fighters

[kevin]

during the korean war soviet pilots were flying for nk. they bitched because they had to dress like the nk, and resented it so much that they started just wearing civilian clothes. but have you ever met a korean named vladimir? come on! never heard about soviet/russian pilots in vietnam or the gulf, but particularly with vietnam, i can't believe they WOULDN'T have kept there dirty paws out of it. particularly when things started going downhill for us. that's like a kid in a candy store. if it turns out true that speicher was shot down by a russian and it's proven...wow, i cant believe that would do a lot of good for us-russian relations. if russia doesnt have many good pilots right now.....it's probably cause they're still trying to find their way home from all over the world. they've been logging more flight time in foreign aircraft then their own.

 

[Jolly Roger]

Flynavy, you are correct!

An interesting fact is that the we knew that there were Soviet pilots flying for the NKAF against US pilots, but did not want to press the issue because it would probably have fomented into a larger war.

I have refueled and help service a MiG-17F that flew for the Soviets in Europe. It was pretty neat. I was talking to the pilot and he was saying that he did a "dogfight" against a Vietnam F-4 pilot for the History Channel.

I don't rememer who he said the guy was, but that he had no difficulty getting in on the F-4s "6". The MiG pilot flew 16s for the Air Force, so he isn't a stranger to acm. When I see him agian in April I will try to get a more detailed description.

Here is a link to some of my airshow pictures that I took at Nacogdoches and Gilmer this year, you will find a picture of the MiG-17.
http://community.webshots.com/user/thejollyroger

Jolly Roger

Fight to fly, fly to fight, fight to win.

"[I would] Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud."
-Sophocles

 

[bunk22]

The Russian pilot flying the MIG-25 is a theory but it was known there were Russian instructors in Iraq. It is thought that if an Iraqi pilot had shot down a US aircraft, he certainly would have been glorified. If it were Russian, not so much. However, Iraq does put their most experienced pilots in MIG-25's. During the 90's, they attempted to set-up some traps to shoot down a high priority target (AWACS or E-2C). There was a point when they could have succeeded but fortunetly the aircraft that normally would have been flying the track that day, didn't make it to its assigned station. The MIG pilot flying that particular day was an Iraqi and the CO of the squadron to boot.

Jolly Roger, I think question #3 is confusing. The F-8 was designed to use its cannon as its primary weapon but it wasn't designed as a guns only aircraft.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

 

[Jolly Roger]

Jolly Roger, I think question #3 is confusing. The F-8 was designed to use its cannon as its primary weapon but it wasn't designed as a guns only aircraft.

You are right it was poorly worded, as were most of the questions. It was late when I pulled the questions off the top of my head. Sorry, I guess I should have prepared a little more.

I meant what was the last platform designed to use guns as the primary air to air weapon. The later models were modified to carry Sparrows.

Jolly Roger

Fight to fly, fly to fight, fight to win.

"[I would] Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud."
-Sophocles

 

[Fly Navy]

Wasn't the LCDR downed by a SAM? Or was that not totally verified and therefore it could have been Air-to-Air?

Fly Navy
ENS USNR

 

[bunk22]

Originally posted by Fly Navy
Wasn't the LCDR downed by a SAM? Or was that not totally verified and therefore it could have been Air-to-Air?

Fly Navy
ENS USNR

There were no SAM or AAA sites in the area. The MIG-25 was seen by an A-6E flight as well as the CO of Hornet squadron. When the wreckage was found and examined, the damage was consistent with an air-to-air missile.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

 

[Fly Navy]

Ahh ok, thanks for the clarification. You're one hell of a history buff, eh?

Fly Navy
ENS USNR

 

[Jolly Roger]

There were no SAM or AAA sites in the area. The MIG-25 was seen by an A-6E flight as well as the CO of Hornet squadron. When the wreckage was found and examined, the damage was consistent with an air-to-air missile.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

The guy the Lt.Cdr. was flying wing on said that their CO went into a turning fight to identify the aircraft that was not identifying and could not get the AWACS to declare the unidentified aircraft a hostile, so he could take a shot. He speculated that the unidentified aircraft was the aircraft that downed the Lt. Cdr.

Jolly Roger

Fight to fly, fly to fight, fight to win.

"[I would] Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud."
-Sophocles

 

[beau]

No peeking

1. Duke
2.
3. Guessing the F-8 (Last Gunfigher anyway!)
4.
5. Sea Fury

I like Quizes

Finch

GO SOONERS!!!

 

[bunk22]

Originally posted by Jolly Roger

The guy the Lt.Cdr. was flying wing on said that their CO went into a turning fight to identify the aircraft that was not identifying and could not get the AWACS to declare the unidentified aircraft a hostile, so he could take a shot. He speculated that the unidentified aircraft was the aircraft that downed the Lt. Cdr.

Jolly Roger

Fight to fly, fly to fight, fight to win.

"[I would] Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud."
-Sophocles

The skipper went around something like twice with the MIG. He visually ID'ed it as a 25 but like you said, did not get permission to fire though if you read the book, "No One Left Behind," there is some speculation that he was given permission to fire but he had switched freq's. Since the only bad element in that part of the country was the MIG, no SAM's, no AAA, and the damage found on the Hornet was consistent with an air-to-air missile, it's always been assumed the MIG downed him. The guys who know best were those flying that night. I'm getting all my info on that night from a book that could or could not contain bad info.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

 

[Fly Navy]

Hey bunk22,

I remember reading/watching a flight where I think 2 F/A-18's were on a strike mission, encountered aerial opposition on the way, downed them, and continued enroute for said strike, thus proving the multi-mission capability of the F/A-18. Do you remember this flight? The guys in the book/show made a big deal out of it, I remember that.

Fly Navy
ENS USNR

 

[bunk22]

I believe that was the same squadron that lost Speicher. They downed two F-7's (MIG-21's) enroute to the target. CAPT Mark Fox (then LCDR) was one of them and the CAG on the Connie's last cruise? I've heard he's a solid leader.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

 

[jarhead]

the squadron was VFA-81 off the USS Saratoga ... Fox was one of them, the other pilot was a fella several months out of the RAG ... i've had the chance to watch HUD video from both jets

semper fi

Originally posted by bunk22
I believe that was the same squadron that lost Speicher. They downed two F-7's (MIG-21's) enroute to the target. CAPT Mark Fox (then LCDR) was one of them and the CAG on the Connie's last cruise? I've heard he's a solid leader.

VAW-120 FRS Flight Instructor

 

[theblakeness]

yes. The fighter that you are referring to was infact Lt. Cmdr Speicher's jet. When it first happened, the media story was a SAM shooting it down, but there is more evidence to support that a MIG shot him down. There is also evidence however that it may have infact been a blue on blue kill.

If anyone shot down a US fighter the first night of the war, then there would have been news about it somewhere, at least in Iraqi papers, but there was none. There was also a report that an F-15 had shot down what he thought was a over the horizon MIG in about the same area. Nobody really knows for sure, its a lot of here say.

 

[zuggerat]

im pretty sure the naval version of the F-86 Sabre is the FJ-2 Fury