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Ammo matters, who knew.....
- Thread starter Bevo16
- Start date
I remember Perry well. Helluva pistol shot. He was retiring as I was coming on board. I saw him last at Camp Perry in '74. He had gone to work for the Border Patrol and was working out of Nogales at the time. He told some hair raising storys about that area.
7.62 brass, which is usually mil surp, has thicker walls like H60 said, which is a function of the military using the bullets in machine guns. That translates into less total internal volume. The same powder load in a commercial .308 will produce different pressures than in a mil surp brass, usually higher pressures. You can see the differences visually if you load the rounds with the same powder load and chronograph the bullet velocity. The way to use both types of brass successfully and have the same groupings is to build the loads up in the 7.62 mil surp brass until the velocities match the commercial brass, or vice versa. The other option is to use only commercial or mil surp exclusively and build those loads for your rifle.
If you do use military brass you'll have to swage the pockets to remove the crimp. Additionally, the brass can become brittle faster, I heard it has something to do with the annealing process. That's usually not an issue unless you're reloading more than 4 or 5 times, and then you just have to ensure you visually inspect the brass for cracks or any deformities.
Thanks for all the gouge, fellas.
Berdan Primed, chronograph, crimed primers, swage...Jeezus, I have a lot to learn about this stuff.
Oh, and I have no intention of being the guy that reaches between some guys legs for brass. But, if I'm watching him pull bullets out of a box, shooting them, and then leaving without the brass (i.e. me, right now), then I don't see the harm in getting a little free gear. That's what turns me on to reloading. It bugs me to go to the range and see guys with 500 rounds sitting next to them when I just paid $20 for this 25-count box of factory stuff and that's all I have to shoot that day.
Berdan Primed, chronograph, crimed primers, swage...Jeezus, I have a lot to learn about this stuff.
Oh, and I have no intention of being the guy that reaches between some guys legs for brass. But, if I'm watching him pull bullets out of a box, shooting them, and then leaving without the brass (i.e. me, right now), then I don't see the harm in getting a little free gear. That's what turns me on to reloading. It bugs me to go to the range and see guys with 500 rounds sitting next to them when I just paid $20 for this 25-count box of factory stuff and that's all I have to shoot that day.
Boomhower,
Get a copy of the ABC's of Reloading (8th Ed is the current one) by Chevalier. Read it cover to cover. It's a great intro to all things reloading, and I learned a hell of a lot from it. One of these days I'll get to buying the equipment, but it's a fantastic quick reference to just about anything shy of an actual reloading manual. Even then, it also does a great job of explaining all the data in the various manufacturer's manuals. Most Barnes and Nobles will carry it in the sporting section, or you can order it.
Get a copy of the ABC's of Reloading (8th Ed is the current one) by Chevalier. Read it cover to cover. It's a great intro to all things reloading, and I learned a hell of a lot from it. One of these days I'll get to buying the equipment, but it's a fantastic quick reference to just about anything shy of an actual reloading manual. Even then, it also does a great job of explaining all the data in the various manufacturer's manuals. Most Barnes and Nobles will carry it in the sporting section, or you can order it.
Even though I don't reload (yet) I still collect brass. Especially for calibers I shoot a good bit of like 5.56, 7.62, .45 and calibers I'd like to shoot more of like 6.8 SPC. I'll get around to it sooner or later. I'll probably start with 6.8 as that's the most expensive thing I shoot.
ryan1234
Well-Known Member
I really want to get into reloading, but haven't made the step towards getting the equipment (just continue to spend a stupid amount of money on new stuff). I do collect all of my brass - which a few guys around the range get kinda bent out of shape if you do - 'stealing' your brass from them. Usually put it right back in the box it came from, don't know if that'll do any good - but it sounds good.. have a lot of 7.62/.308 .45 and 5.56 brass just stacked up here.
The information on this forum has been really useful - thanks guys!
A couple more good sources on the web for reloading info that I use.
http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/
http://www.benchrest.com/forums/
http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/
http://www.benchrest.com/forums/
Temperature matters too...
I made another range trip today, and I would call it a success. After doing a lot of reading over the week and thinking about what was causing my "fliers" I came up with a strategy to minimize those problems. Here are the results:
Some of the targets for the day. The one on the right is 10 shots, rapid fire, and measured .9 MOA.
This one is the best of the day:
This 5 shot group measured .6 MOA, and used 168gr Federal Gold Medal Match.
To eliminate fliers, I put a "warm up" target below the one I was scoring and would shoot 2 rounds of surplus ball ammo to warm up the barrel. That pretty much eliminated the first shot going all wild, and made me much happier with my groups.
OBTW, Black Hills 168gr moly coated match ammo sucks donkey balls. I have an extra box that I will either sell or give away. My old ass military surplus ammo outshot the Black Hills match stuff.
I made another range trip today, and I would call it a success. After doing a lot of reading over the week and thinking about what was causing my "fliers" I came up with a strategy to minimize those problems. Here are the results:
Some of the targets for the day. The one on the right is 10 shots, rapid fire, and measured .9 MOA.
This one is the best of the day:
This 5 shot group measured .6 MOA, and used 168gr Federal Gold Medal Match.
To eliminate fliers, I put a "warm up" target below the one I was scoring and would shoot 2 rounds of surplus ball ammo to warm up the barrel. That pretty much eliminated the first shot going all wild, and made me much happier with my groups.
OBTW, Black Hills 168gr moly coated match ammo sucks donkey balls. I have an extra box that I will either sell or give away. My old ass military surplus ammo outshot the Black Hills match stuff.
I go out of my way to sight in a rifle with a cold barrel. Reasoning is your first shot will always be "cold". When sighting in a hunting rifle, I shoot, wait, shoot just to make sure I'm shooting out of a cold barrel.
Just my method Bevo, not saying you are wrong.
Just my method Bevo, not saying you are wrong.
Just out of curosity were you shooting Black Hills blue or red box? I'm not sure that it matters but I think the red box is new and the blue box is loaded using previously fired brass. I've never shot much of either.
I plan on employing this method with my hunting ammo once deer season gets closer. The range I am a member of has high power rifle shoots every month, and I am going to start shooting in those so I need to be tuned to shoot several rounds in a row. I appreciate the wisdom though.
Red box, and it had the "moly" coating on the rounds. Whatever that stuff does, my rifle hates it.
I had the same experience with some Black Hills red box 5.56 Moly. Black Hills has a rep for making fine ammo but I've got no use for that moly coating. All it did for me was make a mess.
My reloading bench came into being this afternoon. When I woke up this morning, all of this stuff was in about 7 different boxes (not counting the beer). I have right at $1,000 in this set up, and that includes 500 Sierra Match/Game King bullets that are not pictured. I already have plenty of brass, so this will have paid for itself by the time I order bullets again.