Army WOFT

[hipfinnsy]

I searched the board, but I haven't been able to find an answer to this:

I know that for Army WOFT one must take the AFAST. However, as far as the flight physical goes, how much different is it than the long form flight physical that the Navy/Marines administer? If I already passed the long form flight physical without any problems, will I still be required to take the Army's version of the physical? I've already passed the ASTB and I am currently working with the Marine Corps but I just want to keep my options open. My Captain told me that October of next year looks optimistic but I don't want to put all of my peppers in one satchel. Furthermore, is one required to take the ASVAB before one takes the AFAST. Should I talk to an Army enlisted recruiter or is there some magical trick to this process?

Also: will having a four year degree with a good GPA help my chances since I am not prior enlisted?

Regards,

-Digothy

 

[eas7888]

I searched the board, but I haven't been able to find an answer to this:

I know that for Army WOFT one must take the AFAST. However, as far as the flight physical goes, how much different is it than the long form flight physical that the Navy/Marines administer? If I already passed the long form flight physical without any problems, will I still be required to take the Army's version of the physical? I've already passed the ASTB and I am currently working with the Marine Corps but I just want to keep my options open. My Captain told me that October of next year looks optimistic but I don't want to put all of my peppers in one satchel. Furthermore, is one required to take the ASVAB before one takes the AFAST. Should I talk to an Army enlisted recruiter or is there some magical trick to this process?

Also: will having a four year degree with a good GPA help my chances since I am not prior enlisted?

Regards,

-Digothy

Speak to an enlisted recruiter, they are going to be your first step in the Army for getting in to the WOFT program. You'll likely be required to take the ASVAB and then take the AFAST. I've taken both the Army's 1A physical and the Navy's flight physical. Both were pretty similar, though I don't know if one would be substituted for the other. If you have a copy of your physical, take it with you to the recruiter, though chances are your physical would be long expired before you were to submit your package for the WO board.

Long story short, go talk to your local recruiter. They will probably put all of your information in to the system and refer you on to a recruiter who deals with WO accessions specifically.

 

[KBayDog]

hipfinnsy - Recommend you check out the HeliOps / Cleared Hot forums. There are a LOT of Army pilots on those boards, and they can give you the best/most current gouge.

FWIW, the founder of those forums, Ned Dawson, is also a fairly regular member of this site. He's a straight-shooter, and his photography of everything helicopter-related is second-to-none.

 

[hipfinnsy]

Hell yeah. Thanks, guys.

 

[Coota0]

1. You'll have to take the ASVAB and the AFAST. If you made it through college, you'll kill the ASVAB.
2. A degree will help you.
3. Your USN/USMC physical will have to be approved through the aeromedical center at Fort Rucker. They might approve it, they might not, the problem will be getting it to them.
4. There are no officer recruiters in the Army, enlisted recruiters take care of all of the officers as well as enlisted personnel. You will attend basic training, then WOCS and flight school. The problem with the recruiter is that they put through very few packets for WOFT or OCS. You will do the majority of the research on your own, airwarriors, military.com, and kiowapilots.com saved me. It took me nine months to complete a packet and submit it. When I walked into the recruiters office I told them what I wanted to do and got six blank stares, then I asked if any of them had put in an OCS packet and took that guy as my recruiter. He told me that I couldn't do WOFT because you had to be an E-5, I had to pull up the goarmy website on his computer and show him the WOFT program on there before he would believe me. If you've got questions, ask, there are a few Army Warrants on this forum and I know that myself and at least one other aviator on the forum were just like you, college grads that walked into a recruiter's office.

