Naval Aviations "One" Problem...

[sevenhelmet]

3-year FRS IP tour? My friend my friend, you may not be aware that first shore tour orders are being issued for 24-30 months to ensure they have enough time remaining to MSR to be obligated into a disassociated tour.

Isn’t it funny how the boats are always running out of people and we HAVE to go now, now, now, but when the FRSs and TRACOM are running out of people, they just have to suck it up?

Also, involuntary IAs should absolutely not be a thing anymore.

 

[Gatordev]

If he’s talking about who I think he is, 500 total

Correct. I think he had 508 hours, or something like that. Is the guy you're thinking of the one who went to AFG and ended up taking part in raids with SOF? Sounded like he made the most of it, although apparently he did get called to the carpet after being the senior man on a raid that hit a compound belonging to one of Karzai's buddies (if you believe the story).

 

[croakerfish]

During my HT tour, we had an officer jump on a grenade for an IA to a UN Peacekeeping Mission in Africa (blue helmet and everything, she had to go through Army courses for shooting, driving, etc.), but the deal she made with the detailer was "this time doesn't count against my shore tour," and made sure our CO and CDRE were well aware of that deal.

Fast forward to her return from Africa and surprise, surprise, gets the email from the detailer telling her she's up for her disassociated tour. "Not so fast, you made this promise."

"Sorry, that was my predecessor, pick a coast and type of boat."

A few emails from CO and higher ups fixed that relatively quickly and she did a lat txfer to the USCG and is still flying.


==========================
FWIW, all of my experiences with PERS except one have been positive, and ironically, the only "bad" detailer I had was for my initial shore duty orders. With that said, I guess I've kind of accepted how the game gets played (cutting shore duty early, making boat tours last as long as possible), and never fought it, but I feel like the rest have been honest brokers with me.

On my current joint tour, I am going to ask to extend about three months so that my kids can, for the first time ever, finish a school year at the same school, but I know that will be a mega fight since they will want to pull me for O-5 sea duty if I don't make command.

I almost got flicked with that booger after checking in to the FRS for my TAR tour. The deal was that you’d basically just pick up where you left off when you got back, it was in writing by that time.

 

[Griz882]

Correct. I think he had 508 hours, or something like that. Is the guy you're thinking of the one who went to AFG and ended up taking part in raids with SOF? Sounded like he made the most of it, although apparently he did get called to the carpet after being the senior man on a raid that hit a compound belonging to one of Karzai's buddies (if you believe the story).

This guy’s story has a hint of Walter Mitty to it!

 

[MGoBrew11]

I almost got flicked with that booger after checking in to the FRS for my TAR tour. The deal was that you’d basically just pick up where you left off when you got back, it was in writing by that time.

As a fellow TAR, that scares me. I’ve heard of the odd IA here and there but I think most anyone that goes TAR is doing it to stay Navy while avoiding some of the REGNAV shenanigans. Glad you dodged that bullet.

 

[croakerfish]

As a fellow TAR, that scares me. I’ve heard of the odd IA here and there but I think most anyone that goes TAR is doing it to stay Navy while avoiding some of the REGNAV shenanigans. Glad you dodged that bullet.

Well my timing was perfect to make me the ideal sacrifice. Every Commodore in NAE owed CNAF one name for a 365 + training, so my wing picked the FRS to give up a name, and I was the newest FTS guy there who hadn’t even started my TAR tour. No one’s come after me since then, knock on wood.

 

[Gatordev]

This guy’s story has a hint of Walter Mitty to it!

When you hear the details, it sounded mostly legit. He wasn't busting down doors, but he built a relationship with the unit there and would go along with the security detail on some of their hits.

 

[Griz882]

When you hear the details, it sounded mostly legit. He wasn't busting down doors, but he built a relationship with the unit there and would go along with the security detail on some of their hits.

I have no doubt it is legit…just seems remarkable.

 

[sevenhelmet]

I have no doubt it is legit…just seems remarkable.

Agreed. I know a couple of guys who did fires-O tours, and while they trained with SOF, they weren’t going on raids.

Not saying this dude didn’t, but I can’t imagine that it’s common for non-SOF supporting billets to go on mission.

