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College credits in the Navy

The Chief

Retired
Contributor
Brett327 said:
Being in the military means dedicating 100% of your efforts at being good at your job. Anything less will get you the kind of attention which will impede or prevent getting a commission.Brett

Right on. Enlisted with degrees were looked down upon, during my time in the Navy, seems it is still so.

George Washington is one of the finest engineering schools in the country. I out gunned my DO's (and more) education wise, most of whom had their degrees in Antropology, French Lit, History, Ancient Urdu and the likes, leading an electronic division. Having an engineering degree in my field caused me so many problem that I concealed it, as best I could. Easy to do because it was on my own time, not part of my record.

Real as it gets.
 

Steve Wilkins

Teaching pigs to dance, one pig at a time.
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
The Chief said:
Enlisted with degrees were looked down upon, during my time in the Navy, seems it is still so.
I for one do not hold this view and don't believe many of my comrades in the officer community do either.

However, I will say that one of my biggest pet peeves is the attitude from many enlisted folks (especially nowdays) is the expectation of a perceived entitlement that I have to give them time off (or simply make time) for them to work on their education because it will make them better sailors. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. My first priority for anyone working for me is to get them integrated into the unit (whether this is the work center, division, or department) and qualified so that they can at least contribute to some degree to the ship's mission. Once we get them to that point, I want to see them pressing further with intermediate qualifications and professional development (i.e. the stuff found on the bibliography for their rating exams). Their is plenty of education to be had right there in the references found on the bibliography.
 

makana

I wake up in the morning & I piss excellence.
pilot
Demo, sorry for assuming this was heading down "Jet Wannabe" avenue. Like Kycntryboy said, touchy subject on here. However, I guess Crowbar stated the true intention of my post. Most of us on here take great pride in serving our country and are not looking for the quickest or easiest way to advance our personal goals vis-a-vis a college degree. Rather, like Steve pointed out, we first focus on our professional goals, which, after time (usually more than one enlistment), meld into our personal goals anyway. Then, you end up in a win-win situation for the military: you better yourself but also help that particular branch of service by excelling and becoming a greater asset.

The bottom line is, if you are going to enlist, do it for the right reasons. You just have to figure out what those reasons are.

As an aside, from my experience working at a joint command with other branches, the Air Force seemed to be more accomodating to its members who were attending college, even during the work day. And I knew more AF folks who earned their degrees on active duty than Navy folks.
 

The Chief

Retired
Contributor
Steve Wilkins said:
... my biggest pet peeves ...

Without question. We do the Navy's business first, then if time is left and we do not trample on others, we will try to accomodate your own personal desires.

As I said, I, as demostrated, I pulled my weight and often more. Routine evolution or final exam, routine evoluation came first. After my first year, the University was great. Once missed all finals due to official travel, they allowed make-up exams, unheard of.

The problem I always had was " ..... why are you, with a EE degree only a Master Chief, why are you not an officer? You are ducking responsbility ... " or words to that affect.

My answer was always the same: " ... it takes more than a college degree to be a good Naval Officer ... "
 

makana

I wake up in the morning & I piss excellence.
pilot
The Chief said:
The problem I always had was " ..... why are you, with a EE degree only a Master Chief, why are you not an officer? You are ducking responsbility ... " or words to that affect.
Yeah, because we all know that Master Chiefs don't assume any responsibility, right? ;)
 

HH-60H

Manager
pilot
Contributor
My experience in this area comes from observations as a division officer. I want to provide a little reality (like many of the previous posts did) about what your first few years in the Navy will be like. Ok, lets say you enlist and get through boot camp and make it to a carrier based squadron (with or without A school). And for the sake of argument let's say the squadron is getting ready to deploy and is on and off the boat every couple months. Your first 6 months+ you will be assigned to 1st LT division probably, and more likely than not you will handed over to ship's company working as an FSA. Ooooo FSA, that sounds cool and all, yeah not quite. I am not sure what it stands for, but those are the poor guys who scrub pots and pans, swab the decks, and do other manual character building labor down on the mess decks necessary to feed a crew of 5000. You do this 12 hours a day for 3-4 months straight (on cruise). Maybe just maybe, if you can stay awake enough you could squeeze out one class which would count for 3 or 4 credits. But don't count on the internet to be up, and if it is don't count on you getting to use it much because A) you are an E-1 to E-3 who is assigned to the lowest internet tier which equates to the smallest bandwidth and B) since you are only kind of in the squadron and definately not ship's company you will have to beg for someone somewhere to let you use a computer (I know some Sailors who got to check their email once a week max)

Whew that's 3-4 months of hard labor down, no problem right? Now if you didn't manage to piss of the MS1 (excuse me CS1) you were working for (or god help you a Chief in your squadron) your CMC will let you come back to the squadron. Now guess what? You might have a little temp light duty in 1st LT, requiring that you perform the manual labor necessary to make a squadron run, again for 12 hours a day (assuming you have not finished cruise)

Now great, you finished all of that, and it is off to Line Division! There you will working for the meanest, toughest PO1 and Chief in the squadron. Because that's where they assign the meanest toughest PO1 and Chiefs so that they can whip new Airmen into shape. Again long hours, and lots of manual labor. Even back at the beach Line division has got the longest hours. They are the first ones in to pull the birds out of the hanger, and the last ones to finish, since they have to wash the aircraft and put them back in the hanger.

