Air Force v.s. Navy Culture Differences

[MIDNJAC]

It's the same thing, different boots. There are some fucking weirdos in Navy fighters too. Like was said, if you are insistent on being miserable, you will be either place. Or you can choose to enjoy things. Same thing on the civilian flying side, there are people who will bitch and moan to their death about making absurd $$ vs making absurd $$+1 dollar.

 

[Swanee]

there are people who will bitch and moan to their death about making absurd $$ vs making absurd $$+1 dollar.

"But this big bag of gold is too heavy... *sigh* I can't be expected to carry this by myself. This is bullshit!"

 

[mad dog]

Not sure if they have these at the USAFA but it looks like the USNA has frat houses…which is pretty cool in my book.

Pic from today [Speedy Tuesday] while visiting the USNA during a long BWI layover…

 

[Ralph]

You have to take that with a grain of salt as well, there is quite a bit of self-selection on a site like that and folks who are miserable are going to be attracted and more apt to post if that who is dominant on a site like that. We can speak from experience here. It's the internets, not real life.

Plenty of the USAF folks I've served with have enjoyed their careers just as much or more than their Navy counterparts, as with most things it is what you make of it.

This site has avoided the negativity. It seems any airline or Air Force flying site is a dumpster fire.

 

[PhrogLoop]

Not sure if they have these at the USAFA but it looks like the USNA has frat houses…which is pretty cool in my book.

Pic from today [Speedy Tuesday] while visiting the USNA during a long BWI layover…

View attachment 36372

Love that house. My roommate’s dad was an O-6 on Captain’s Row. Sunday brunches were the absolute best.

 

[PMPT]

Oh, we in the AF have turned into a shitshow in the past few years. Worse than ever.

That said, the anecdotes from my Navy / Marine brethren indicate they are hot on our heels in keeping up with the stupidity.

But what can I say? I'm an abused spouse and not willing to divorce the AF organization since I love the people... and the jets... so much.

personally, i'd rather the pendulum swung in the direction of more crew rest than in the direction of maxing crew day and minimizing rest. but that's just my lowly $0.02

 

[wink]

personally, i'd rather the pendulum swung in the direction of more crew rest than in the direction of maxing crew day and minimizing rest. but that's just my lowly $0.02

Easy to say. How long should rest be, 8 hours, 10,15? Should it be longer after all night flying? If you have 15 hours one night can it be reduced, to say 8 hours the next night? You get bonus hours for a combat mission or missing meals or for flying a certain number of days in a row? Are crew rest regs ever suspended for operational necessity or by some authority?

I was once burned on a C-141 flight home from deployment. Also on board was a deceased sailor. AF canceled for crew rest when a maintenance delay took them about 20 minutes into crew rest, for an augmnered crew that could sleep enroute. B.S.

 

[taxi1]

crew rest

Sea story

I remember standing alert on the carrier one night, forget the alert status but I actually had my flight gear on and plane was preflighted, power on, etc. We were in a slide as we waited to see if any planes came around the corner north of Norway. I went back to my stateroom and just laid down on the rack for a quick 30 second nap. Immediately sunk into the deepest alpha wave comatose sleep possible. Was woken up by our young enlisted, and told we were a 'go' and to head up to the flight deck. Wha? Huh? Where am I? Oh f***

I was a 1 on a scale of 1-100 alertness.

Got up on the deck, it was driving rain and snow as I stumbled into the gale in my dream state to our Hummer sitting on Cat 1, getting instant hypothermia. Junior co-pilot was already in, power on, and we get the props spinning post-haste while the ship turned into the wind. We sat there with the engines turning while the Important People below decks decided what to do with us. I remember thinking I hope we don't have any emergencies, and I just have to worry about a night pitching deck recovery. Just trying as hard as possible mentally to clear the cobwebs, but not working.

Luckily we canxed, stood down status, and I crashed. Otherwise could have been an Approach article.