 

[Uncle Fester]

I've always wondered why these didn't go out as guard/reserve mobilization orders. Plenty of folks were/are always looking for a set of AD orders to plus up their reserve retirement or even get them over the 20 year equivalent in points mark for an AD retirement. Even just a chance for 6 months to a year to go back on AD for a bit and take a break from the civilian world.
Seems like if the AD needed an extra guy that they didn't have they should dip into the reserve forces- after all, isn't that part of what the reserve forces are supposed to be for?

In the Navy anyway (I don't know about the other Reserves), SELRES are forbidden from getting a 20-year regular retirement. You have to be authorized in writing to even go into sanctuary, and get a waiver to mobilize if you're over 16 years total active duty. Unless you're literally irreplaceable - "senior doctor with unique/esoteric specialty" was the example I was always given - you will not be approved for any of that. If you get into sanctuary without authorization, they don't have to honor it (and according to the instruction, they won't).

I think they'd get volunteers if that was the carrot offered...I know I would have; having my retirement pay kick in immediately instead of waiting until 60 would have been nice. But it's never going to happen.

 

[Swanee]

As a fellow TAR, that scares me. I’ve heard of the odd IA here and there but I think most anyone that goes TAR is doing it to stay Navy while avoiding some of the REGNAV shenanigans. Glad you dodged that bullet.

So TAR is "Temporarily Activated Reservist" correct? If so, how do they change your orders to be able to deploy you on an IA? You can deny any set of orders as long as they aren't an involuntary mobilization without any negative action. And you have to accept any modifications to orders.

This can be a pain for us when the schoolhouses are running long because technically someone can say, "no, I'm not extending on this set of training orders, I'm going back to my civilian job." No one ever does it, but they can.

 

[Uncle Fester]

So TAR is "Temporarily Activated Reservist" correct? If so, how do they change your orders to be able to deploy you on an IA? You can deny any set of orders as long as they aren't an involuntary mobilization without any negative action. And you have to accept any modifications to orders.

This can be a pain for us when the schoolhouses are running long because technically someone can say, "no, I'm not extending on this set of training orders, I'm going back to my civilian job." No one ever does it, but they can.

Training and Administration of the Reserve. It was the old name for FTS and they just brought it back 2-3 years ago.

 

[Swanee]

In the Navy anyway (I don't know about the other Reserves), SELRES are forbidden from getting a 20-year regular retirement. You have to be authorized in writing to even go into sanctuary, and get a waiver to mobilize if you're over 16 years total active duty. Unless you're literally irreplaceable - "senior doctor with unique/esoteric specialty" was the example I was always given - you will not be approved for any of that. If you get into sanctuary without authorization, they don't have to honor it (and according to the instruction, they won't).

I think they'd get volunteers if that was the carrot offered...I know I would have; having my retirement pay kick in immediately instead of waiting until 60 would have been nice. But it's never going to happen.

Yeah, I've had this discussion here before and still can't believe it. The ANG will work with folks to get them their AD retirement if they're close. In fact, it's encouraged by all levels of leadership. It's a win/win. Billets get filled by folks who volunteer and the volunteers get their career goals met. Tons of ADOS and STAT tours for 3-4 years out there at all of the MAJCOM bases just for this reason. Lots of ability to homestead and keep family stability. It can be a bit of work to keep flying, but it's not impossible by any means.

 

[Swanee]

Training and Administration of the Reserve. It was the old name for FTS and they just brought it back 2-3 years ago.

Ah, so they're not reservists?

 

[Uncle Fester]

Yeah, I've had this discussion here before and still can't believe it. The ANG will work with folks to get them their AD retirement if they're close. In fact, it's encouraged by all levels of leadership. It's a win/win. Billets get filled by folks who volunteer and the volunteers get their career goals met. Tons of ADOS and STAT tours for 3-4 years out there at all of the MAJCOM bases just for this reason. Lots of ability to homestead and keep family stability. It can be a bit of work to keep flying, but it's not impossible by any means.

It's absolutely stupid, but {gestures broadly at everything else in how the NAVRES is administered}.

The rationale behind it is that mil retirement pay between day 1 of retirement and age 60 is funded by the services; after that it comes out of the VA budget. So sanctuary works to the service's benefit too because they know that CDR Timmy is retirement eligible in two years and they can budget accordingly. Since Reservists don't necessarily work that way, they can't budget that way, and so they don't let them do it.

Could you change things and make it work to everyone's benefit (sailor and Navy)? I have never yet seen an explanation why not, except "it's hard." And it would certainly help at least some IA pain. But the Navy refuses to do it, and has for years.