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What Happens If You Can't Land on a Carrier?

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Since I’m part of the crew that helps train these pilots…
Really? Not going to pile on here, but what you offered in the thread that I commended on was way, way off the mark. No big deal, just some friendly professional advice about speculating about something you don't know that much about in a room full of folks who do. Enough said.
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
I responded accordingly. I never came in here like “no it all” regardless of where I come/came from.
No, we clearly know you don't know it all. That's OK, no one knows it all.
This conversation can go one of two ways.. ?

Oh, please do tell!

Edit, I see this has been played out. Welcome to the site. Looks like you've gotten your dose of humble pie welcome as is the case for many newcomers here and any ready room in the fleet.
 
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sevenhelmet

Low calorie attack from the Heartland
pilot
There's the barricade too:


Never saw that before. Thanks.

Was Oyster the guy who took the cat shot with the track seals still installed, thereby FODing both motors? If it's the same guy, he lost the left engine completely, and the right wasn't entirely happy either (evidenced by "tipping over- shit! Compressor stall!"). The rest of the story goes like this: Oyster had punched out once before, and barricaded in order to avoid having to do it again... that's the way I heard it, anyway.

Either way, the balls to stick with the jet when you're being told to eject, and how cool he sounded on the radio- My hat's off. I might have given that one back, had I ever faced a similar situation.
 

ea6bflyr

Working Class Bum
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Never saw that before. Thanks.

Was Oyster the guy who took the cat shot with the track seals still installed, thereby FODing both motors? If it's the same guy, he lost the left engine completely, and the right wasn't entirely happy either (evidenced by "tipping over- shit! Compressor stall!"). The rest of the story goes like this: Oyster had punched out once before, and barricaded in order to avoid having to do it again... that's the way I heard it, anyway.

Either way, the balls to stick with the jet when you're being told to eject, and how cool he sounded on the radio- My hat's off. I might have given that one back, had I ever faced a similar situation.
Here's the story as told by Oyster: https://tailhookdaily.typepad.com/tailhook_daily_briefing/2008/08/a-pearl-from-oy.html

" Oyster, here. This note is to share with you the exciting night I had the other month.

So There I was .
. . manned up with pins pulled on the hot seat for a 2030 night launch on the Hornet about 500 miles north of Hawaii. I taxied off toward the carrier's island where I did a 180 and got spotted on Cat # 1. They lowered my launch bar into position and the take-off routine began. On the run-up, all systems appeared to be ' in the green.'

image

After waiting the requisite 5 seconds to make sure all my flight controls were okay, I turned on the exterior lights, then shifted my eyes to the catwalk to watch the deck edge dude move his head while clearing me, left and right.

With the back of my helmet, I touched the head rest for . . what was coming.


image
The Hornet cat shot is pretty impressive. Particularly at night. As the cat fired, I clicked in both afterburners . . and I am along for the ride. But just prior to the end of the stroke . . there's a huge flash with a simultaneous B-O-O-M !

My little pink body was doing 145 knots or so just 100 feet above a black Pacific.

The aircraft stabilized . . except for the airspeed, which was quickly degrading below 140 knots. I raised my gear, but the throttles would not move any further forward despite my
Schwarzze-negerian efforts to force them.

From out of the ether, I hear a radio voice say . . a single word :

' JETTISON
! '

Rogered that ! And a nanosecond later, my two drop [ fuel ] tanks, plus a 4,500 pound MER were punched seabound. The airplane leapt a bit higher.

But not enough.

Now I'm about a mile in front of the boat at 160 feet and with the airspeed fluctuating from 135 to 140, when the command radio comes up with SECOND loud and clear single-word sentence . .

" EJECT ! "

But the [ thing's ] still flying, so I respond . " NOT YET ! I've still got it."

Four miles in front of the boat, I take a peek at my engine instruments and notice my left engine doesn't match the right ... big time. It's funny, how a quick glimpse can get acid-etched ' into your brain. Even though I'm still doing the Ah-Nold thing on its throttle position, the left motor's RPM reads precisely 48%. And about that time . I get a repeat urgent call :

" EJECT ! "

" Nope ! . it's still flyin.' "

At 5 1/2 miles out, I asked Tower to please get the helo headed my way as I truly thought I was going to be ' shelling out. '

At some point, I thought it'd probably be a good idea to start dumping some gas. But as my hand reached down for the dump switch, I actually remembered a NATOPS PROHIBITION against dumping fuel with the after-burners blowing.

After a second or two contemplating the threat of the unnecessary fuel weight vs the possibility of blowing myself up . . I flipped the FUEL DUMP valves open.


INSTANTLY . A SIXTY FOOT ' ROMAN CANDLE ' . . trailed along BEHIND!

At seven miles, I started a tiny climb to get a little breathing room from the sea close below, as CATCC Control chimes in with a downwind heading for the landing pattern . . [ With owl-like eyes ] I'm like : " Oooh . what a good idea." So, I throw down my tail hook.

Eventually, I get the aircraft headed downwind to the boat at 900 feet and ask for a Tech Rep. While waiting, I shut down the bad left engine.

