What
Makes sense to me. There’s an easy place to streamline the system.
-
Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?
Go here:
Edit Account Details and Profile
The SHOW: Airlines still a "good gig"??
- Thread starter A4sForever
- Start date
I have a number of my reservists in town for their AT, so I'm just parroting what they have shared from their respective companies - but was told Delta and United guys were told that it's done. We'll see of course. Clearly feel good and simply for optics. The dynamics are fascinating to me as an outsider.
My money guy says I’ve squandered too much coin on Speedmasters and have to fly as long as possible - so…no.
Question for anyone at THE SHOW regarding short call reserve.
I currently live approximately 2.5 to 3.5 hours away from a major domicile. If go the airline route I'd like to do everything possible to keep my current home and not move. I'm not opposed to being flexible - i.e. prepositioning temporarily to be within the required recall time.
Is living 2.5 to 3.5 hours away realistic knowing that if hired I would be on short call reserve for some time? How many days during a month are you on short call? When you're on short call can you preemptively look at future trips one or more days out that someone dropped and try to pick up them (trying to increase predictability)? Does seniority affect your ability to do this or is it first come? Any other advice?
Thank you.
I currently live approximately 2.5 to 3.5 hours away from a major domicile. If go the airline route I'd like to do everything possible to keep my current home and not move. I'm not opposed to being flexible - i.e. prepositioning temporarily to be within the required recall time.
Is living 2.5 to 3.5 hours away realistic knowing that if hired I would be on short call reserve for some time? How many days during a month are you on short call? When you're on short call can you preemptively look at future trips one or more days out that someone dropped and try to pick up them (trying to increase predictability)? Does seniority affect your ability to do this or is it first come? Any other advice?
Thank you.
All that depends a bit on company. What company/base are we talking about
This is just tragic - is this about the influx of new and inexperienced ramp crews? This is twice in under a year. Crazy.
www.ksat.com
Investigation underway after airline crew member dies at San Antonio International Airport
Authorities are investigating after an airline crew member died at the San Antonio International Airport Friday night.
Dude, it’s still a pilot’s hiring market. Short call reserve would legitimately be a dealbreaker for me. I’d sooner go to a fractional or Part 135 carrier than deal with that.
If you really have such deep roots somewhere that you can’t move closer to base, you need to consider a crashpad. Unless things have changed recently, short call reserve means notification to INSIDE security within 3-4 hours. That’s not realistic with you living 2.5 to 3.5 hours from your base.
Short call is company dependent. In general, 2-4 hours you need to be ready to launch. So, if on short call, not doable in your situation. Especially if you’re on probation. You might be able to request trips in whatever uncovered flying is available while on reserve. That makes the logistics easier and more predictable if you’ll be on reserve awhile.
A 3 hour drive to a line is doable. I’d rather do that than commute 1 hour to a line by air. If hiring stays steady the way it has been, maybe you’re not on reserve for long and can hold a line.
Really? Short call reserve doesn’t last forever. Seems a bit short sighted.
I‘d echo what others have said….this is so totally company dependent, you’d get half a dozen different conflicting answers. What is the callout time required? What defines “reported”? Does this company have airport standby? Can you bid for open time trips while on short call? The answers to all these questions are different in some way at each airline. My particular company has 2.5 hr short callouts. That means you need to be at the airport (not necessarily through security) in 2:30 from the notification. We don’t do airport standby/reserve. And we arent able to pick up trips in a short call status (though long call can). Typically the min callout is pretty rare. It only happened to me once during the 2-3 months I stood reserve after coming off OE. Normally it was more like an 8-14+ hour notification. We can move our reserve days around, though IIRC, you can’t move days if it will make less than three consecutive days on your existing schedule. 12 days off per month, normally in one 5 day stretch, one 3 day stretch, and two x two day stretches. But regardless of the rules where you are applying, if you can’t be at wherever you need to be within the min callout, you need to figure out another plan (crashpad, etc).
yeah this. If you want to do the job (mainline 121) it is a fact of life, at least for a short time. Or maybe not, if where you go, reserve is senior (some places it is)
Was looking at LAX or ONT. I didn’t have a specific company in mind yet. I needed to start researching differences.
Is there a place where all the things mentioned as variables for each company are located and easily comparable?
Airline Pilot Central is probably a decent place to start, as much as I hate to say it. There’s nuggets in the sea of garbage on the forums there. It’s contract season though, so rules/variables today may change tomorrow.
Airline Pilot Central Forums
Airline Pilot Central - The best information portal for active and future airline pilots
www.airlinepilotforums.com
No.
The scheduling, QOL, etc... specifics of each company are complex and different. This is one reason why contract negotiations are so difficult.
Here's United Airlines short call in a nutshell.
- it's a 2.5 hour call out. That means you get a call... and you are expected to be at the jet as soon as 2.5 hours later.
- if they call me at 0200 on a Sunday morning, I can be there in 2+15.
- if they call me on a Sunday afternoon in July, it might take me 4+ hours.
- however, UAL has a provision in our contract that accounts for traffic delays. This is not something I'd challenge during my year on probation, however.
- I have a friend who lives by me that got called on a Sunday afternoon. He told them he'd be there in 4 hours. Crew Desk said "but you are required to be there in 2.5!" He replied "with Sunday traffic, it isn't happening." Crew Desk said "Nevermind!", hung up, and apparently called someone else. He never heard another thing about it.
- if assigned short call, it's for a 14-hour window. If you don't get called during this window, you are released back to long call, and you go to the "back of the line" as far as getting looked at for an assignment.
I know plenty of guys that live near me that, if assigned Short Call during their probationary period, would drive to a location about 60-90 minutes from SFO and hang out. One good location is Travis AFB: they would go workout at base gym, hit the commissary for non-perishable goods, go to library, go for a walk, etc...
With hiring the way it is now, you will not stay on narrowbody reserve very long. And as a line holder, Long and Short Call don't exist for you. If you get a widebody, you will have to deal with occasional short call since it will take longer to get off reserve.
At United, everyone's monthly schedule is an 18-day Long Call schedule (12 hour call out). Short Call is assigned day by day. Pilots can volunteer to pick up Short Call. Whatever is left gets assigned, based on when you were last used. My neighbor picks up just about every Short Call he can, so it's not a bad deal for everyone.
Before someone would run to a fractional or Part 135 before dealing with Short Call, I would have to question if you really understand the nuances of Short Call... and the differences in pay/QOL between the Big 6 and Part 135/fractional. I'm not saying you're wrong. Just be sure you understand what your tradeoffs are. In most cases, I'd say you're throwing away a lot to avoid something that can be easily managed.
Also, I meet people that don't want to move because Little Johnny is in 7th grade and they want to wait until he in in college so as not to disrupt his life. Keep in mind, if you decide to commute instead of move, there's a good chance Little Johnny won't be spending much time with you, especially in the early years of your airline career. As someone who went to 4 high schools in 4 years, I can tell you that Little Johnny will probably be ok. And having you around the house more counts for a hell of a lot.
Last edited: