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These guys may have some explaining to do!

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HooverPilot

CODPilot
pilot
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Since exceeding the sound barrier IS NOT a normal practice going into the break, I think these guys may have to answer some questions!

http://www.sptimes.com/2005/03/12/news_pf/Tampabay/Sonic_booms_shake_up_.shtml

Sonic booms shake up area
Navy jets arriving at MacDill break the sound barrier and shatter the quiet of a Friday evening.
GRAHAM BRINK and SAUNDRA AMRHEIN
Published March 12, 2005

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Seminole resident Henry Remi walked outside when he heard what sounded like a series of loud explosions Friday evening.

His neighbor had done the same thing.

"You hear that?" Remi asked.

"Yeah, I heard it," replied the neighbor.

Remi said he wanted to make sure he wasn't losing his mind. He wasn't.

What Remi and thousands of other residents from Citrus to Manatee counties heard and felt was two F-18 jets breaking the sound barrier. The resulting booms resonated from Citrus to Manatee counties.

The two Navy F-18 Hornets arrived from a naval air station in Pensacola and landed about 8 p.m., said Air Force 2nd Lt. Larry Vanderoord, spokesman for MacDill Air Force Base. He called their arrival a "routine landing" and said these planes usually fly faster and lower than typical planes landing at MacDill.

The jets, based out of California, were scheduled to take off again today or Sunday.

"They are very fast, and when they come in, they're very loud," Vanderoord said.

The shaking registered on the U.S. Geological Survey seismograph in Orlando, measuring 2.7 on the Richter Scale, the equivalent of a weak earthquake. Central Florida is not an active earthquake area, said USGS duty officer Madeleine Zirbes.

"They did see it register," Zirbes said from Denver, Colo. "They thought immediately that it could be a sonic boom."

The blast prompted hundreds of calls to area newspapers, TV and radio stations and local authorities. Many residents headed outside to find out why their homes were shaking.

Remi has heard the double boom that comes when space shuttles re-enter the atmosphere. On Friday, he said it sounded more like five or six booms in a row.

"I never heard so many booms come as rapidly as that," he said.

Carrollwood resident Mark Thatcher heard the rumbling over the noise of his television set.

"It just sounded like an airplane really close," he said.
 

Brett327

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Well, if they did, in fact, do that, then they're stupid, but I'm always suspicious of initial reports where lay-people on the ground tend to jump to conclusions (usually the wrong ones).

Brett
 

KBayDog

Well-Known Member
"Based on my experience..."

(Sorry, had to say it, especially since "my experience" thus far consists of API...)

...how does the 3710 guidance about careless/reckless flying usually play out legally? I am specifically referring to the one that says "Flights of naval aircraft shall be conducted so that a minimum of annoyance is experienced by persons on the ground. It is not enough for the pilot to be satisfied that no person on the ground is actually endangered. Definite and particular effort shall be taken to fly in such a manner that individuals to not believe they or their property are endangered."

No, I am not specifically talking about this case, since it is still speculation. I am talking about "in general." This rule got my gears turning, since anybody can claim that naval aircraft are annoying. (You in the I-15 corridor know what I mean.) To me, it seems to take some of judgement of the aviator, and give all judgement/benefit of the doubt to the person on the ground. Any thoughts/experiences with this?

BTW, am I the only one that gets PO'd that we need reminders, like at MCAS Beaufort, that "The "noise" you hear is the sound of Freedom?"
 

KBayDog

Well-Known Member
Little clarification here: I'm not arguing/debating the rule; I just want to ensure that I am complying with its letter/intent when I do start flying naval aircraft. Thanks.
 

HooverPilot

CODPilot
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KBayDog said:
...how does the 3710 guidance about careless/reckless flying usually play out legally? I am specifically referring to the one that says "Flights of naval aircraft shall be conducted so that a minimum of annoyance is experienced by persons on the ground. It is not enough for the pilot to be satisfied that no person on the ground is actually endangered. Definite and particular effort shall be taken to fly in such a manner that individuals to not believe they or their property are endangered."