 

[highside7r]

Digothy,
At least you started on a good site. There are several other websites directed to more of the Army side. I made the mistake of switching from the Navy to the Army (ok it's not that bad, just snow on the ground here in the "Stan" and I had a cold shower again)

#3 on Coota0's post, you will need to find an Army flight doc to submit your Navy flight phys, the forms are different, but the info is the same. I was stationed at Pensacola at the time of my packet, and had a LtCol doc at NAMI covert and then submit to Rucker. Initial requirements are the same since I applied, but we are actually starting to downsize like the other branches, so you will have to be more squared now to get in vice 2003 with OIF kicking off. You will need an updated ASVAB score and use the books to study for the AFAST, they are almost the same and the test is easier than the ASTB. On the recruiters, as mentioned be prepared to do all the leg work yourself and continue using the "internets" for info.

Also check out aptap.org, it's geared toward Army dudes going to the airlines, but still some great basic info.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

A few things I have noticed being in recruiting several years now.
1. I get phone calls about once per month from Army helo pilots wanting to come into the USN so they can get more flying time, the 60 pilot we had with us said the hours the army guys were saying they had were 25-50% of what a USN helo pilot would have at the same point in the career.
2. I run into many people looking at aviation programs who shop different services (not a bad thing) but the common story when they check out the army is the army recruiters are encouraging them to go enlisted first so they can "earn the respect" of the guys they will be in charge before submitting an officer package.

 

[Stearmann4]

There's a ton of Army WO application and program information on www.verticalreference.com. There's also a couple of lengthy threads on the topic hidden somewhere on AW. Army recruiters DO NOT get any recruting credit for sending guys to Warrant officer Candidate School thus, they are less than helpful if a guy walks in the office without doing his/her research. They have also been known to take advantage of the un-educated and recommend that if they enlist they'll have a better chance at flight school than a civilian off the street.

As for comparing flight times, the Army is the same as any other service; when a fired up kid (WO) shows up, studys and is proactive, he flys a lot. When a dud shows up whining, doesn't know his EPs and limits and takes 2 hours to start up, I find other things for him to do and progress his friends. Commisioned guys are a whole other story, they can go 20 years without accruing 1,000hrs.

In a rare instance of orgainization, the Army has a step-by-step application procedure spelled out in detail at http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/. Everything you need to complete most of the application process on your own is here. Nobody is going to bend over backwards helping you with the application, the least of which is a recruiter with nothing to gain.

It's lengthy, but I typed a "WOC For Dummies" during a previous deployment (it may even be on here somewhere) as basically a form response for the dozens of potential WOCs I hear from each year that have the same problems. http://helicopterforum.verticalreference.com/topic/13671-a-woft-view-from-the-top/

I currently have a 7-0 acceptance rate for applicants who've followed the guidance and I submitted letters for. The entire thread and a ton of FAQs can be found at: http://helicopterforum.verticalreference.com/forum/32-general-military-helicopter-discussions/

MR-

 

[KBayDog]

Stearmann: Excellent posts, both here and on verticalreference.

I'm going to quote you, as I think this one item may be the most important thing people need to know about soliciting information in the age of instant electronic communications...and what tends to be the source of a lot of red-ass experienced by new members on this forum:

Networking: Lastly, I've had several aspiring WOCs contact me via PM with such endearing greetings such as "hey", and "Dude", using incomplete sentences, and asking questions without so much as leaving their name or email address to respond. Nobody expects 'Sir", etc, my first name is fine, but if you aren't able to type a coherent, professional letter (email) using correct grammar, spelling and composition without using texting short hand, you will get an equally curt response. I can say this will most likely be the case for most any officer you ask for help. Remember that written correspondence is often the first impression you make. Unfortunately there's undoubtedly been a few outstanding and qualified candidates who never made it past an email because they wrote like they were texting buddies at school.

 

[Coota0]

Stearmann thanks for the links to the WO for dummies, I'm going to pass that on to a couple of my crew chiefs.

Stearmann is absolutely right about flight hours, how up knowing everything you can and be a sponge willing to learn when you get to your unit and you will fly. Do something stupid or be a PITA and you will sit and watch others fly.

 

[Justin P]

I've got one year left in college, I want to fly and want to start my flying career in the military.
I submitted my Marine OCS application, but like someone else said on these forums: I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket.

Thanks for all the sites and info, I have what I need to apply for the WOFT program.

