I don't know if the issue so much here is that "I didn't get saluted that one time by the guy who was wearing handcuffs" as it is some boot ass boot who hasn't even been commissioned yet saying "Hey, I'm a crusty old Corporal and you lieutenants need to let it go because you haven't been to combat and you aren't in the fleet." Personally I've never had anybody blatantly blow off saluting me but if I did, I'd certainly stop them and make them see the error in their ways. I wouldn't cause a big scene about it...unless I was provoked.
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Fezz, I don't know what those E's were doing at the time, but there are situations where it's not appropriate to salute, or expect a salute. Check your Naval Officer's guide, it has a good section in there on courtesies (I know most guys probably just toss this book, but mine sits on the back of the toilet, so it gets looked at daily). Basically, if the guys are in a working party, then it's not required, however, they should at least address you. I live in the Q on Corry, so I see various E's all day and I have yet to see one not salute. I've had some Marines stop at the other end of the building stop, salute, and say good morning.
As far as educating these guys if and when they do fail to salute, I believe it should always be done, tactfully. I don't believe in trying to humiliate a guy or make him feel stupid for not doing it. I've heard guys say, "oh don't say anything. You don't know what's going on in that guys head. He may have just had his ass chewed by his Chief or Sgt and he's feeling down". Screw that. When I went through boot camp (11 long years ago) the biggest thing drilled into our head was attention to detail. If that sailor or Marine can't be observant enough to notice an officer just because he's had a bad day, then he may well miss that torpedo speeding through the water or that suicide bomber driving towards him as he's standing watch.
As far as educating these guys if and when they do fail to salute, I believe it should always be done, tactfully. I don't believe in trying to humiliate a guy or make him feel stupid for not doing it. I've heard guys say, "oh don't say anything. You don't know what's going on in that guys head. He may have just had his ass chewed by his Chief or Sgt and he's feeling down". Screw that. When I went through boot camp (11 long years ago) the biggest thing drilled into our head was attention to detail. If that sailor or Marine can't be observant enough to notice an officer just because he's had a bad day, then he may well miss that torpedo speeding through the water or that suicide bomber driving towards him as he's standing watch.
I'm not quite sure if they were a working party. There were about 5-6 crammed into those white duty vans. And I was approaching them as they were exiting their vehicle. I cant remember off the top of my noggin what constitutes a "working party," but they didnt look busy if thats what you mean. It appeared as though they were just dropped off. I walked by and they just looked at me like I was nobody. Almost like they were giving me dirty looks and didnt care I was just an Ensign. I actually felt stupid for some reason. But yea, I plan on letting them know their faults (humourously if possible) should it happen again.
I knew someone would mention that, hater. I know a few LT's who used that line, that's where I heard it and thought it was kind of funny. When you have a group of guys who look lost like Fezz said they did, I don't think it would be humiliating at all. What is humiliating, is when a LT chews an E's ass in front of his wife and kid for not saluting as he's getting into his car. What makes an E feel stupid is when he's looking down as he's going up a flight of stairs and fails to see the Major walking down. Then when he nervously snaps that salute, realizes there's a pen in his right hand which get him another ass chewing. (btw, only the second example was me, when I was an E1 in A-school).
But no, that line said to a nervous group of boots in a lighthearted way, would hopefully ease their tension so that they don't stand there with that deer in the headlight look next time it happens.
But no, that line said to a nervous group of boots in a lighthearted way, would hopefully ease their tension so that they don't stand there with that deer in the headlight look next time it happens.
As a prior-enlisted jarhead, I have experienced this from both sides. We used to kind of make a game of it as LCpls. Everytime we saluted, they had to salute us back, no? He who bagged the most salutes won.
One of my favorite stories is from one of (the many) Chesty Puller books out there. Chesty, as a senior officer, came across some 2ndLt who was "punishing" a junior Marine for not saluting him. The 2ndLt made the junior guy stand there and salute him 100 (or some ridiculous number of) times. Chesty came upon this and reminded the 2ndLt that military courtesy requires the senior officer to return the salute. So he made the 2ndLt continued his "excercise" with the junior Marine, this time with both of them saluting. Gotta love it!
Saluting is a deep-rooted tradition in the military. As an officer, you should never take it for granted. When you "return" the salute, you should take even more pride in the fact that you get to salute one of the hard workers that help contribute to your service. If you show pride in your military courtesy, others (both junior and senior) will follow your lead.
