Life as an aviator on a "small" ship?

[sickboy]

Ha, our OIC's rule was you had to be shaved for port.

Also recommend flying with a razor incase you divert to the carrier. That way, you don't ruin it for everyone else.

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Well, not all carrier hate beards:

Suppose if Royal Dutch Navy will have a carrier again, a ZZ Top style would be routineB-)

 

[DanMa1156]

We had some British Sailors onboard with my CSG so they could go train their future carrier crews in fixed wing flight deck ops; they all had pretty good beards. One of my roommates one day said to me "Dude, I've gotta talk with their divo. I don't understand how he and his chief let them get away with that trash."
"Uh, you know they are British, right?"
"Nope! Answers that!"

 

[ChuckMK23]

I really like reading how the HSC concept is working now - between logistics ships, CV and shore dets - I'm slightly jealous. I only got to see my little corner of Big Navy on USNS or AE/AOE's. The occasional cross deck to the CV where we were totally dependent and secondary to our HS hosts.

Being on a non aviation ship is enjoyable because YOU get to be the expert on all things aviation - and despite the SWO wardroom, you make really good connections, have a chance to actually run evolutions wing to wing (Vertrep cycles fro example) and as previously mentioned leadership opportunities fostering your enlisted team - which MO and Maint Chief genuinely appreciate since they are spread so thin.

We also enjoyed some unique port visits - going places the CV could not. Small ports and then shore basing with allied hosts. Turkey and Israel were especially memorable in that way.

I would have enjoyed more exposure to CVW life - never really got that.

 

[Sonog]

For you dudes who did the 3 det concept, did pilots rotate between dets? Because that sounds phenomenal if that were the case

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Uh, you know they are British, right?"

They have regulation against moustache, though. You can be either clean shaved or wear full beard including cheeks of equal hair length everywhere on the face, only these two options exist on RN ships. But Dutch officers and men can have whatever they want - I personally have seen an officer looked like Lemmy Kilmister except the length of the hair. Swedish and Danish too, but officers are quite moderately shaved while NCOs quite can look like heavy metal musicians, with tatoos even on the face. Personal freedom, a sort of.
To the topic - in Russian Navy all aviators are not quite familiar with the shipboard life, as they are always guests on the ships. Yet it seems that the helicopter people liked to sit on the small ships more than to be deployed on Kuznetsov aircraft carrier. There isn't an Air Dept DH on the Russian frigates, this role is filled by ship's XO, who knows nothing about aviation so helo det's OIC, being equal in rank with this XO (usually O-4), can be considered as acting DH while still flying. And if Kuznetsov is akin to 2-stars hotel to air personnell, a FFG or DDG has at least one star more

 

[Uncle Fester]

I've done four boat deployments - two on frigates and two on CV/Ns. Second frigate cruise was as part of an air det. There's definitely pros and cons to both. Most notably to me was that as an aviator on a carrier, you have layers and layers of aviation command and experience between you and the ultimate decision-makers. On a smallboy, it's hard to escape that the senior aviation guy present is an O-4 who is subordinate to a Shoe CO. Sometimes that works well, sometimes it doesn't. On the other hand, as an O-3/-4 you have direct access to the captain and you have a voice in how the aviation assets are employed; that's definitely not the case on a carrier.

Creature comforts are certainly better on the Boat. You never run out of anything on the Boat. Multiple fully-equipped gyms vs a stairmaster jammed in a corner. Sundae bars and Taco Tuesday vs "hey I heard we got a case of bananas on that last RAS hit, let's get 'em before they're gone!"

 

[DanMa1156]

For you dudes who did the 3 det concept, did pilots rotate between dets? Because that sounds phenomenal if that were the case

Most of the pilots got a taste of both the CVW and Shore Dets. (As in, at some point, EVERYONE was on the Carrier).
Some did all 3 (Figure about 30% of the pilots).
A few (I think 3) did stay on the Carrier the entire time.
The least did only VERTREP and Carrier dets (I think this affected only 2 of our pilots).

The VERTREP det at first, was frowned upon, and I don't know that it was ever fully embraced by leadership; but eventually, when guys couldn't earn any more quals while underway, it became a good spot to put them in some leadership spots they wouldn't have had (AOIC / OPS specifically).