In short order, I hear Scott " Fuzz " McClure's voice. I tell him : ' Okay Fuzz, my gear's up . . my left motor's off . I'm only able to hold altitude by using minimum afterburner. And every time I try to come out of afterburner I start heading down.'

I just continue trucking away downwind . . trying to stay level . . and keep dumping fuel. It seemed like I'd been in afterburner for around fifteen minutes.

At ten miles or so, I'm down to 5,000 pounds of gas and start a 180 back toward the ship. I don't intend to land, but I just don't want to get too far away.

Of course, as soon I as I stuck in a small amount of bank . . I start dropping like a stone. So I end up just making a shallow bank turn giving me a 5 mile radius around the boat.

Fuzz is reading me the single engine rate of climb numbers from the 'book' and it doesn't take us long to figure out that things aren't adding up. One of the things I'd already learned about the F-18 Hornet is that it's a perfectly good single engine aircraft . . flies great on one motor.

So why do I now have to use the ' blower ' just to stay level ?

By this time, I'm talking to the Deputy CAG and CAG who's now up on the bridge with the Captain. And we decide I need to climb to 3,000 feet, then ' dirty up' with gear and flaps to see if I'm going to have the excess power required to shoot a night approach. So, I get headed downwind . . went full burner and eased up into a weak climb on my 46 % RPM motor.

Eventually it makes it to 2,000 feet where I leveled out below puffy clouds that were magnificently silhouetted against half a moon which was really - really cool. Then I started a turn back toward the boat, threw the gear down, then pulled the weak engine out of ' blower.'

Remember that flash/boom . . that started this little tale ?
[ Repeat it here ] . . .

FLASH BOOM !

I jam the engine back into afterburner. And after three or four HUGE compressor stalls and the accompanying deceleration, the motor comes back on again . . at 46% RPM.

I'm thinking my blood pressure was probably up . . and for the first time, I notice that my mouth had no saliva.

At this point I'm looking at the picket ship in front of me, at about two miles, and I transmit to no one in particular : " You need to have the picket ship hang a left right now. I think I'm gonna be outta here in a second."

I said the words calmly but with meaning. Instantly, the picket ship pitched out of my way. Ha! That scored points with the heavies. Ha! Here I am among jocks who deadstick crippled airplanes away from orphanages and puppy stores. It's funny how quickly the mind can multi-focus under duress.

OK, so I'm dirty and I get it back level to pass a couple miles up the boat's star-board side. I'm still in minimum blower and my fuel state is now about 2,500 pounds. Hmmm. I hadn't really thought about running out of gas.

Now . . I've got to muster up the gonads to pull that motor out of blower again . here we go !


FLASH B-O-O-M !

I'm thinking that I'm gonna end up punching out and tell Fuzz at this point :

" Dude, I really don't want to try that again." Don't think everyone else got my meaning . . but he chuckled.

Eventually I discover that even the tiniest throttle movements will cause the flash/boom so I'm trying to be as smooth as I can.

I'm downwind a couple miles when CAG comes up and says, " Oyster,we are going to rig the barricade."


image

Remember, CAG's up on the bridge watching me fly around making blower donuts in the sky. He's also thinking I might run outta fuel. And by now I've told everyone who's listening that there a better than average chance that I'm going to be ejecting. And the entire time, in the darkness below, the helicopter bubbas - God bless 'em - have been following me around.

I continue downwind and again, sounding more calm than I probably was, I called the LSO : " Paddles . . you up ? "


image
"Yes, go ahead " replies ' Max' Stout, one of our LSO's. " Max, I probably know most of it , but do you want to ' shoot me ' that barricade briefing ?"

So, in about 5 seconds . . he went from expecting me to just ' punch out ' . . to my requesting a briefing for engaging the barricade . . and it was probably causing him to borderline hyperventilate. On the other hand, his response in a calm voice was awesome to hear . . just the kind of voice you would want to hear.

And at nine miles I say, "If I turn now will ' it ' be up when I get there ? I DO NOT WANT TO GO AROUND ! "

"It's going up right now, Oyster. Go ahead and turn."

"Turning in now. Say your final bearing." "Zero six three," replies CATCC.

" OK, I'm on a four degree glide slope and I'm at 800 feet. I will intercept glide slope at about a mile and three quarters . . then reduce power. "
Seconds later, I reduced power : Flash BOOM !

Out of fear . . I added power !

Oops . going TOO HIGH !

Pull power. Flash BOOM !

Out of fear I add more power. Ooops . . GOING HIGHER !

* Flashback to LSO school :" Today's lecture will be on your making a single- engine approach to the barricade. Just remember . .the ONE PLACE YOU REALLY - REALLY don't want to BE IS : TOO HIGH [ then catch the top of the barrier with your landing gear ! ]

I start to set up a faster than desired sink rate the LSO hits the wave-off night lights." Very timely too. I stroke the AB and cross the flight deck with my right hand on the stick and my left poised to reach down and grab the little yellow and black ejection handle between my legs.


image
No worries. I cleared that sucker by at least ten feet. By the way my fuel state at the ball call was [now low] at 1.1. As I slowly climb out I punched the radio button saying . . again to no one in particular : " I can do this." I'm in blower still and CAG says, " Turn downwind and after you get turned around, Oyster, this is gonna be your last look [ at the boat down here in the dark ] so [ with that in your instrument reading mind ] you can turn in as soon as you're comfortable."