And for all those that whine about saluting O-1s, guess what, O-1s have the absolute short end of the stick. Think about it... they are the only guys who have to salute EVERYONE they see (except for fellow O-1s, I guess).
One of my favorite stories is from one of (the many) Chesty Puller books out there. Chesty, as a senior officer, came across some 2ndLt who was "punishing" a junior Marine for not saluting him. The 2ndLt made the junior guy stand there and salute him 100 (or some ridiculous number of) times. Chesty came upon this and reminded the 2ndLt that military courtesy requires the senior officer to return the salute. So he made the 2ndLt continued his "excercise" with the junior Marine, this time with both of them saluting. Gotta love it!
Saluting is a deep-rooted tradition in the military. As an officer, you should never take it for granted. When you "return" the salute, you should take even more pride in the fact that you get to salute one of the hard workers that help contribute to your service. If you show pride in your military courtesy, others (both junior and senior) will follow your lead.
And for all those that whine about saluting O-1s, guess what, O-1s have the absolute short end of the stick. Think about it... they are the only guys who have to salute EVERYONE they see (except for fellow O-1s, I guess).
Except warrants!
Question for you other priors... do any of you find yourselves forgetting to drop the salute first? For 10 years I saluted and waited for the officer to drop his salute first. Right after getting commissioned, I would have enlisted guys salute me and when I return the salute, I would find myself forgetting to drop it because I'm waiting for them to drop first. Not really a problem any more, but I found it kind of amusing at first.
Question for you other priors... do any of you find yourselves forgetting to drop the salute first? For 10 years I saluted and waited for the officer to drop his salute first. Right after getting commissioned, I would have enlisted guys salute me and when I return the salute, I would find myself forgetting to drop it because I'm waiting for them to drop first. Not really a problem any more, but I found it kind of amusing at first.
snizo
Supply Officer
Saluting shouldn't be that complicated. Salute when you can limited by safety (trying to hold 800 lbs with one hand so you can do it, driving in a car when you need both hands to do it) or tradition (indoors, uncovered).
What is the deal with rules? On steps? If you're driving and dont need both hands for the safe operation of the vehicle? If you get saluted, do your best to salute back and vice versa.
We're all adults and can figure out when it isn't neccesary or appropriate to do it.
trv - I've never heard that either. As far as I know, you do. Hopefully we have all traversed the mysterious wasteland that is a staircase before and wouldn't be endangering our lives or the lives of others by looking up once in a while...
What is the deal with rules? On steps? If you're driving and dont need both hands for the safe operation of the vehicle? If you get saluted, do your best to salute back and vice versa.
We're all adults and can figure out when it isn't neccesary or appropriate to do it.
trv - I've never heard that either. As far as I know, you do. Hopefully we have all traversed the mysterious wasteland that is a staircase before and wouldn't be endangering our lives or the lives of others by looking up once in a while...
Ah, warrant officers, I always forget about them...
I didn't have the dropping problem, but I distinctly remember the first normal salute (i.e. not at the comissioning ceremony) I received. I remember looking around, thinking oh, $hit, is there an officer here I need to salute? I made a quick glance to either side and then it hit me... I'm the officer. I returned the salute and we both smirked at my poor S.A.
It's no wonder us butter-bars get a bad rep.
I didn't have the dropping problem, but I distinctly remember the first normal salute (i.e. not at the comissioning ceremony) I received. I remember looking around, thinking oh, $hit, is there an officer here I need to salute? I made a quick glance to either side and then it hit me... I'm the officer. I returned the salute and we both smirked at my poor S.A.
It's no wonder us butter-bars get a bad rep.
Just to give you all the heads up, if you are going to chew someones @$$ for not saluting and a senior officer comes up and asks you whats up remember to salute him. My buddy told me this story when he was in P-cola and some ensign came to chew his ass out for not seeing him and not saluting and when his commander came up, this ensign starts ranting and raving about my buddy not saluting him...but he in turn doesnt salute this commander and gets his @$$ chewed...this ensign made himself look like a tard...pretty funny story.
That doesn't make any sense. All of us (officers) have to salute everyone we see (except for others of the same paygrade). Whether we have to initiate the salute or return it, you still have to salute. So the short stick theory for O-1's doesn't apply.handjive said:
Saluting while driving a car....never done it, never will. Safety first guys.
Also don't wear a cover while driving. Never had any grief about it.
I do however give a quick salute to the gate guard while in my car at the gate after he's saluted me.
Also don't wear a cover while driving. Never had any grief about it.
I do however give a quick salute to the gate guard while in my car at the gate after he's saluted me.