The inland det was great for almost everyone because you got a break from the ship, got to interact with the Army a bit, the USO was fantastic, and - most importantly for HSC guys - you didn't have to stagnate on your overland cards like PR / SOF, and CAS. We were the first to kind of establish a footprint in OIR for it, but I know subsequent squadrons have continued it and have been used operationally from that det as well, which is really great news for the community and a huge break from the "airwing only" mindset that can hurt the HSC community.

I consider myself super blessed to have been able to go to all 3 dets - I loved the carrier, but it was great to get the occasional DFAC meal and Skype phone call home and VERTREP... damn, I fell in love with VERTREP on that det. I flew so much and had so much fun on that det.

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Well people, which is an accomodation of helo det's officers on USN DDG, for example? One 4-bunks stateroom? 2x2-bunks? Has OIC his personal stateroom + 1x3-bunks for others? If one big stateroom for all, how does it work for the coed personnell?
Russian helo det (1-2 Ka-32 co-axial hoovers) is accomodated in one big room aft (6-bunks: 2-4 pilots including OIC, an aviation engineer for airframes/engines (nickname "elephant") and weapon systems engineer (nickname "monkey") - all officers, all males) on a DDGs and 2x3 on frigates.

 

[Gatordev]

The pilots will get whatever staterooms are available. Sometimes that means they'll be together, sometimes that means there might be 3 in one room and 2 (plus a SWO) in another. The OIC usually rooms with one of the other DHs on the ship (and if he can swing it, NOT with the CHENG, because that sucks). I've only spent a couple of weeks on a DDG, so I can't remember if it has a 4-man stateroom or not. Given a lot of times, there's at least one female pilot, they'll usually stay with the ship's company female(s).

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Thanks, in general approach is clear - whatever free bunks the ship has for det. Good and really about brotherhood of communities on smallboys. No, ours is different - wherever an aviation personnell on the ship can be deployed, they inevitably have separate living area. CV, LHD, CG, DDG, FFG, even new corvettes - everywhere they live separately from ship's company. I told you - they're guests first of all. By the way, what's wrong with CHENG? A phone endlessly ringing and NCOs constantly walking back and fore, so no sleep-no rest-no silence for CHENG's roommate?

 

[Gatordev]

Exactly. Trying to get crew rest while living with the CHENG was always a struggle, at least on the ship I was on.

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Trying to get crew rest while living with the CHENG was always a struggle, at least on the ship I was on.

Yup, CHENG is CHENG in each navy. That is why in Russia CHENG boasts a luxury one-person stateroom with shower and WC inside even on a frigate. Let him rule his own mech-electro-steaming-water-shitty kingdom from his own throne and don't dip at least the other DHs in this crappy stuff

 

[azguy]

Well people, which is an accomodation of helo det's officers on USN DDG, for example?

Flt IIa's are built for the flight crew. There is a 5-man suite, one 2-man room and one 3-man room which share a head, all the way back by the hangar/flight deck. Not a great location but it's a nice set-up and conducive to crew rest. The way I've seen it, the Air Boss lives with one of the SWO DHs up in the main O-country, and the two other HACs get the 2-man, and the three new-guys share the 2-man back aft.

 

[Max the Mad Russian]

Flt IIa's are built for the flight crew. There is a 5-man suite, one 2-man room and one 3-man room which share a head, all the way back by the hangar/flight deck. Not a great location but it's a nice set-up and conducive to crew rest

Right, here too the air personnell is located aft just forward of hangar, while general O-country it closer to amidship - a German legacy to us, as previously liked British tradition to place the O-country aft took a lot of time for officers on surface ships to reach their battle stations in GQ, a kind of. But aviation guys here are not always deployed, so their quite comfortable rooms often filled with some staffs or Army/Air Force liaison parties.
Once when I was newcomer, we had an Air Force Fighter Director, a Major, with two radar WOs, both in their 40s, just to run the AF interceptors from the ship - four shore-based Su-27s defended us and seven Su-24s were "attackers". That trio directors "splashed" all seven Fencers as well as one of two curiously snuffing after them German Navy Tornado IDSs. Second Tornado had managed to pass over the ship crossing her course and gave a thumbs up to the bridge. CO directed a full box (6 bottles) of Armenian brandy to that Air Force party as a result, and me to organize the delivering. That is why I know that aviation compartments are at least to some degree better than ours in ship's company.