 

[ChuckMK23]

Sea story

I remember standing alert on the carrier one night, forget the alert status but I actually had my flight gear on and plane was preflighted, power on, etc. We were in a slide as we waited to see if any planes came around the corner north of Norway. I went back to my stateroom and just laid down on the rack for a quick 30 second nap. Immediately sunk into the deepest alpha wave comatose sleep possible. Was woken up by our young enlisted, and told we were a 'go' and to head up to the flight deck. Wha? Huh? Where am I? Oh f***

I was a 1 on a scale of 1-100 alertness.

Got up on the deck, it was driving rain and snow as I stumbled into the gale in my dream state to our Hummer sitting on Cat 1, getting instant hypothermia. Junior co-pilot was already in, power on, and we get the props spinning post-haste while the ship turned into the wind. We sat there with the engines turning while the Important People below decks decided what to do with us. I remember thinking I hope we don't have any emergencies, and I just have to worry about a night pitching deck recovery. Just trying as hard as possible mentally to clear the cobwebs, but not working.

Luckily we canxed, stood down status, and I crashed. Otherwise could have been an Approach article.

When I flew EMS and was on the 1900-0700 shift, this was me - sad to say but there was a few times when I could not remember starting the engines and launching...

 

[sevenhelmet]

Sea story


Luckily we canxed, stood down status, and I crashed. Otherwise could have been an Approach article.

C2X/JTFX, every time.

As a JO, I found myself going to bed at 2359 for an 0300 wake-up to brief the "Alpha strike"- a last-minute skeds change due to 10 aircraft diverting from the carrier due to weather. Luckily, the following day's event was weather canceled overnight, I'm pretty sure someone would have balled it up on that one. The scary thing was, nobody recommended canceling for crew rest during the hasty night-prior strike planning session.

As a DH, I had a similar set up for a blue-water DCA (about 4 hours of "crew rest", after a month of C2X underway fatigue), after flying twice (or was it three times?) and working MO stuff the day prior. This time we actually launched. Luckily it was good weather and picture clean all day, the launch was to make our sortie generation rate as part of the airwing "stress test" (the we're-going-to-go-until-someone-literally-dies part of C2X) CAG specifically waivered crew rest on that one, but nobody was happy about it, and it was brought up as a safety item in the debrief. Response was basically "Nothing bad happened, and now that we've met the metric, we don't have to repeat that event."

One of those "pressured to fly against better judgment" things. God, I hated C2X.

 

[PMPT]

Easy to say. How long should rest be, 8 hours, 10,15? Should it be longer after all night flying? If you have 15 hours one night can it be reduced, to say 8 hours the next night? You get bonus hours for a combat mission or missing meals or for flying a certain number of days in a row? Are crew rest regs ever suspended for operational necessity or by some authority?

I was once burned on a C-141 flight home from deployment. Also on board was a deceased sailor. AF canceled for crew rest when a maintenance delay took them about 20 minutes into crew rest, for an augmnered crew that could sleep enroute. B.S.

it could be the number specified by CNAF providing at least the opportunity for 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep. i understand the desire and need to dig deep in the fight sometimes, but statistics and history have shown us that if one pushes too far in aviation, you end up with crashed planes and dead pilots. i guess we brief crew day and crew rest each sortie for a reason, no?

 

[ChuckMK23]

Ironically its the AF and not Navy that issues single seat crews amphetamines for high tempo contingency/combat flight ops....

 

[sevenhelmet]

Ironically its the AF and not Navy that issues single seat crews amphetamines for high tempo contingency/combat flight ops....

I never tried the "legal speed" pills. We did have non-amphetamine "go pills" (Modafinil) on my last USN deployment. I took it as prescribed during the crossing for side-effect evaluation, and then took it exactly once before a combat mission.

Didn't sleep for 3 nights. Never again. Coffee is my jam.

 

[FrankTheTank]

Come to FedEx, half our pilots do that shit, four nights in a row, every other week.. ?‍?

 

[Griz882]

Not sure it counts in this conversation, but on a recent house hunting trip to Colorado I met my first Space Force guy at DIA. We approached the entry line at the Starbucks at about the same time and I said, “After you, airman.” to which he replied, “Thank you, but I’m a Space Force guardian, sir.”

He did it with a straight face so I can’t tell if I’m impressed or amused.