The important part is when I don't know wtf I'm talking about, I can sea-lawyer with the best of 'em. At least I'm getting better at it.
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Bar Stool Economics
- Thread starter picklesuit
- Start date
The important part is when I don't know wtf I'm talking about, I can sea-lawyer with the best of 'em. At least I'm getting better at it.
Minnesota has it half right: don't tax food, don't tax clothes. Unfortunately that's where it ends. Every luxury should have what?; sales tax . We all would contribute proportionally to what we do beyond surviving. It should not be a matter of monetary contribution, rather the individual's ability to contribute to the state; sounds very similar to socialisim/communism, no? It was a good idea until THAT label got applied....fail.
Can you affoard to spend more than what it takes to survive? Go for it!. Can you not afford to? Subsist! No where in the constitution does it say that every man (or woman) is entitled to creature comforts.
(Bar stool is right!)
Can you affoard to spend more than what it takes to survive? Go for it!. Can you not afford to? Subsist! No where in the constitution does it say that every man (or woman) is entitled to creature comforts.
(Bar stool is right!)
The important part is when I don't know wtf I'm talking about, I can sea-lawyer with the best of 'em. At least I'm getting better at it.
For the general edification of all...This doc. presents an interesting read on the realities of a progressive tax system. I used it and some others as a research doc. for some work in college.
http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/88xx/doc8885/12-11-HistoricalTaxRates.pdf
On the face of it, it doesn't look as bad as many would have you believe. In short, it appears to disprove the idea that "the richest x% pay next to nothing (again in % terms)..." myth. While it certainly isn't like that, some of my further research highlights that the biggest advantage presented in the US tax code is not a reduction in the % in tax you pay...but in the amount of income you present to be taxed. Don't forget that in kindergarten terms... Tax paid = tax rate x AGI
The biggest loopholes for everyone, but especially for those able to afford tax lawyers, is in reducing AGI. I have some supporting docs that I will try to dig up and post.
No, that's not right. How can you pick what is essential. I need my car to get to work. I need a bed to sleep in. ... Rich people regularly spend much more on "Organic" food and fancy clothes. Those certainly are not essentials yet don't have to be taxed because they fall under the categories of food and clothes.
The FairTax plan includes a prebate each month based on the taxes a person at the poverty level would pay. So, if you are at the poverty level, you pay no net taxes. If you want to get fancy clothes and spend more, you pay more taxes.
New York has a simlar tax to what was described as Minnesota, (the clothes I think just became a permanent fix... and there is an income tax, but I'm talking sales taxes here) - and clothes become "luxury" after a certain price, and I'm pretty sure that foods that are specialty foods and junk foods (cookies, chips, etc...) are taxed. I'm not positive though, but I think a system of sales taxes like that is pretty fair.
Yeah, and that just causes a more confusing tax code. Imagine being a small business owner who wants to open up a small grocery store. He/She must now program their checkout machines to calculate taxes on certain thing and not on others. They must be able to change this every year as the legislature changes their minds. Additionally another part of the government must be established to monitor what should and shouldn't be taxed.
Again, why are we doing this? It is just easier to send people a check for what taxes they would pay.
More regulation is rarely the solution to a problem.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Having lived in NY for most of my life, the clothing tax is the only thing that has changed as far as what gets taxed as far back as I can remember. The legislature doesn't wake up one day and suddenly decide that you need to now pay a sales tax on cereal. The thing that has changed is the %, but it's only gone up something like .25 to .5% since I was old enough to start buying stuff. It's pretty simple: Any food that is not prepared for you is tax free (except for juice and soda).
I also have a suspicion that most store owners don't program their own registers.
Yes, I understand that the actual owner of a business probably doesn't but it is still his responsibility. BTW, I grew up in PA which does the same thing.
If you think that NY doesn't change their taxes (just because it is only for a weekend, doesn't make it any easier):
http://www.empire.state.ny.us/press/press_display.asp?id=56
If you think that NY doesn't change their taxes (just because it is only for a weekend, doesn't make it any easier):
http://www.empire.state.ny.us/press/press_display.asp?id=56
I am glad my state doesn't have sales tax, it is such crap.
As far as I understand, here is how it goes:
State Government: "We need to either implement a sales tax or property taxes will go up"
People: "We don't want that, sales tax it is"
-1 year later-
State Government: "We need to increase property tax - for the children"
People: "Well we have to do it for the children"
State Government: "ROFLMAO LOL BBQ!!111 We win again, taxpayers!!"
Repeat Ad Nauseum until both property and sales taxes are ridiculously high.
As far as I understand, here is how it goes:
State Government: "We need to either implement a sales tax or property taxes will go up"
People: "We don't want that, sales tax it is"
-1 year later-
State Government: "We need to increase property tax - for the children"
People: "Well we have to do it for the children"
State Government: "ROFLMAO LOL BBQ!!111 We win again, taxpayers!!"
Repeat Ad Nauseum until both property and sales taxes are ridiculously high.
I will assure you as a top % DINK'er that those mythical means to reduce your AGI are just that, mythical. Unless you have one hell of a lot of money to hide offshore or so much you don't mind losing a bunch to save taxes or are willing to buy large amounts of rentals and run them as another business it's hard to reduce you AGI. If you're just like we are, two people that work 100 to 120 hours a week you're pretty screwed and the AMT only makes it much worse.
Perhaps it's also because a visit to the IRS is not on my things to do list but give it a try if you wish.
everyday is tax free shopping day at your NEX!
But you still get charged a "surcharge" (Nex-Tax I call it) that goes to the MWR...so just a single purpose tax...
yea i never noticed that until I was stocking up for Hurricane supplies (limes, lemons, copious amounts of medicinal booze) and saw a "nex surcharge" or whatever they call it. I was a little miffed with what I saw as a Tax called by any other name until I found out that it supported MWR programs, at which point i felt like a horse's derriere for even bitching in the slightest about it.
IMO, the government should not take any more than 25% of a person's income. Of course, getting to that point where we can sustain the current government while taxing like that is a big hurdle, but morally that's what I believe. And I mean combined too, as in federal income tax, state, local, etc...should add up to no more than 25% of people's income.