Fun Meter no longer pegged

[ChuckMK23]

Some interesting info I just got in an email that seems to make sense. This came from a Marine 0-5 at the Pentagon.

Apparently a number of Army types were circulating a powerpoint slide deck that had, among other things a chart of combat damaged aircraft and combat wounded/killed aviation personnel broken down down by service. The argument from the Army folks were they were not getting enough funding for operations when compared to wartime effort - and that funding and resources should be diverted from other pots to Army.

Word is the slide had goose eggs for the Navy portion of the chart - the implication was that Navy units simply could not be contributing to the war since there was no battle damaged aircraft or aviation personnel killed or wounded. Apparantly even the Coast Guard had casualties listed (although I can't figure out why..)

This was the genesis of the whole air ambulance det thing..

Again this is second hand but it makes sense given the complex politico world of the Pentagon.

ANybody have any info to support this notion (or refute it?)

 

[Steve Wilkins]

My thoughts are, if that's too much for people to handle, then they should get out. If a 6 month IA tour is going to ruin your day, then get out. If you can't handle graduate level education and JPME, get out. Let's face it, we're not in this business because we thought, or wanted things to be easy. Sure deployments during OIF and especially OEF were long and homecycles were short - that's pretty much over. If there's a need for IA billets to be filled in the war zone, how about being a team player and sign yourself up. IMHO, people ought to be in this game for one primary reason - service. So if your "fun" quotient isn't being met, I urge you to get out ASAP. That just leaves more command slots for me. Brett

How about a 425 day IA? The problem with all this IA stuff is that it is extremely disorganized. I have two problems with how we're doing business with this IA program. One is that it we are now 3 years into this gig in Iraq. People should NOT be given a two week notice and told to pack your bags, your going to Iraq (in two weeks). That might be appropriate if this war was just starting, but its not. We've been doing it for awhile now....long enough anyway that we should know what billets need to filled long before they need to be filled. Two weeks notice is simply unacceptable, at the stage we're at, IMO. Second, I was an XO at a reserve center, and briefly a reservist myself after I got out in 2004. I see these IA jobs as something that are perfect for reservists....for a couple reasons. One, I feel it's the job of reservists to augment our forces where required. Second, I know first hand that reservists love to do stuff like this.

 

[lowflier03]

On a side note, a number of my peer group (VP) are VOLUNTEERING to do IA instead of the traditional Disassociated Sea Tour.

Sadly, I would rather do an IA tour than a disassociated if I were given the option...who wants to spend 3 years with the deployments, but without the flying. However we were informed that the IA tour would occur before the disassociated, not in place of...

 

[S.O.B.]

I’m just curious are these VP guys pontificating about “manning up” and being a “team player”?

 

[zab1001]

I’m just curious are these VP guys pontificating about “manning up” and being a “team player”?

meaning what?

 

[webmaster]

I’m just curious are these VP guys pontificating about “manning up” and being a “team player”?

I guess with both cases I am talking about (and probably not indicative as a whole), they knew they weren't going to go anywhere (like many of us) with the current VP DH selection criteria. They didn't want to get out, and still wanted to serve. And unfortunately, another flying tour wasn't an option. They "could" roll the dice like many, go do the disassociated sea tour, and hope for better boards, but opted to take the IA tour.

 

[webmaster]

just my view on VP and IA.... for what its worth

Sadly, I would rather do an IA tour than a disassociated if I were given the option...who wants to spend 3 years with the deployments, but without the flying. However we were informed that the IA tour would occur before the disassociated, not in place of...

I honestly don't know your track, and what gates you need. And I will freely admit what I am relating is all second hand, so I could most definitely be mistaken. But there generally isn't that much time left over in a VP track, back the FRS by YG+11 (if DH selected). You do an IA tour, and it impacts that career progression, where are they going to fit that disassociated tour in? Also, you have those career VP bubbas FIGHTING for disassociated sea tour orders (good competitive ones), so they can stay competitive. I mean come one, discussing orders 22 MONTHS out? I had to do that, and it blew my mind. NOW, from everything that I have been hearing, you are basically "fresh meat and free game" for any orders if you don't screen. Gotta love that, thanks for playing, here take these orders or else.

 

[S.O.B.]

My thoughts are, if that's too much for people to handle, then they should get out. If a 6 month IA tour is going to ruin your day, then get out. If you can't handle graduate level education and JPME, get out. Let's face it, we're not in this business because we thought, or wanted things to be easy. Sure deployments during OIF and especially OEF were long and homecycles were short - that's pretty much over. If there's a need for IA billets to be filled in the war zone, how about being a team player and sign yourself up. IMHO, people ought to be in this game for one primary reason - service. So if your "fun" quotient isn't being met, I urge you to get out ASAP. That just leaves more command slots for me.

Brett

So you’re like one of those “If the Navy wanted you to have a family they would have issued you one in you sea bag” guys. That’s great. Obviously a six month IA tour isn’t a big deal in itself but when you add the fact that most of us have been deployed for two years out of the last three and will now be deploying again for an IA while on shore duty, it seems to be a little more than we bargained for, especially when it doesn’t qualify as a disassociated. Also in that three year shore tour of which a year could now be spent deployed finish your JPME and get a Masters. O.K. great I’ll use that department head bonus for a good divorce attorney. Just kidding.