So now at this point you have finished 1-1.5 years in the squadron (not the Navy mind you, maybe you are at 2-2.5 years in the Navy) and if you are the most amazing human alive have completed 1 MAYBE 2 courses of 3 or 4 credits each. So max you are looking at 8 credits in 2.5. This DOES NOT count any credit you can receive from Navy training. Although even designated airmen who show up to their first squadron go through a schedule similar to this. After you have finished this routine off, life does get a little easier, but not much. On the boat expect 12 hour days every day, with poor internet access (and we have the best out on the carrier) BUT now your Chief/DIVO/CMC someone starts harping on you to study for your next rating exam so you can make PO3, get your EAWS or something.

I know this is a long post, but all I am trying to say is that don't expect to get a lot of personal college work done your first few years in the Navy. I had several of my guys who came in with a great plan just like that, who in the end just ended up demoralized because their plan was not realistic. I have no idea at all what Air Force enlisted life is like.
 

The Chief

Retired
Contributor
makana said:
Yeah, because we all know that Master Chiefs don't assume any responsibility, right? ;)

LoL. That I never noticed! :sleep_125 It was always authority I was running away with!

Seriously though. My ego, but I thought I was doing more and better things for the Navy as the MCPO. Gotta chuckle about it now, some years later! I had fun. It was tough at times, often, but rewarding.

And I guess I ended up hijacking another thread.

But I must add. It is heartwarming to see so many dedicated folks on this site, clearly the best of the best. And I am just glad you tolerate me.
 

Demo

Registered User
I wanted to thank everybody for taking their time to reply and setting me straight on this subject. I gotta tell you it is amazing what recruiters will say to you these days to get you to sign up it is almost laughable. The Navy they tried to paint for me is much different from the one described here and if I did sign up then obviously I would've signed up for the wrong reasons. From the start I was setting myself up for failure thinking if I do join up college will be my priority; getting out with a bachelor's in 4 years all paid for plus income, I guess after all when something sounds too good to be true it probably isn't. This forum has been very helpful, I'll be sure to check in more often, take care guys. Thanks.
 

Cordespc

Active Member
None
Contributor
I completed my degree in 3 years while on sea duty. While it surely would have been impossible if I were ship's company, I was attached to the Air Wing, and did not have to make the multiple short jaunts in preparation for deployment, only the big ones. Sometimes things work out that way.

Like the Master Chief said, it is no easy task. I usually took 2 or 3 classes per semester, and maintained (and excelled in) a very busy work schedule in the Navy. I made it a point to never allow my studies to interfere with my Navy responsibilities.

True, a lot of sailors who pursue off-duty education lose sight of the fact that it is strictly off-duty. I have known many people who ask for time off to study, break out their books in the work center, or show up for work late and tired and cite a late class as the reason for their deficiency.

I have been very fortunate in the respect that I was able to complete my degree in 3 years despite a 6 month deployment and a handful of short detachments. Sometimes things just fall into place, but to assume that they will is just setting yourself up for failure.

BTW, my University accepted 33 credits for my Navy schools. This satisfied all of my lower level electives. Additionally, I used the CLEP and DANTES programs to test out of 12 credits. This is a free service offered to active duty personel, but I believe civilians can participate for about 30 bucks a shot. Good luck!
-Paul/AT1
 

makana

I wake up in the morning & I piss excellence.
pilot
Demo said:
I wanted to thank everybody for taking their time to reply and setting me straight on this subject. I gotta tell you it is amazing what recruiters will say to you these days to get you to sign up it is almost laughable. The Navy they tried to paint for me is much different from the one described here and if I did sign up then obviously I would've signed up for the wrong reasons. From the start I was setting myself up for failure thinking if I do join up college will be my priority; getting out with a bachelor's in 4 years all paid for plus income, I guess after all when something sounds too good to be true it probably isn't. This forum has been very helpful, I'll be sure to check in more often, take care guys. Thanks.
Another satisfied customer! :D
Good luck, dude.
 

haydog

Registered User
Cordespc, I can't believe you made first already. I remeber when you walked into my shop as a young airman and Timmy beat you up. And in reply to getting your degree while on active duty, I will agree it is extremely hard and takes dedication. I have been in seven years now. I am almost done with my shore tour as an instructor. But thank God I had a good first class in my MTU that said go to school and don't waste your shore duty. I took the advise and now I am only one class(stats) and two cleps away from my degree in Pro Air with a minor in business MGMT from ERAU. My advise to you DEMO is take what is said here and from your recruiters with a grain of salt. When it all comes down to it, this is your decision. What is the best choice for you.
 

zacharyj53

Registered User
My advice is this...

If you want to fly in the AF....Join the AF...Start classes there and try to get into their enlisted to officer programs...That is a lot easier to do than trying to switch services...Is it possible to get a four year degree while in...Yes...I got my 4 year degree while I was in the USMC in 5 years...But I also used clep test to knock out about 24 credits.
 

zacharyj53

Registered User
Also...

If you decide on the Navy go into the Aviation side...Radar Tech or something like that...Most colleges usually accept that training as college credit.
 

haydog

Registered User
zacharyj53 said:
If you decide on the Navy go into the Aviation side...Radar Tech or something like that...Most colleges usually accept that training as college credit.

That is a good point. Embry-Riddle give on average 53 credits to an AT2 for sevice schools, experiance and also your rank. Now you don't even have to be advanced. Some universities are giving the credits just for passing the exam.
 

Cordespc

Active Member
None
Contributor
haydog said:
Cordespc, I can't believe you made first already.

Yeah, even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while. Congrats to you as well.

haydog said:
I remeber when you walked into my shop as a young airman and Timmy beat you up.

Ahh, those were the days....but weren't you also a young airman, and didn't Timmy also beat you up?? :D I haven't seen you out and about for a while....I figured you were up in Newport. Congrats on the soon to be BS. Looking into an OCS app now?

Rgds/ Paul
 
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