This rule is more of a catch all if there are no other rule violations. So it would probably be a secondary worry for these guys, They would have to worry first about the no supersonic flight over the contiginous US except in designated area's. Those area's are pretty dang remote- Places like Fallon, Nellis, China Lake and Edwards come to mind.

As for the rule you are discussing, In my last squadron we had a crew FNAEB'ed for flying in a manner that a person on the ground could perceive a danger or threat from the aircraft. What did they do you ask? They flew a circle over one of the guys house at 1,000' AGL while VFR. 5 complaints later, and it was FNAEB for everybody!
 

petescheu

Registered User
Yeah but it's still awesome, you gotta give it to those pilots for showing up the Air Force like that... def some cahones.
 

Brett327

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shoo24 said:
Yeah but it's still awesome, you gotta give it to those pilots for showing up the Air Force like that... def some cahones.
There's a huge difference between coming to a USAF field to execute a smart Navy break and causing a huge and very public incident that gets people at all levels of the chain of command in hot water. Assuming the story is accurate, I hope their stunt was worth the effect that it's likely to have on their careers.

Brett
 

zuggerat

Registered User
"you can break a hard right, select zone 5, you can extend and escape, you made a bad choice" ... just listening to viper boys...

i really dont know why i posted that... i was watching top gun and thats the scene that was playing when i read the post... so whatever enjoy my brief topgun-ism
 

Tripp

You think you hate it now...
Flights of naval aircraft shall be conducted so that a minimum of annoyance is experienced by persons on the ground.

HA! Now that's funny...someone needs to tell that to the MH-53E pilot that decided to "loiter" over my house one day. Nearly shook the whole damn thing down...but it was pretty cool to see one that close.

(To be fair, I live more or less under Dobbins ARB's flight path)
 
This isn't regarding the sonic boom, it's just military air traffic in general.

I'm just curious why it is people move in, probably to take advantage of the nearby military base for its economic potential, then years later, begin to ***** and moan about the "noise." Seriously, wtf. How about a little F-in gratitude.

Just a little PO-ed cuz I read an article on Luke AFB a while back. It astounds me that people can be so dumb/selfish. They stick it in the middle of the desert to be AWAY from population centers, but one springs up around it anyway. Then they complain.
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
As for me

I live relatively near an AFB and a flight path is directly over my house. Doesn't bother us or any neighbors, we're always impressed with the sheer size of the C-5, and the sexiness of the occasional fighter.

Those big engines are the sound of freedom!
 

Tripp

You think you hate it now...
In reply to/conjunction with Vegita's post:

I agree...I wasn't complaining...if anything I was awed by the sheer power of the 3 GE engines that thing's got.

For the most part, you tune air traffic out within a couple of days. It's like living next to railroad tracks (which I've also done in college).
 

bunk22

Super *********
pilot
Super Moderator
Back in July 2001, my det was preparing for cruise with FCLP's out of MCAS Miramar. As most probably know, that base has everything from Hornets to helo's and is a very busy airfield. So we bounced for about 2 hours that day and when we came back through base ops, the ODO looked quite annoyed. Our two COD's flying non-stop touch-n-go's had caused quite a stir. We had over 60 complaints in those two hours. The jets come and go but I guess having props buzz your business or house for two hours gets quite annoying. Of course, as far as I know, the base was there first :confused:
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
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San Diego wouldn't exist in the state it is without the military. Too bad we can't tell them to go fvck themselves. I bet most of the complaints are from retired aviators... those are the ones that are really ridiculous. They already knew the base was there!
 
Fly Navy said:
San Diego wouldn't exist in the state it is without the military. Too bad we can't tell them to go fvck themselves. I bet most of the complaints are from retired aviators... those are the ones that are really ridiculous. They already knew the base was there!

Yeah, I think those have got to be the worst if they're out there. And you KNOW they did it when it was their time, lower and faster.
 
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