 

[Brett327]

So you’re like one of those “If the Navy wanted you to have a family they would have issued you one in you sea bag” guys. That’s great. Obviously a six month IA tour isn’t a big deal in itself but when you add the fact that most of us have been deployed for two years out of the last three and will now be deploying again for an IA while on shore duty, it seems to be a little more than we bargained for, especially when it doesn't’t qualify as a disassociated. Also in that three year shore tour of which a year could now be spent deployed finish your JPME and get a Masters. O.K. great I’ll use that department head bonus for a good divorce attorney. Just kidding.

Hey, like I said, if your meddle isn't quite up to the challenge, then don't let the door hit you in the ass. As for your family life, that's something you choose, so if you've also chosen to be unrealistic about the possible responsibilities of military service during wartime, then that's unfortunate for you. This hearkens to the complaints you heard from some after the war started about only being in the service for college money, or from reservists who had equally unrealistic expectations. Further, a 6 month IA tour does not, and should not equate to or replace a 24-30 month disassociated tour, so I don't get your your issue with that. Am I being a harda$$ about this, sure, but in case you haven't checked, retention isn't an issue in the Navy right now, especially in aviation, and we've really seen the worst as far as what the war has to throw our way. I don't know what your background, platform or experience level is, but from my POV, I'd just as soon see people try to be team players while we're at fvcking war. Otherwise, I hear MacDonald's is hiring.

Brett

 

[SteveG75]

Hey, like I said, if your meddle isn't quite up to the challenge, then don't let the door hit you in the ass. As for your family life, that's something you choose, so if you've also chosen to be unrealistic about the possible responsibilities of military service during wartime, then that's unfortunate for you. This hearkens to the complaints you heard from some after the war started about only being in the service for college money, or from reservists who had equally unrealistic expectations. Further, a 6 month IA tour does not, and should not equate to or replace a 24-30 month disassociated tour, so I don't get your your issue with that. Am I being a harda$$ about this, sure, but in case you haven't checked, retention isn't an issue in the Navy right now, especially in aviation, and we've really seen the worst as far as what the war has to throw our way. I don't know what your background, platform or experience level is, but from my POV, I'd just as soon see people try to be team players while we're at fvcking war. Otherwise, I hear MacDonald's is hiring.

Brett

:icon_hamm Nail, meet hammer.

Lots of guys (Navy and Marine) are being sent IA from my command (NWDC, Navy Warfare Development Command). I actually see it as a way of breaking up the pain of shore duty (this one is painful) and gaining some points with the detailers for follow-on orders. We have one O-5 who is heading out for a year at NAVCENT with supposed TRACOM (non-XO/CO) follow-on orders. Now, I am not sure about that but my detailer as told me that my next tour will either be sea or a year "hard-fill" (read as boots on ground). If I do a year in country, he has implied I can write my ticket for my last tour. As a FOS'd O-4, I am just waiting on my second look at O-5 (realistically not) and then the continuation board before I make any decisions and/or plans.

But, if the pick me now, I'll go.

BTW, a lot of this moaning reminds me of the Hornet guys wanking to the flag panel at Hook a couple of years ago about having to go do shooter tours. Four words - NEEDS OF THE NAVY.

 

[Brett327]

:icon_hamm Nail, meet hammer.

Lots of guys (Navy and Marine) are being sent IA from my command (NWDC, Navy Warfare Development Command). I actually see it as a way of breaking up the pain of shore duty (this one is painful) and gaining some points with the detailers for follow-on orders. We have one O-5 who is heading out for a year at NAVCENT with supposed TRACOM (non-XO/CO) follow-on orders. Now, I am not sure about that but my detailer as told me that my next tour will either be sea or a year "hard-fill" (read as boots on ground). If I do a year in country, he has implied I can write my ticket for my last tour. As a FOS'd O-4, I am just waiting on my second look at O-5 (realistically not) and then the continuation board before I make any decisions and/or plans.

But, if the pick me now, I'll go.

BTW, a lot of this moaning reminds me of the Hornet guys wanking to the flag panel at Hook a couple of years ago about having to go do shooter tours. Four words - NEEDS OF THE NAVY.

They did the same wanking at this years Hook Flag Panel about IA. The Admiral's most appropriate response was, "Hey, there's a war on, STFU." Call me crazy, call me a company man, but there's a whole lot more to being a Naval Officer then twiddling your thumbs on shore duty while the Army and Marines are doing all the dirty work.

Brett

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Brett, have you contacted your detailer to volunteer?

 

[Brett327]

Brett, have you contacted your detailer to volunteer?

Funny you should mention - I'm calling for orders tomorrow and I'll take whatever's coming my way in that respect. I would much rather do a year at C5F than on a disassociated CAG staff tour.

Brett

 

[Steve Wilkins]

staff weenie either way, except one gets underway and one doesn't

 

[zab1001]

Yeah, but one also gets A&W hot dogs at the Desert Dome.