SECNAV Criticizes 'Blueberries'

[insanebikerboy]

But the utility uniform WAS broke. It's easy to look back on the 'good ol'e days' or act like a tough guy and say feelings don't matter when you don't have to wear them. It's easy to say "it doesn't matter, it's not written anywhere to put creases in utilities" when you don't have to obey the authority of CPOs. But if you were XO, would you tell your CMC to stop having the goat locker make their Sailors crease their utilities? Or would you be right there with him saying your crew is going to look sharp for the ADM visit? More likely, my guess is you'd be focused on more important things than something as mundane as E-6 and below creasing utilities...after all, the Chiefs are supposed to handle that. It doesn't matter if the Sailor dungarees came before The Shawshank Redemption was made, what matters is many Sailors in the 21st century identified the uniform with prison wear and that all the issues with utilities combined had an adverse effect on morale and retention.

So the CNO listened and created a uniform that fixed the complaints. Could it have been done a lot better? Absolutely. But to say that the old enlisted utilities weren't broken is ignoring or forgetting a wide range of issues that Sailors had with the uniform.

EDIT: I knew when I wrote the 'nam statement, someone was likely to show me up with a case where servicemembers wore camo. So thanks for the education...definitely not how WWII Marines are portrayed and I'm obviously dinq on my military history. However, the fact does remain that many real warfighters fought and died for our country in solid-colored uniforms without spending so much effort looking the part.

I did wear utilities, the uniform definitely WASN'T broke, and it was a helluva lot better than these shitty NWU's.

And yes, it is the XO's job to worry about uniforms.

Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Recovering LSO]

Yes. But then you proved my point with this

No Spekkio, I wrote "WITH". It's a distinction worth noting as it's important. The Chief's Mess is the Chief's Mess - the front office still sets the tone and the agenda.

 

[HueyCobra8151]

Spekkio: Why does a requirement (real or perceived) to put creases in a uniform make it broken?

 

[Rocketman]

Spekkio: Why does a requirement (real or perceived) to put creases in a uniform make it broken?

When mama-san did the creases no one bitched about creases......

Same uniform before mama-san

after mama-san

 

[OscarMyers]

Spekkio: Why does a requirement (real or perceived) to put creases in a uniform make it broken?

I don't think it was the creases that made the uniform broken, but rather the escalation of wear for the uniform. Utilities were meant to be a working uniform, but fell short on may levels. Dungarees had iron rank and stencils and could be redyed until the cows come home, making them much more useful. God forbid you got a grease spot on a pair of utilities, making them un-serviceable and having to be replaced. So we ended up having coveralls for the working uniform and utilities to stand watch in. NWUs may not be the best uniform, but they sure as hell beat utilities and they even have cold weather gear that doesn't suck. Ever been caught on the flight deck in a utility jacket in a squall?

Are the squadrons still issuing organizational foul weather gear for the maintainers these days?

 

[ProwlerPilot]

I find the most troubling thing about the uniform changes over the past couple years is the apparent lack of real reseach and QA that goes into their production and implementation. The fact that NWU's are not fire resistant is crazy. Isn't fire our number 1 enemy on ship? Isn't that why you have to crazy roll them, so in an emergency they can be instantly pulled down and ready for GQ? Then there's the PT uniforms that initially turned eveyone into a wet T-shirt contestant once they started to sweat. Great for South Beach, not so much in the hamster gym. To add insult to injury, they then started melting in ships laundry. Gee, if we only had information on how hot those laundry machines get..... Really, who is running this show?

The amount of time, money, and effort we put into this topic I find comical. The disparity between the services is simply a magnification of it. Find a uniform, make it safe and useful, and disband the whole committee. Is it really necessary to re-visit this question every 3 years? Yes, the NWU's looks stupid and I specifically have a problem with a 1 inch by 1 inch patch being the only distuinguisable feature between an E-3 and O-9, but let's just get it standardized, make it safe, and be done.

As for warfighting, why don't we simply have the best performing pattern in country and make everyone wear it? Seems pretty simple. Call it the Joint Strike Uniform. Of course I guess that would mean it would be woefully behind schedule and over budget....

 

[picklesuit]

I hated the fucking utilities. With a passion. If I went to quarters to, say, put on Second Class PO, I had creases, shirt stays, and had to crease the pants. And then I could either take those off and put on my "working utilities" or risk staining the "dress utilities" and having to make new ones. In the AW shop you had creases every day or you were a "dirtbag" and not squared away.
The pants were miserable, and shrank no matter how cold they were washed. The button strip baconated like a champ, and they were fading the minute you put them on.

I don't like the price tag for NWU's, but I like the fit and pocket arrangement and the wash/wear. The fire retardant thing is another issue.
Of course, this is all moot now as I wear either a bag or a bag to work now and I have long ago lost any fireproofing the flight suit may have had to the laundry machine. Gotta have some soft clothes!
Pickle
Me circa 2006 frocking AW2 about two weeks before starting OCS (hence the laughter)

 

[kmac]

Of course, this is all moot now as I wear either a bag or a bag to work now and I have long ago lost any fireproofing the flight suit may have had to the laundry machine. Gotta have some soft clothes!

What's the reasoning of this? How does fabric softener ruin the fibers of the flight suit? I've never figured this one out.

 

[Gatordev]

What's the reasoning of this? How does fabric softener ruin the fibers of the flight suit? I've never figured this one out.

I believe it was Nittany who brought this up a few months ago. The Aramid material is a bunch of threads woven into a garment, it's not a treatment of the material (which is what I had been mistakenly told in the past), so the thread itself does not stop from becoming fire retardant. I think he even quoted an actual Aramid website and didn't go all Wikipedia on us.

The fabric softener was, I believe, another urban myth.

 

[kmac]

I would agree with you, but...

 

[xj220]

Anyone actually lubricate their slide fasteners with a wax pencil?

 

[Gatordev]

I would agree with you, but...

Are you sure you're not a P-3 or LAMPS pilot? What male actually reads the directions?

Yeah, I don't know. Apparently if you remove the label, the flight suit will explode, too.

Anyone actually lubricate their slide fasteners with a wax pencil?

Yes. I've had a flight suit that had a terrible main zipper. Waxing it helps big time.

 

[helolumpy]

Apparently if you remove the label, the flight suit will explode, too.

Which is OK for a flight suit since it's flame retardant. It was NWU's you'd have a 'screaming Class A' fire on your hands!

 

[Jim123]

Anyone actually lubricate their slide fasteners with a wax pencil?

Yes... Waxing it helps big time.

"That's what she said."

 

[picklesuit]

Well,
I can SEE through mine...I'm sure that's fine...
Pickle