived @ 'Point 1' ... there was no tanker, of course.
"TANKER POSIT" ...
"POINT 4" ...
So the lead drove us over to Point 4 ... meanwhile, the tanker had flown around the circle to point 3 ... makes sense once again, yea-as ... ???
"TANKER POSIT" ...
"POINT 3" ...
Annnnnnnnnnddd ... so it went for about 2-3 more iterations, whereupon the RAG Instructor riding in one of the planes came up on freq. and said:
"LEAD ... I want you to take this flight and land it. I want you to take this flight and land it back @ Fallon. I want you to take this flight and land it NOW ... I just have one question: do you have any questions .... ????
Whereupon followed some minor 'squeaking' on the freq. in response to the Instructor's direction ... and the flight RTB'd to Fallon and landed uneventfully ... minus some fuel and a night tank-ex "X" in the box.
Years later ... the same former RAG STUD brought an A-6 into the break @ CUBI @ warp-overdrive speed, snapped it in a Shit-Hot break, chopped both throttles off thus shutting both engines down, and he and his below average B/N both punched holding hands across the channel from Grande Island ... the B/N retired ... the pilot later became a Catholic Priest.
Things really DO have a way of working themselves out ... don't they ???
Must be a training command thing. You'll never hear it in the fleet, I don't think I even recall hearing that at the RAG.
Talk to the tanker? Why would you want to do that? Sheesh... they know where I am.
But in all seriousness, I've never heard them call out points either. They'd just give us a quick BRAA call and we'd find'em that way. But then they weren't really orbiting either... just droning around in the track until someone needed to plug. Then they'd "orbit" while whomever was in the basket (or getting plugged as the case may be)
But in all seriousness, I've never heard them call out points either. They'd just give us a quick BRAA call and we'd find'em that way. But then they weren't really orbiting either... just droning around in the track until someone needed to plug. Then they'd "orbit" while whomever was in the basket (or getting plugged as the case may be)
I vaguely remember something about tanker "points" being briefed once or twice. But it must have been very rare. If it did occur, I never paid any attention.
1. Many tankers rarely really knew where they were anyway. :icon_tong
2. However the really good tankers were easily discernable in-flight from the others , without us having to know the individual pilot/crew.
3. It was always radar, talent, and a RIO, rather than numbered posits... to join on Texaco wherever he may be, even if he didn't know where he was or direction of his orbit.
4. In the clag, at night, and with low fuel, you slowly - very slowly - joined a Texaco straight and level. Then the good RIO would continuously call our declining distance and hopefully corresponding and declining closure rates off our radar to the tanker, until at the last few hundred feet (or less) when we could finally obtain a hazy and dark night visual on the tanker....hopefully.
Always somewhat of tense, methodical, and precision maneuver.... or otherwise, a mid-air collision in the clag, or a flameout. Something definitely not for the weak of heart!
1. Many tankers rarely really knew where they were anyway. :icon_tong
2. However the really good tankers were easily discernable in-flight from the others , without us having to know the individual pilot/crew.
3. It was always radar, talent, and a RIO, rather than numbered posits... to join on Texaco wherever he may be, even if he didn't know where he was or direction of his orbit.
4. In the clag, at night, and with low fuel, you slowly - very slowly - joined a Texaco straight and level. Then the good RIO would continuously call our declining distance and hopefully corresponding and declining closure rates off our radar to the tanker, until at the last few hundred feet (or less
) when we could finally obtain a hazy and dark night visual on the tanker....hopefully.Always somewhat of tense, methodical, and precision maneuver.... or otherwise, a mid-air collision in the clag, or a flameout. Something definitely not for the weak of heart!
I vaguely remember something about tanker "points" being briefed once or twice. But it must have been very rare. If it did occur, I never paid any attention.
1. Many tankers rarely really knew where they were anyway. :icon_tong
2. However the really good tankers were easily discernable in-flight from the others , without us having to know the individual pilot/crew.
3. It was always radar, talent, and a RIO, rather than numbered posits... to join on Texaco wherever he may be, even if he didn't know where he was or direction of his orbit.
4. In the clag, at night, and with low fuel, you slowly - very slowly - joined a Texaco straight and level. Then the good RIO would continuously call our declining distance and hopefully corresponding and declining closure rates off our radar to the tanker, until at the last few hundred feet (or less
Always somewhat of tense, methodical, and precision maneuver.... or otherwise, a mid-air collision in the clag, or a flameout. Something definitely not for the weak of heart!
These days, there's always the TCAS rendez-vous if AWACS/E-2/CRC can't hook you up.
I've has to do an IMC rendez-vous (sans A/A radar, mind you) in 1/2 mile viz - not fun.Brett
Don't know about present capabilities ... but if it helps, the KA-6D and/or any bird w/ a D-704 'buddy store' on centerline could xfer JP4/5 at around 200+ GPM (@ 6.7/6.8 ppg) ... the usable fuel capacity of the D-704 was 300 gallons. [MIL-A-22847 (Wep)]
Catmando said:
HEY!!! I can hear you .... at least we knew where the gas was ...
Funniest thing was when some of the more 'fuel-hyper' F-4 puke-drivers would bang off the cat & call ... "TANKER POSIT" in the middle of their clearing turn ... only to hear an answer something to the effect of:
"Right behind the #2 JBD ... I'll be with you ASAP after I get airborne ...!!!"
citation - out of curiosity, how exactly are you going to put this together, and what are you modeling? Are you going to put each a/c on its own stand, or are you going to put one on a stand and make the hose support the other?
I ask because I tinkered with a KA-6 to A-6 "in the basket" model a few years ago and could never come up with something to use for the hose that would support the model's weight but not look grossly out of scale.
I ask because I tinkered with a KA-6 to A-6 "in the basket" model a few years ago and could never come up with something to use for the hose that would support the model's weight but not look grossly out of scale.
We always knew who the "really good tankers" were, and there was a reason they were good. Case in point: During one particular NATO exercise in the MED, we were RTB from a really lllooonnnggg range bombing mission and it was painfully obvious we were going to be below bingo on the ball. A call to the E-2 to send the KA-6 headed our way was made. Through the smooth coordination between a really good controller on the E-2 and a "really good tanker" pilot, the tanker rolled out on our heading at our twelve o'clock about a quarter mile ahead, at our airspeed and altitude with the basket streaming. We barely manuevered at all, all 4 of us got some gas, and we trapped at just above bingo fuel. And it was the two "really good" crew in the KA-6 we always knew we could count on who made it happen.
LowWingLoad
New Member
You are welcome ...
WHALE ... and WHALE ... CIVIE-STREET or USN ... I have time in both ... and they're both 'da BOMB!!!
I always thought that the A-3 looked massively underpowered for it's size and weight. Any truth to that thought from your time in the seat?