I flew the DAY pattern and I gave away about 200 feet in the turn. Then like a total dumb head, I come off instruments and take peek out as I get on centerline and " that ' NIGHT THING ' about feeling that I'M TOO HIGH ! . . grabbed me by the throat. So, in error, I pushed down toward the dark water, close below.

I got kinda irked at myself then as I realized I would now be intercepting the four degree glide slope in the middle . with a flash/boom every several seconds all the way down. Last look at my gas was 600-and-some pounds [ 100 gallons ] at a mile and a half.


" Where am I on the glide slope, Max ?" I ask. I know I'm low because my ILS needle is waaaay up there. I can't remember what the response was, but by now the ball's shooting up from the depths.

I start flying it but before I get a chance to spot the deck I hear : " Cut, cut, CUT !" I'm really glad I was a ' Paddles' for so long because my mind said to me : " Do what he says Oyster ! " And I pulled it back to idle.

My hook hit 11 paces from the ramp. I hit the deck . skipped the one, the two and snagged the three wire and rolled into the barricade just 13 inches right of centerline.

Once stopped, my vocal cords involuntarily shouted, " VIC-TORY ! " The deck lights came on bright . . and off to my right there must have been a . . ga-zillion cranials and eyes watching.

You could hear a huge cheer across the flight deck. After I open the canopy and the first guy I see is our huge Flight Deck Chief named Richards. And he gives me the coolest personal look . . and then two thumbs up.


I will remember all of that forever.


P.S. You're probably wondering what gave motors problems. When they taxied that last Hornet over
clip_image001
the catapult .. they forgot to remove a section or two of the rubber cat seal. When the catapult shuttle came back to hook me up, it removed the cat rubber seal which was then inhaled by both motors during my catapult stroke.

Left engine basically quit even though the motor is in pretty good shape. But it was producing no thrust and during the wave-off one of the LSO's saw "about thirty feet" of black rubber hanging off the left side of the airplane.

The right motor .. the one that kept running . . had 340 major hits to all engine stages. The compressor section is trashed . . and best of all . . it had two pieces of the cat seal [ one 2 feet and the other about 4 feet long ] sticking out of the first stage and into the air intake. God Bless General Electric !

By the way, maintenance data showed that I was not fat on fuel -- I had 380 pounds ( 61 gallons) of gas when I shut down.

Again, remember this particular number as in ten years of story tellin' when it will surely be . . ' FUMES MAN . . FUMES . . I TELL YOU ' !

Oyster, out."
 

Rtjenkins

Ricky Jenkins
No, we clearly know you don't know it all. That's OK, no one knows it all.


Oh, please do tell!

Edit, I see this has been played out. Welcome to the site. Looks like you've gotten your dose of humble pie welcome as is the case for many newcomers here and any ready room in the fleet.
I’ve been public for a months, but air warriors I have been on for years.
I dont boast of how much I know, nor am I moved of how much I don’t know. This site can be helpful for new and old personnel. I have questions and answers just like anybody. 2nd if I have to fact check someone, there are several ways to do that. Based on your response to me without answering the original question, attempted to handle me and I am not that person. I responded. I said what I said, nothing else needs to be said after that. The question could have been answered and noted* and we could have been amongst other things.. Now what conversion are you willing to have
 
I’ve been public for a months, but air warriors I have been on for years.
I dont boast of how much I know, nor am I moved of how much I don’t know. This site can be helpful for new and old personnel. I have questions and answers just like anybody. 2nd if I have to fact check someone, there are several ways to do that. Based on your response to me without answering the original question, attempted to handle me and I am not that person. I responded. I said what I said, nothing else needs to be said after that. The question could have been answered and noted* and we could have been amongst other things.. Now what conversion are you willing to have
yourenothatguypal.jpeg
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
I’ve been public for a months, but air warriors I have been on for years.
I dont boast of how much I know, nor am I moved of how much I don’t know. This site can be helpful for new and old personnel. I have questions and answers just like anybody. 2nd if I have to fact check someone, there are several ways to do that. Based on your response to me without answering the original question, attempted to handle me and I am not that person. I responded. I said what I said, nothing else needs to be said after that. The question could have been answered and noted* and we could have been amongst other things.. Now what conversion are you willing to have

If I had better internet right now, I'd post a meme of a joke going over your head. Do you know which one I meant? No?
 

OscarMyers

Well-Known Member
None

villanelle

Nihongo dame desu
Contributor
Sometime over a beer, I shall tell you all a story about how I set JoBoy up with a friend of mine, who was just out of a relationship and looking for... something casual, which worked well for someone who was leaving for Guam in a few months. Also, I am pretty sure I saw him at Mongolian BBQ night in Atsugi about 4 years ago, which made me think he was probably FTS or SELRES since many of those people passed through and he certainly wasn't assigned to Atsugi. I didn't approach to confirm the identity though.
 
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