I just would like some perspective on the timeline of things for the WOFT program.

After you're accepted you go to:

BCT/WOCS - 17 weeks
JOPD - 6 weeks
HOLD - 1 week
SERE - 3 weeks of lockdown
HOLD - approximately 1 month
IERW - approximately 21 weeks (Flight training)


I only have the acronyms. Can someone break these down in some detail?

Once you have your wings, where do you get stationed? Do you have any say?
So you first enlist? Can I the enlistment bonus for having a college degree?


The girlfriend is moving to Miami...is there anyway I can go through this program and live/ fly with the army there?

Thank you gentlemen for any and all the info.
Respectfully,
J.

 

[Lawman]

Take that timeline, wad it up in a ball and throw it out the window...

Nobody has enough of a track on the bubbles in flight school, they are always changing. Basically it's gonna lay out like this.

WOCS for 7 weeks. That is after basic training and you may spend a month in-between the two waiting to class up as a snow bird.

Then you'll go to 1-145th and check in as a flight student... Expect to be there and be treated like a child for the next 1-2 years.

Next will be SERE. Just a three week course but they front load it because they don't want people going all the way through and then sucking it after the money is put into them.

From there you'll go back on hold for IERW. That can take however long it takes at the time you get there. Me it was 2 months others it was 6 days... Just no way to really tell you. When you start you'll fly the TH-67 through three stages. Primary up first, which is learning to fly in the pattern and hover without killing yourself. Instruments follow which is the long one just because of the academics and everything needed to go along with it. After that it's 2-3 weeks of BWS which is you learning to navigate off a paper map at 90knots and 100 feet... Your experience will vary on fun in any of these stages based on individual IP.

After that and a pt test they throw all your scores into a weighted matrix and put you in order of merit with the other WO's or Lt's respectively. They tell you how many of each aircraft are available in a room all together and let you pick in order. You may get what you want, or you might take the fat girl home just depends on luck. Some classes it wouldn't matter because there are two of ____ and everything else is ____. know some guys that it lucked out like that. When you finish that they'll split you by aircraft and let you pick your top 3 postings for that aircraft.

Then your back on hold for what can be days or months so study your shot and be ready. I was told 6 months for apache. I got 9 days notice a month on hold, so you never know.

You do your advanced aircraft which can take a couple months for hawks and hooks or 5-6 for scouts and guns. You'll get your post assignment a couple weeks before your done no matter your aircraft. They don't cut you orders till they are pretty sure your going to pass.

After that you graduate and have ten days to clear. Then report to your post and start being the wojg'iest WOJG you can be.

 

[KBayDog]

Good gouge Lawman, thanks for giving us Whiting-types some insight as to what happens up the road from us.

You guys do your -67 routes at 100'? Damn, I'm jealous! We're limited to 200', and at that altitude, I often find myself asking, "What the hell are we doing all the way up here?!?!" (Then I remember that my bird is painted orange and white, and I just smile and press on.)

 

[Lawman]

Good gouge Lawman, thanks for giving us Whiting-types some insight as to what happens up the road from us.

You guys do your -67 routes at 100'? Damn, I'm jealous! We're limited to 200', and at that altitude, I often find myself asking, "What the hell are we doing all the way up here?!?!" (Then I remember that my bird is painted orange and white, and I just smile and press on.)

Depends on the IP really. I had very little fun in BWS because I was flying with a guy that was mondo anal about something. Other guys were doing their best Airwolf impressions.

Though really that was a joke when I flew with "the flying dutchman" in the Apache. Guy was a Dutch exchange pilot. These are the guys that do the apache airshow demo. He literally put the nose of the aircraft into trees while you were buttoned up in the bag using the PNVS to show you how you can't trust your depth perception under system.... Cause when you too the front window block down there was a tree swallowing the helicopter. That guy was fun to shoot with.

 

[phrogpilot73]

The girlfriend is moving to Miami...is there anyway I can go through this program and live/ fly with the army there?

Seriously?