When did the NAM become such an easy medal? I hear sailors talking about getting one just for going on det.
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Are individual awards getting watered down (ie a NAM for a Det)?
- Thread starter Alpha_Echo_606
- Start date
My own two cents, but for what it's worth, the only medals or ribbons I've ever seen people really take pride in are sea service deployment and enlisted service (for all you priors). You ain't shit unless you've been in the trenches, if you will.
Unfortunately NAMs seem to have gotten way too watered-down, or have always been that way. Frag the thread if you must, but I'll say what's already been said a thousand times before. The same medal for finishing a 2-deployment sea tour or saving an aircraft and cleaning up a dirty beach?.. bullshit. I know, I know, NAMs are more "generic" and all that.
Be proud of the work you did and enjoy the free beer.
Unfortunately NAMs seem to have gotten way too watered-down, or have always been that way. Frag the thread if you must, but I'll say what's already been said a thousand times before. The same medal for finishing a 2-deployment sea tour or saving an aircraft and cleaning up a dirty beach?.. bullshit. I know, I know, NAMs are more "generic" and all that.
Be proud of the work you did and enjoy the free beer.
They are making that whole area of the base down by the Coast Guard station the spot for the oil-cleanup. Don't worry though, proud volunteers, I saw the coca-cola truck coming in to drop off cases of soda to aid in the oil cleaning effort.
NAM and MUC I don't get as awards now. When a whole school gets a MUC, yeah, that's rediculous. They seem like participation ribbons from talking to people and the few I've seen awarded. Maybe a NAM is like a handie. At one point in your life you thought they were awesome and you were king shit for getting them. Now, you know you'd really like something better and you feel a bit dirty for getting it...
Sorry for the threadjack, but I think the bigger issue with awards is not so much that they are watered down (which they are in most cases) but that there is no semblance of a Navy-wide standard for them. You say some ensigns got a NAM for working at an elementary school? I know a shit hot senior LT who just finished a very tough tour as an FRS IP and is on his way to a competitive shooter job and got a NAM out the door. On the devil's advocate flip side, I worry that a Navy wide standard would swing the pendulum further towards watering down said standard because of the real impact personal awards have on the enlisted side. So we're left with a situation where you have no idea what quality Sailor or Officer you're looking at just by checking out their top row. I agree that campaign/deployment/combat V's say much more.
What I find conversely odd is that you pretty much have to be KIA to get anything above a bronze star. Silver Star, DFC, Navy Cross, MOH seem to most if not all be posthumous.
phrogpilot73
Well-Known Member
I think these guys would disagree with your statement...
Here's some Silver Star citations for you. Please note that most are NOT posthumous. Same with Navy Cross, unfortunately I can't find any links that have them organized neatly by campaign for the DFC - but I know that most are awarded to living individuals.
You want to bitch about the MOH being only awarded posthumously? I'll back you up - but the others you mentioned are pretty fairly awarded.
I think part of the problem with NAMs is that, IIRC, each CO is authorized so many to award on his own. It would seem to me that different skippers are going to have different criteria for when to give those out.
Since 12/7/41, there have been 851 MOH awards. Of the 851, 523 were posthumous. Of the 328 that were awarded to living individuals, 91 are still living today. So, that part of the statement that most MOH awards were posthumous is correct.
The problem of awards being 'watered down' is not just a Navy problem. As a current enlisted member of the Army, I can tell you that the same problem plagues that branch as well. It has gone so far as people getting awarded a BSM for satisfactory completion of a deployment in a leadership position. Although being in a leadership position while in a combat zone is a very demanding and stressful task, completing that task satisfactorily should in no way qualify a person for a Bronze Star. I've always been under the impression that "Above and Beyond" should be the initial qualifier for an award. The degree of the accomplishment would determine what award was merited. To me, it cheapens the medal, but this is just my $.02, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. At least they weren't awarded with "V" devices. That really would have made my blood boil.
From the awards manual... a lot left up to discretion.. Bottom line (for me), anything noteworthy done operationally. Cleaning up a beach while stashed? no.
NAM Eligibility Requirements. Awarded to members of
the Armed Forces of the grade of lieutenant commander or major
and junior thereto, for service performed on or after 1 May
1961. The award may be authorized for meritorious service or
achievement in a combat or non-combat situation, based on
sustained performance or specific achievement of a superlative
nature, and shall be of such merit as to warrant more tangible
recognition than is possible by a fitness report or performance
evaluation, but which does not warrant a Navy and Marine Corps
Commendation Medal.
(1) Professional achievement that merits the award
must:
(a) Clearly exceed that which lS normally
required or expected, considering the individual's grade or
rate, training, and experience; and,
Be an important contribution of benefit to
the United States and the Naval Service.
(2) Leadership achievement that merits the award
must:
(a) Be noteworthy;
(b) Be sustained so as to demonstrate a high
state of development or, if for a specific achievement, be of
such merit as to earn singular recognition for the act(s); and,
(c) Reflect most creditably on the efforts of
the individual toward the accomplishment of the unit mission.
NAM Eligibility Requirements. Awarded to members of
the Armed Forces of the grade of lieutenant commander or major
and junior thereto, for service performed on or after 1 May
1961. The award may be authorized for meritorious service or
achievement in a combat or non-combat situation, based on
sustained performance or specific achievement of a superlative
nature, and shall be of such merit as to warrant more tangible
recognition than is possible by a fitness report or performance
evaluation, but which does not warrant a Navy and Marine Corps
Commendation Medal.
(1) Professional achievement that merits the award
must:
(a) Clearly exceed that which lS normally
required or expected, considering the individual's grade or
rate, training, and experience; and,
Be an important contribution of benefit to
the United States and the Naval Service.
(2) Leadership achievement that merits the award
must:
(a) Be noteworthy;
(b) Be sustained so as to demonstrate a high
state of development or, if for a specific achievement, be of
such merit as to earn singular recognition for the act(s); and,
(c) Reflect most creditably on the efforts of
the individual toward the accomplishment of the unit mission.
Working at a school? Doing a noteworthy PR project?
Ain't nothing wrong with a letter of appreciation. It's still "commendatory material" for a fitrep, and serves the "atta boy" purpose without cheapening those given for true impact performance or EOT.
Ain't nothing wrong with a letter of appreciation. It's still "commendatory material" for a fitrep, and serves the "atta boy" purpose without cheapening those given for true impact performance or EOT.
Gus Gorilla
New Member
When did the NAM become such an easy medal? I hear sailors talking about getting one just for going on det.
+1
While I was stationed overseas it was considered standard practice to get an "end of tour NAM" on your way out the door. Didn't really have to do anything special. Just live overseas on a ship and show up to work every day. If you could do that for 3 years without getting in trouble, Bam! NAM in the works. I felt like it was complete BS. That's your job. Be there, work hard, stay out of trouble. These are basic requirements of civilized life. It's not necessarily Military standards. Anywhere you work Civi or otherwise, Be at work on time and out of trouble. It's not really award worthy.
As someone noted above, it is related to the "X number of NAMs per personnel in the unit", and the fact that COs (most?) feel like they need to give all of those out, plus the standard "end-of-tour/end-of-career" awards. I suspect that COs feel, at least on a sub-conscious level, that the more medals they give out the better they look.