Sounds like a perfect case of pilot error where had you done the procedure improperly (task saturation, etc) and pulled it all the way off, bad things could have happened. But you did it right, and I assumed all turned out well?
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Hornet pilot loses wings over...a videogame?!
- Thread starter Cron
- Start date
Sounds like a perfect case of pilot error where had you done the procedure improperly (task saturation, etc) and pulled it all the way off, bad things could have happened. But you did it right, and I assumed all turned out well?
Yes NATOPS does give guidance. Doesn't mean that guidance works 100% of the time. There have been high speed shaft failures that looked like high sides. I have seen fluctuating instruments that look like the good engine is the bad one, even after doing the NATOPS troubleshooting thing, along with some gouge techniques that helped diagnose it.
I have also had a lowside that if we had followed the entire procedure (Go to lockout on the bad engine) would have most likely caused the HMU to blow apart and then give us a fire, while TERFing on goggles. Of couse my own personal belief of "dont f@ck with the PCL's if the bird is still flying" won out and saved us the hassle. But we did take grief for not finishing the procedure until maintenance had a chance to pull out the HMU and show what had really happened.
You can guarantee that if we had gone to lockout and lit the bird on fire, it would have been blamed on "pilot error" and if we messed up and balled up the bird because we didn't go to lockout that also would have been "pilot error." Damned if you do, Damned if you dont.
To bring out the cliche truck--
"Climb to cope"
"Dual concurrence on ECLs and T-handles"
"If possible, turn an airborne emergency into a ground emergency."
"Troubleshooting stops at 300'"
And a new one,"If she's still flying, don't mess with anything until you're sure about it."
"Climb to cope"
"Dual concurrence on ECLs and T-handles"
"If possible, turn an airborne emergency into a ground emergency."
"Troubleshooting stops at 300'"
And a new one,"If she's still flying, don't mess with anything until you're sure about it."
How about this one: "The degree of 'pilot error' is inversely proportional to the pay grade of the pilot."
I read something called the "shiny switch theory" once.
The switches in the cockpit all have a matte finish on them when new. As switches get operated, they tend to lose the matte finish and get shiny. The vast majority of pilots who have flown the aircraft before you did not need to touch the dull switch, therefore think twice before operating a non-shiny switch. If you moved a dull switch and something bad is starting to happen put the dull switch back to the original location and start throwing shiny switches until bad things stop happening.
For an H-60 example, how many issues are cleared up by cycling the Back-up Pump? It's a shiny switch....
Apparently the inflection point is somewhere north of my paygrade.
Hmm...that's why the Navy calls 0-4s "Hinges."
I don't know if anyone else agrees, but I heard this one all the way back from flight school to the fleet, and when I sat down and really thought about what it meant and the implications of it, it didn't make sense.
I debated this one and discussed it with some people, and I know a few others who DO NOT brief this, like I've chosen not to. Particularly with fires, I am going to complete the EP LONG before I am on the ground. With a time-critical issue (chip lights, transmission indications), as long as the a/c is flying fine, then yes get it on deck as quickly as possible. But for something like a fire, I am certainly not going to get it on deck still burning. Rushing an EP, especially when flyability is involved and CONTINGENT upon the emergency, whether it's fully developed, or the EP has been completed, is EXTREMELY dangerous in my mind and not the best course of action.
I think you're taking it too literally. Why trouble shoot something in a hover when you can do it on the ground? If something is wrong as you're sliding away from the deck, why take a lap in the pattern when you can just set it down on deck and figure it out there?
There's a -60B mishap where trouble-shooting occurred in a hover and a few moments later, the helo was on its side. I'm not saying that was the sole cause, but you get the idea.
Sure, understood. I think it's a blanket statement covering a variety of situations, but I am thinking about a few where it probably isn't a good idea. No biggie, everyone briefs NATOPS a little differently. I was just curious.
Hence the 'if possible'.
Your considerations as a vertrep guy are significantly different than, say, a Marine assault support guy in the friendly desert at 50'.
Case-in-point: A few years ago, our squadron had a bird with a compressor stall in the desert. Since it was a training flight at low altitude, they decided not to dick around with it in the air, and just get the thing on the deck. On the way down, the engine caught fire. They landed, extinguished the fire, and a new motor was installed the next morning. No biggie.
There is no one size fits all approach to emergencies....hence why they pay us the big bucks. My preference is to aviate, navigate, and communicate my way to the ground...if possible. It's worked for me so far.
Your considerations as a vertrep guy are significantly different than, say, a Marine assault support guy in the friendly desert at 50'.
Case-in-point: A few years ago, our squadron had a bird with a compressor stall in the desert. Since it was a training flight at low altitude, they decided not to dick around with it in the air, and just get the thing on the deck. On the way down, the engine caught fire. They landed, extinguished the fire, and a new motor was installed the next morning. No biggie.
There is no one size fits all approach to emergencies....hence why they pay us the big bucks. My preference is to aviate, navigate, and communicate my way to the ground...if possible. It's worked for me so far.
Perhaps it's a different AOR, or the green team treats things differently, but I've been told to treat sand as water out in Durkistan, and the only time you should put down out there is a land IMMEDIATELY. They put it down in the desert outside the wire overnight?