NWA 188: Airliner overshoots airport by 150 miles...

[A4sForever]

.... I know the airlines are big on CRM...shit, they invented CRM... Why is it a bad idea for everyone in the cockpit to be fucking around with something that's not flying the plane? I refer you to EAL Flight 401, Dec '72.

This was the one that finally pulled the plug on flying w/ your head up your ass and was the genesis of CRM, airline-style: United Airlines Flight 173

Some crew members didn't like flying w/ me (Yeah, I know, I know ... ) 'cause I wouldn't let 'em do music, newspapers, books, magazines, crossword puzzles, computers, etc., etc. ... all the usual suspects ... in the cockpit. Others Capt's would -- I wouldn't. The guys who 'needed' that stuff to 'stay awake' were usually the slackers, however ... both in the air AND on the ground, so I really didn't care whether or not 'they' liked my adherence to company and FAA policies.

Who do you think would have fried over the hot coals had there been an incident related to cockpit distraction ... ???

Can you say: the Captain???

Can you say: ME???

I figured I got paid enough to do the job ... and do it 'right'.

Too bad people have to die ... before some guys get it 'right'.

 

[LowWingLoad]

Think someone in one of the two seats doesn't like how the senority list is gonna work now that they are Delta?

Hmmm not bad, had this idea four days ago before the "story" came out, must be all those years working at NWA finally paid off.

 

[Godspeed]

'cause I wouldn't let 'em do music, newspapers, books, magazines, crossword puzzles, computers, etc., etc. ...

I figured I got paid enough to do the job ... and do it 'right'.

Too bad people have to die ... before some guys get it 'right'.

On one hand, I find it pretty outrageous that someone could be so irresponsible while their sole job for a few hours is to get the 180+ lives they are transporting to their destination safely. That is a lot of people whose lives and trust depend on you to do it right, EVERY TIME. Commercial airline pilots are paid a good sum of money (or used to be anyhow), and it isn't to jerk each other off in the cockpit.

On the other hand, I can see how after doing this for many many years, with so many uneventful flights along the same route, talking to the same controllers, dozens and dozens of times in a row, how one could get complacent. I don't think these are bad people, just people that got incredibly complacent. Complacency is an insidious thing.

While I think that a good deal of blame should be placed on these aviators, I would also question NWA's policy and the professional atmosphere that it is supposed to be maintaining.

While probably a big difference from the airlines, I feel that the very few squadrons I have been a part of have done a great job of combating complacency. I actually appreciate the safety stand downs, operational excellence meetings and AOMs, and not because I can just go home and drink beer afterwards, but because I feel that they really do a good job of taking people out of their normal habit patterns and reminding them that complacency kills in this business.

My newbie .02 on it anyhow.

 

[Clux4]

How about this, Pilots and FA's were having sexual encounters during flight and things got out of hand.
It is only a matter of time before their story cracks open.

 

[m26]

How about this, Pilots and FA's were having sexual encounters during flight and things got out of hand.

Which is why they had to fly another 180mi to erase the damning portion of the CVR?

 

[A4sForever]

Which is why they had to fly another 180mi to erase the damning portion of the CVR?

Naaaaaa ... they just had to come back after overflying KMSP ... you can erase the cockpit voice recorder on the deck ... when I first started flyin' the Line, that was SOP when blockin' in at the gate.

Any gate; any flight ... ERASE BUTTON prior to shutting down.

 

[A4sForever]

Delta Air Lines, which owns and operates Northwest Airlines by virtue of last year's merger, pretty much said that the pilots who flew past Minneapolis-St. Paul last Wednesday are going to lose their jobs.

And if there's no satisfactory explanation -- should they lose their jobs?? Yes, so they should ... as they give the rest of us in the profession a black eye. :fight_125

 

[FlyingOnFumes]

"... (and) each pilot accessed and used his personal laptop computer while they discussed the airline crew flight scheduling procedure."

I'm sure that the crew flight scheduling issue has been resolved for them now...

 

[Flash]

How about this, Pilots and FA's were having sexual encounters during flight and things got out of hand.
It is only a matter of time before their story cracks open.

I saw two of the stewardesses interviewed about the flight, for the pilot's sake.......I hope that didn't happen!

 

[BACONATOR]

I love listening to the peanut gallery's comments after an article like this, as I'm sure most do who are members of a professional community which takes a particular, honed skill or a great deal of education and/or experience.

 

[Clux4]

I saw two of the stewardesses interviewed about the flight, for the pilot's sake.......I hope that didn't happen!

Well, you know every now and then these things happen and when you see the people involved you wonder why on earth it happened.

 

[KBayDog]

I love listening to the peanut gallery's comments after an article like this, as I'm sure most do who are members of a professional community which takes a particular, honed skill or a great deal of education and/or experience.

Yeah, so do I.

 

[ryan1234]

Commercial airline pilots are paid a good sum of money (or used to be anyhow)

Wish it were the case across the board... I'm a little suprised it happened to a legacy and not a RJ or Dash - cause if it did, that whole ATP reqs for Regional FOs would be set in stone.

On a side note... I wonder if the NWA guys were in the Guard or Reserve?

 

[A4sForever]

Wish it were the case across the board... I'm a little suprised it happened to a legacy and not a RJ or Dash - cause if it did, that whole ATP reqs for Regional FOs would be set in stone.

On a side note... I wonder if the NWA guys were in the Guard or Reserve?

And as always w/ things like this -- things that get a LOT of 'public attention' ... during the postmortem/investigation we UNLEASH the politicians & bureaucrats -- you know ... to make things 'right' again ...

Northwest pilots' mishap highlights delay in new cockpit rules

Northwest Airlines flight leads to probe of pilot professionalism

Military? Former Military?? I believe the Copilot was a former USAF weenie ... mebbe an O-3. The CAPT is the 'guy' I 'know' ... however, he was a 'baby' when hired, so I'm gonna' say ... one former AF-puke and one nothing. I guess the answer is NO.

Don't tell Hacker I said that ...

 

[ryan1234]

And as always w/ things like this -- things that get a LOT of 'public attention' ... during the postmortem/investigation we UNLEASH the politicians & bureaucrats -- you know ... to make things 'right' again ...

Northwest pilots' mishap highlights delay in new cockpit rules

Northwest Airlines flight leads to probe of pilot professionalism

Ah, the politicians aka "experts" like:

"We need things to be done now," said Rep. Laura Richardson (D) of California. "We have people like myself and many people here in this room who are traveling every single day."

- who are also paying barely anything for airfare and expect the RJ FOs to have Space Shuttle type ratings and 10,000 hours 121 Turbine PIC.

"Pinnacle Airlines Flight 4712 skidded off a runway in Traverse City, Mich., in April 2007. The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) determined that the crew shouldn't have tried to land. "

I remember watching CNN during the recent Colgan crash... one of the "experts" was talking about carburetor ice (!) probably contributing.

sorry...just a rant... I'm still a little bitter about the proposed ATP 121 F0 reqs.... yet no mention about the $1500/mo pay.

guess it's all in the spirit of change