Instrument rating

[Fly Navy]

Oh I agree, I've seen it, it's the magical number where they have more time than the average guy, and feel they don't have to study and their "skills" will get them through, but much less "experience" other than straight and level in a C-172 than they'd like to admit. I personally think it's attitude that gets them, not performance.

Yeah I agree. Some just can't adjust to military flying either. It's just different.

 

[Punk]

I'll just say this, one thing in aviation is golden, and that's experience, you can never have enough.

 

[Carno]

Oops, I didn't mean to imply that getting an instrument rating would be helpful for military flying, I was speaking more about learning to fly in general.

I don't disagree that academics-wise everyone will be pretty much on the same page. What I meant is that having previous experience with basic flying skills can only help. I never said, and didn't mean to imply (if I did), that having all of my civvy ratings will make me a better military pilot, or make flight school a breeze, I only meant that it will help out, as far as having a basic concept of flight.

And believe me, if I could go back in time and re-live my senior year of high school, I would NOT have enrolled in a flight school for college. I have more debt than a lot of people on this board have yearly income.

 

[Carno]

Why waste the money if you'll be getting military flight training?

If all you are doing is pleasure/business flying then yes, I'd recommend it, but I wouldn't recommend it to someone about to go to military flight school.

 

[KBayDog]

An instrument rating should be an automatic must... we used to call the PPL a licence to learn (or a licence to kill yourself).

I'm going to have to go ahead and sort of...disagree with you. Yeah...

It depends on what you hope to get out of aviation. Some people just want to tool around the local area on beautiful days with a Rec certificate - they aren't out to get rating after rating after rating. If your only desire is to take a -172 out on a crystal-clear day with no winds for a joy-ride, an instrument rating would be a serious waste of time and money. It is akin to getting advanced SCUBA ratings, when all you want to do is go down 30' and look at all the fishies.

I agree that it is something valuable to have in your hip-pocket...especially when you are dealing with, oh, your life. However, if he does his homework (ensuring that there is a 0% chance of any weather, knowing the local flying area like the back of his hand, etc.), the average crop-dusting VMC bubba just does not need to get one.

(That said, if I had nothing to do with the military and just wanted to tool around, I would STILL get an instrument rating. Personally, I would not feel comfortable knowing that I know the bare minimum to get a plane in the sky. But, to each his own.)

 

[ocs_hopeful]

I am about to get my IFR ticket. I wouldn't say that I feel more qualified than anyone else that i will be going against in flight school, but I have found that the more confidence in the air you have the better pilot you are. The ticket has gven my confidence a ten fold increase.

 

[Gatordev]

But..... While getting instrument rating is a great learning experience and further develops your skills, those skills become pretty useless after not using them for 6-12 months. It would be interesting to see statistics of people who have IR, how many regularly use the skills. I'm guessing it would be greater than people who have PPL and actually go flying. But still, there are those that have them and don't use them afterwards, and that skillset becomes less useful over time w/out continued practice/use.

 

[KBayDog]

Nothing you can ever to due further your experience/skill level is ever a waste of money... especially when it comes to flying.

As someone who is entering the flying profession, I agree. It's our job - some would say our duty - to constantly further our experience/skill levels.

Like gatordev said, though, what's the sense in paying the big bucks for a perishable skill that you will hardly ever use as a daytime, VFR recreational pilot? There are a lot of folks out there who want to spend their limited plane rental money to take off, do some local sightseeing (keeping their heads out of the cockpit), and land. They want to enjoy their limited flight time - they don't want to make every flight a designated "training" flight. They want to enjoy basic straight-and-level VFR flight, but do not have the time or money to constantly upgrade their ticket. For them, spending money to learn perishable skills is a waste of money.

 

[Gatordev]

Hence why you gotta be current to be legal I've found if I haven't flown the panel in a while I really gotta hunker down on the guages (or hud!) for several minutes because my head will spin. After that I'm good. Had an ACM solo a few weeks ago, we launched into some heinous wx and it was my first real cloud time in a while. Joined up under the weather and climbed through... felt like we were in a right hand bank the whole way through the weather. I had the damnest time hanging onto my leads wing. When we broke out on top, I literally felt the muscles in my legs relax I was so tense.

Now wait a minute. You're dragging legality into this? You might as well go crazy and add common sense too. <cough> JFK Jr. <cough>

When flying an aircraft that took some of the workload off me, I could shot the shit and fly an approach at the same time. Now that I'm back in Mr. Toad's wild ride, I find the same thing as you, I need to concentrate more before I can get distracted, and I still manage to miss little things. Stupid profeciency.

 

[zippy]

thats not entirely true (from what i've heard) i was about to sign up for civy flight school, but a Marine aviator advised me not to, he told me that when you are at flight school for the Marines, you need to forget everything about civy flight. This is just words passed down from someone who is an av-8b pilot, take it for what its worth.

The biggest thing that I've noticed guys with a bunch of prior flight complain about is that they are having to get used to doing things using/verbalizing the verbatum procedures listed in the Navy Flight Training Instructions.

Does civilian flight training make you more competitive for your time in primary to qualify for one of those slots?? This would seem to me to be the most important measuring stick of civilian flight training worth. Opinions are welcome.

Most of what i've seen here would indicate that overall it does help... That being said, a lot of it seems to boil down to a persons natural ability. A lot of the guys I know with a bunch of prior flight time are smoking the program- but then there are some I know who just had IFS and are doing just as well. There have also been guys who rolled through the squadron after going through one of those flight programs at a civilian college- and their IPs commented that they way they fly doesnt show it.

As far as having a Civilian IR, it'll help you for the first 6-9 months, after that everyone is caught up and on the same page.

That first 6-9months is Primary... knowing what I know now, Id say that If you are in a position to gain some skills/experience that will help you out perform your peers and maybe make you the top student the week you select, and have the time and money to go through with it, then do it. If not, dont worry about it and do your best and remember that its all going to come down to the needs of the Navy/Marine Corps at the time you select to determine where you go.

 

[USMCRugger]

I'm guilty of "wasting" my money on a ppl, but I'm not doing it only to better my chances of getting selected into a flight program, even though it is a goal of mine. I just wanted to take it into my own hands and fly. I love flying and I'm glad I went this route. I solo'd for my first time 3 days ago!

 

[A.Kuettel]

Congrats on the solo, its pretty weird bein the only one in the plane for the first time. They threw me in the a lake by the airport and cut my shirt my first time, anything to you?

 

[Punk]

Congrats on the solo, its pretty weird bein the only one in the plane for the first time. They threw me in the a lake by the airport and cut my shirt my first time, anything to you?

The cutting the shirt thing on your first solo is a tradition. I still have mine from back in '96 (damn its been a long time).

The Navy tradition is to cut a tie.


Soloing in the -34 wasn't all too exciting, really limited in what you could do. I still had a damn good time though. The aerobatic solos were a blast. But soloing the -45, now that was amazing.

 

[michaels601]

Jumping in late on the board, been away for a little while, but from what I understand flight time is never a waste as long as you plan on going back up again. Hours are hours, the extra experience isn't going to hurt you in any way... unless you get yourself killed.

Currently trying to pull a christmas miracle out of my butt and snag my instrument rating before i go home for break. That being said, I should go study more.

 

[A.Kuettel]

good luck to ya man, i am going for my ticket over christmas as well.